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Using a wetter than normal lather for straight shaving is a common recommendation to new straight shavers. I find that I often enjoy a lighter lather than most of the new base soaps for the same reasons. A lot of the enjoyment of straights for me is the honing and maintenance of a fine edge. I like a lather that lets me feel that edge a bit.
I used to whip soap in a scuttle until I had lather that had standing peaks, like meringue. As my shaving as evolved, I've gone to a "less worked" lather, sometimes (often) face-lathering. I've found that the key for me is slickness not heaviness. I can recall the barber, when I was a kid, using his thumb to smear a lot of the lather off while he stretched my sideburn and neck areas to shave them. That type of minimal thickness but great slickness is what I look for now, and what gives me the best shaves -- SR or DE.
Might be the same thing, but I have taken to using the wetted brush to sweep away a lot of lather, esp after a first pass. It seems a pile of excess does no good.
What is next to the skin is what works.
Wish I could give an answer but I never understood what cushion was relating to lather. All I know is that I like a thick lather, not as in deep, that has enough water in it to feel slick. Hope that makes sense.
Bob
Hydration provides slickness, whether the lather is thick or thin. I care more about slickness than I do cushion, but enjoy both when I can get them.
I like a little extra wet in my lather. Thickness seems like it keep the blade from getting closer to the skin. I like to take my lather to the point where its just about to be too wet and and become a drippy mess, then work it some more to build up the soap a touch more. This way its wet, slick and just on this side of dripping and running down my face. There is a fine line to getting the max water and not breaking down the soap.
Though I still enjoy the benefits of a good face lather, I've gone the other way. I never really worked that hard to create a lather "that had standing peaks, like meringue," now I do. Too funny.Quote:
Originally Posted by Haroldg48
Of course now that I have a bit more experience, I know what soaps are more likely to give me that and seek them out.
I bowl lather 95% of the time.
I like a nice thick lather with peaks that is on the wetter side.
A big key for me is how wet my face is when I brush it on.
I'd rather it thin out while applying than in the bowl.
Like Jerry said it's a fine line....I think of it as kinda like mixing concrete.
Just a tad bit too much water and you end up with a soupy mess.
Pete <:-}
I'd only add that for me the lather is usually the key to the shave, assuming I have a SR that is well honed to a sharp, yet comfortable edge. If I rush lathering, I can tell while shaving and have sometimes started over.
Aloha!
Good thread. I went through a period this last year where I was far too busy to fuss with my normal routine of wet shaving. I had 5 minutes to shave in the morning. So I resorted to hand lathering Cremo on my face, and doing a fast two-pass shave with a DE and Feather (or Lord) Blade. My two favorite blades. On occasion, when I had a precious 15 minutes to spare, I also shaved this way with my straight razors.
What I found is that I agree with some of the comments here. It's the slickness of the skin where the razor meets the beard that counts, not whipped lather. Hand lathering Cremo put a thin slick barrier on the skin, and a small bit of lather. I think you can get a slick skin surface with a good thick lather, don't get me wrong, but I found that a quick face lathering of Cremo (very low lather) was just as effective as my decades of bowl lathering.
-Zip
I used to fuss with trying many soaps and bowl or face lathering etc. End of the day if the edge you put on the razor is good then the shave will be good. For the heck of it once I shaved with Dial 2 for a buck hand soap from the dollar store and it was no big deal really. Whatever works is about the size of it.
I like it just thick enough it does not drip down my face. It’s part of what makes me a messy wet shaver. Too thick and it feels sticky under the blade.
Aloha!Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill31521
I hear that.
I've posted this in other threads, but my Grandfather raised a family through the Great Depression, and never got over his penny pinching. He'd squeeze a penny so hard that Lincoln's head would pop. All his adult life, he shaved with his Solingen Straight Razor and ivory (hand bar) soap - the same stuff he bathed with and washed up with. He'd shave some off of the bathroom bar into his mug with his pocket knife, put in some hot water, and whip it up into a lather. That worked for him for 50 years. He'd never pull out his wallet for razor blades let alone a "Soap" or "Cream" made for shaving.
I can hear him now.... "I'm not spending good money on special soap for shaving when I have a perfectly good bar of Ivory soap in the bathroom!"
His set-up was the pinnacle of frugal simplicity. He'd shave at the kitchen table. Basin, Towel, Mug, Brush, Mirror, Straight Razor and Styptic Pencil. Done and done.
As a sidebar, I remember reading a thread on another shaving forum about an Ivory Soap challenge. Some wet shavers reported amazing results with Ivory soap as their shaving soap. I guess Ole Granddad was on to something. RIP.
Cushion is like that definition of Porno. You can't define it but you know it when you see it.
That's how cushion is. Few can explain it but when you use a soap that has little you know it real fast. A good example for me is the Italian Saffron Soap. I've used it many times with a straight and it's really slick stuff with "good Cushion" but one day I used it with an aggressive DE and though it was slick there was something definitely missing and that was cushion. I felt it as the razor dragged along my face. It was an unpleasant sensation.
I instantly knew what cushion is.
Before I started using DE and SR razors I used regular old bar soap for years with the multi blade disposables. I quit buying "goo in a can" long before switching over to traditional wet shaving. I would just hand/face lather (no brush) with the bar of soap. For me, this worked better than the canned stuff. This was not done out of frugality, I just never liked any of the canned shaving cream or gels. Now however I would never give up my brushes.Quote:
Originally Posted by ZipZop
I will agree that almost any soap will work. But the quality of the feel in the shave goes down hill fast. Ive shaved with good soaps and bad soaps. And when you treat a bar soap the right way it will give a nice shave. The main thing is to make the lather the best for that soap.
I tried a few bar soaps just to say ive done it, but they dont compare to a good shave soap. There is a difference! This is what i found in my testing.
Yup, I have used Ivory soap to make a lather and shave with. It was no thrill even compared to Arko which I find excellent. It could also be that Ivory soap is not the same formula as it was many years ago.
Bob
BobQuote:
Originally Posted by BobH
To me, cushion is the buffer between blade and skin.
Bluesman touches on it in his OP when he says he likes less cushion so he can feel his honed edge more. I believe you can get away with a less than perfect edge when there is more cushion.
For want of a better analogy, I think of when two metal sheets are rubbed together grease would be cushion and oil would be sickness.
I guess I fit into this category as well.
As for bar soap, I tried a bar of goats milk soap sent by JP5, its a very good performer. Similar to vintage Williams mug. Its also made in Amish country, so it may be a multi use soap, also. Keep it off your feet, when showering..!!
Like snot on a glass door knob....
Well then, I think I prefer slickness to cushion.Quote:
Originally Posted by markbignosekelly
Bob
To me a sign of good slickness is when you splash your face with water after your shave and it still fills slippery.Quote:
Originally Posted by BobH
No, that's the blood from the shave. it's very slipperyQuote:
Originally Posted by markbignosekelly
Har har.
Yup, I'd say so too.Quote:
Originally Posted by markbignosekelly
Bob
I’m guessing you might like the glycerin heavy soaps over a tallow soaps then? At least I find glycerin based soaps still feel slippery and provide great glide by adding water - even after the blade has passed.Quote:
Originally Posted by markbignosekelly
Yep, I just checked the ingredients on some of my favourite soaps and they all contain a good amount of glycerin. Never really thought of that before. Obviously a well hydrated lather plays a massive part of how slick a soap/cream is.Quote:
Originally Posted by earcutter
That’s cool that you figured it out then. You can keep it in mind when you shop for your next soap(s).Quote:
Originally Posted by markbignosekelly
I really figured out what glycerin did in my “Uber Lathers” (cream, soap and some extra glycerin) making days. That extra glycerin really made a difference. I used to put some drops in every lather I made, but somehow it fell out of favor.
I’ll say this, I bought a small bottle at the pharmacy for 5 bucks or something like 10 years ago, and it’s still going strong. Best investment ever lol.
But yeah, if you add glycerin, you’ll need to add more water. At least that’s what I found.
Sounds to me that most of us would rather be lacking in cusion to have slickness. Glad im not an odd one out. Slick is so much more important to me.
If you want to really know how a lack of cushion feels just shave with water. As long as you keep wetting your face you will have basic lube and absolutely no cushion.
Glide vs Cushion...
I think we all know what glide is, and what it gets us. It’s indispensable when it comes to shaving. Glide by itself, can provide awesome shaves. This stuff (see below) is a glycerin heavy product, is my wholly grail of glides! Used in the shower with tons oh water and steam, there’s nothing that even comes close to its performance. But that’s in a very wet environment!
Attachment 297239
Moreover, a glycerin heavy product will make for some soft skin after continued use! It traps water! But ultimately, the film coats the skin which helps you push down a bit and cut closer.
So what is cushion then? Well cushion is everything else you know about a shaving cream that isn’t scent or glide. It’s the millions of micro bubbles that actually condition your beard and make it softer. This aids glide in that a weakened beard allows for a more speedy glide.
Cushion in some cases also conditions the face for the shave by tightening it up a bit. A pre shave like Proraso doesn’t aid glide, it tightens the skin and holds the whiskers for a clean cut. This is cushion too! And it’s lovely.
It’s all that conditions your face and beard. Sure a greasy tallow and/or a slippery glycerin that help slide, also soften, but on thier own, I find they dry the skin too much and do nothing to soften or prepthe beard.
All said and done, glide without cushion kind of sucks. And cushion without glide bites. The closest shaves I get come from a soap that provides good cushion and conditioning... with ample slide to allow me to push down a bit.
Ive never liked pushing down a bit. If the blade dont slip thru the whiskers with no pressure than it goes in the honing cup. Never pressure is my way!
When I go across the grain, I’ll dig down a bit for that bbs shave.Quote:
Originally Posted by Gasman
I'm with Jerry on the no pressure thing. That's why I like lower cushion, and was the reason I started this thread, because I can get close with no pressure.
Thats sounds scary to me. :dropjaw:Quote:
Originally Posted by earcutter
