Trouble with transparent soaps

I've been experimenting lately with Uberlathers by matching various soaps to my regular creams. A trend has emerged that does not make sense to me so I'd love to get input.

All of my transparent soaps (Col Conk, SRD, QED, etc) result in lather that is best described as 'light and fluffy' compared to all of my opaque soaps (DR Harris, Muhle, Queen Charlotte, Trumper, etc) which give me a far more desirable 'thick and rich' lather. The transparent soap uberlather has many small bubbles that I can't seem to break down. The lather ends up on the dry side with very little 'slickness' like my opaque concoctions.

I've tried the transparent soap uberlathers with no extra glycerin, a little extra (1-2 drops), my regular (2-3 drops) and a lot (6 drops). I was never able to get acceptable results.

Am I doing something wrong or could it be the way my water interacts with soaps that have undergone the process necessary to make it transparent? I have big city water.

For the record, I make uberlather in a Dirty Bird scuttle using a variety of creams (three Castle Forbes scents, DR Harris Almond cream, Queen Charlotte Bay Rum cream, Salter Wild Rose, etc). No matter the combination, I get the same result if using transparent soaps.

Any thoughts?

It could be your water, but since the only difference you mention is the clear soaps vs the opaque ones.
One thing springs to mind - the clear soaps are glycerin based soaps. Fat based soaps will be opaque. (But not all opaque soaps are fat based, ofc). I do not have any glycerin based soaps so I don't have any experience wit them myself.

Perhaps it's just that your water is better suited for fat based soaps?

Best of luck.

The only difference between a transparent glycerine soap and an opaque glycerine soap is dye, such as titanium dioxide which does nothing more than make the soap white.

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Originally Posted by Theseus

The only difference between a transparent glycerine soap and an opaque glycerine soap is dye, such as titanium dioxide which does nothing more than make the soap white.

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I've also read that transparent soap has alcohol added??? And maybe a different process.

But if you're right and it's just a dye, then why would lathering results be do dramatically different...and consistently so?

This one has me baffled...

Often times soaps are complex concoctions of chemicals. Maybe when you mix some the chemicals don't mix well with each other. That's the only thing I can think of. To tell you the truth if you get great lather from some great soaps why do you need to mix them to begin with?

You know what they say about a bird in the hand is worth more than 2 in the bush.

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Originally Posted by thebigspendur

Often times soaps are complex concoctions of chemicals. Maybe when you mix some the chemicals don't mix well with each other. That's the only thing I can think of. To tell you the truth if you get great lather from some great soaps why do you need to mix them to begin with?

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That is why I ordered myself a tub of Xpec. If it is all it is said to be then it is "The Ultimate Uberlather in a Tub" and I can rid myself of the assortment of soaps and lathers which I have accumulated in quest of this holy grail.

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Originally Posted by thebigspendur

To tell you the truth if you get great lather from some great soaps why do you need to mix them to begin with?

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I have the same problem with all of my transparent soaps even when I do NOT mix them with a cream. For example, when I face lather with a transparent soap, I just don't get the later I get with opaque soaps. Lots of guys here have recommended transparent soaps (especially those from QED and SRD) for uberlathers, so this just can't be a universal problem. Strange this is...

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Originally Posted by eflatminor

But if you're right and it's just a dye, then why would lathering results be do dramatically different...and consistently so?

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I think you missed my point. Clear soaps are glycerin based soaps. These are not the same as fat based soaps. The opaque soaps you mentioned are all fat based, afaik (I checked DR Harris, but I'm pretty sure the others also are)
Glycerin is a natural component of soaps, but companies tend to separate it out from higher quality soaps and use it on its own. It's sort of like utilizing a by-product. In short, glycerin soaps are not the same beast as regular fat based soaps.

Theseus only pointed out that the difference between clear and opaque glycerin soaps are dye. The difference between an opaque glycerin soap and an opaque fat based soap are much larger.

For a quick rundown on the differences, check out this article on soap making methods, especially the Cold Process Soap and the Melt and Pour Soap articles.

I'll also add that thebigspendur makes an exellent point.

Best of luck.

I've always found the Glycerin based soap in general have a really strong scent to them but produce a weaker lather when compared to the English triple milled soaps. Personally, I avoid the Glycerin soaps.

Glycerin soaps should ( theoretically) have a very high glycerin content, so adding more will probably do a lot less good than it will with a fat based soap , which has a lot less.

My example of that is the infamous Williams. It is very hard to lather without glycerin, but tends to work much better with a bit of glycerin or in a superlather with glycerin. Does that make williams a bad soap? Not automatically. It just means that williams does not have a high glycerin content, so it responds better to glycerin than, say, a glycerin based soap.

I think it is fair to point out that *all* animal fat or tallow based soaps produce glycerine during the saponification process. Whether that glycerine is retained in the soap or separated out (and used for the manufacture of old-school dynamite) is up to the manufacturer. Vegetable oil soaps typically do not contain much in the way of triglyerides, therefore do not produce appreciable amounts of glycerine when saponified, so if it is desired in the final product, must be added in.

A formulated soap's ability to create lather will be dependent upon the type of soap ingredients used, other adjuncts (lanolin, glycerine, fragrances, etc) and the hardness of your water. Hard water means less prominent lather.

Not all opaque (non-clear) soaps have "dyes" (really, these are pigments, not dyes) to make them opaque. Most fat based soaps are opaque naturally, and tend to be hard. Vegetable oil soaps are more likely to be clear, and tend to be soft.

Clear glycerine soaps *can* produce a rich lather, but are more sensitive to water quality (hardness) than a properly blended soap. Transparent glycerine soaps typically don't produce as good a "glide" as properly blended soaps, either.

In the end, it's all about the formulation of the soap & how it works on *your* skin. Find several that work well, and stick by them. I'm always on the lookout for new/better soaps, but always have my stand-bys.