Strop tension too much?

I have been shaving with a straight razor for about 6 months now
Daily shaves in the last 4 months, so I am still quite new to the art

In the past few weeks I have had some dulling to the edges of my Razors
The shaves have been a bit grabby and felt like the edge wasn't sharp
Irritation has been a little more than I am comfortable with
I have had a member here do a touch up hone on 2 of my razors a few weeks ago
It feels like the egde only lasted a few shaves before feeling dull

I have recently also concentrated more on my stropping by keeping tension on the strop
The tension I have on the strop feels quite tight, it seems this is the advice from many Forum members
Is it possible to use too much tension when stropping?
Could this dull the edge of a Razor?
What is actually happening to the edge if the strop is too tight?

Today I watched a You Tube video of Lynn stropping a Razor
It seems the tension used in the video is not as high as I use atm
So I am more confused now. tight strop or not tight.
How to get it right.

I appreciate any input from all members

Rick

Hey Rick,

Stropping is a really big can of worms. I believe that if you get 10 members that respond to this post, all ten will have tweaked something about their stropping to make it work for them. Many people say keep the strop "taught", as in keep it straight with no slack.

I had a really nice strop early on, and I had so much tension on it, and wasn't paying attention to how things felt, that I ended up twisting the leather slightly. From that moment on, I began to concentrate on a tension that worked for me.

If I showed you a picture of my strop when I hold it, many would say it has wayyyyy to much slack. But it works for me, and I get consistent, repeatable results from how I do it. I think you should try and experiment with tensions to see what works best for you, really tight, just taught, or a bit of slack. Really pay attention to the edge and how it feels. When you test a stropped edge and say "Wow....that's nice", then attempt to repeat that edge by stropping the same way for your next shave.

Concerning the touch-up, you could have rolled and edge, or the touch-up for some reason could have gone awry. If you have anything with magnification, have a gander at the cutting edge to see what kind of shape its in.

Hope this helps.

You can't damage the edge by having the strop too tight.
I strop on paddle strop quite often and the edges come out quite nice.
I would say your edges are at a point where they need a refresh on a pasted strop or a hone.

All I use is a Paddle Strop. It is flat, doesn't bend at all, and I've experienced no problems.

Many thanks to all for their input :)

To Maxi

Thanks for your informative reply
My early stropping was done on a paddle strop
Moved on to a Poor Mans strop
Very few issues with keeping a sharp edge
The learning continues :)

To Mainaman

I have now had those razors honed again
There are some others that will need honing in the next few weeks
By then the next phase of my shaving journey will have started
I am waiting on a Naniwa 3000/8000 superstone and DMT 325 plate to arrive
Then its on to lapping and learning the hones

To Ace

It's time to get out my paddle strop
And get it working again
Put it into rotation with my hanging strop and poor mans
It could be just the thing to keep my edges sharp

My strop is a strip of 3" wide black latigo glued on a 1x3 board. It doesn't get any tighter than that, and I've had no problems. I might try a hanging strop one day but if it isn't broke I really don't want to fix it.

A hanging strop should be comfortably tight with a bit of deflection. Many find using a paddle easier because its already flat and taut and the holding part is simplified. Probably your stroke is not right and that's why you are having problems. Sounds like rounding the edge which is common. It takes practice.

The reason I normally recommend just keeping the strop taught vs. holding it so tight that your arm cramps is that stropping really needs to be done with the muscles more relaxed. I find that when someone puts a death grip on pulling the strop tight, that they also end up using significant pressure on the razor when stropping and a lot of times will actually roll the edges by lifting up at the end of the stroke. Stropping is one of those things where you really have to find your own rhythm and comfort level on the tension and this does take a little pressure as Nelson indicates. To me, the keys are not too fast, but not too slow and you want a little pressure, but not to much or too little. Being tentative or too aggressive or too heavy handed is usually where the problems come into play. Many people also nick the strops or don't get the positive effect from stropping by being to tentative as well.

For those people who have a lot of problems with the hanging strop, the paddle is always a good alternative. Personal preference really plays a big part here.

Have fun.

This may open a new can of worms,but has anyone ever put a spring scale on a hangin strop? Fish scale should work.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by thebigspendur

A hanging strop should be comfortably tight with a bit of deflection.

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+1. Just enough slack for some deflection ensures that your entire blade is in contact with the strop for the full stroke.

I think it's possible to be too taut. The signs of this are a razor that hops when going down the strop. If the razor feels like it's bumping along instead of smoothly gliding along you might have the strop too taut. If you grab the strop end with confidence, but only use two fingers, index and thumb, you'll probably improve the strops ability to deflect. The deflection allows the strop to absorb motion better. If the strop remains relatively flat, yet still has some give in it to absorb mistakes, you'll strop better.

To find the correct amount of pressure to use, use the least amount of pressure that creates draw.

The most difficult thing for me to teach is stropping and one of the challenging factors is that the pressure of both hands is related to each other. Think of the pressure needed to hold the strop taut as related to the pressure you apply with the razor. Think of the strop as a simple machine, like the fulcrum or the screw. Extend the strop so that it is flat, but can absorb energy if applied by accident. Then strop lightly with you controlling the razor's flat motion. You should, for example, be able to move the razor back and forth without the strop in place. As the razor moves it should feel like the flattened strop is catching/abrading/rubbing on the razor. If you wave your hand in the air it's like using too little pressure or a strop that has too hard of a surface. If you rub your hand back and forth over a rug you'll feel a huge difference, like a "pulling" sensation. That is your goal.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JimBC

This may open a new can of worms,but has anyone ever put a spring scale on a hangin strop? Fish scale should work.

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I had been thinking the very same thought. I just need to wait until I visit my brother, who has a selection of them for me to play with. You cant go too light weight, or it may "bounce" and I dont want to nick my last good strop just on an experiment!

When I first started I thought I had this taut thing all figured out. I put one end of the strop on the back of my Honda Civic and the other end on my son's Honda Civic and got the wheels spinning. The only problem was mine had a bigger engine so I'd start pulling his car down the street so I'd have to run and strop at the same time which wasn't a good thing. But the strop was really taut.

I have conducted some stropping experiments with both knives and SR. Here are my results which are similar to the comments already suggested.

1) A too taught strop with a too light touch does nothing to the edge. The contact is so light and intermittent along the edge as to have no effect.

2) A too loose strop with too strong of pressure will roll the edge on almost every stroke.

3) The strop must be just loose enough to allow full contact with the edge and the stroke pressure can then be very light and still make full contact with the edge.

Smooth, consistent strokes are more important than speed. I have paddle strops. They be easier to use for newbies, but for me they lack the feel and pure pleasure of stropping.

Hi Rick,

As others have said, it is a personal preference a lot of the time. You remember when I stropped those couple of razors at the Brisbane meet? That strop was retractable and spring loaded - there was no way it was able to be pulled tight, there was only the tension provided by the spring, which was not a lot.

The secret is not how taut the strop is (although completely slack will never work, obviously). The secret is how you move the razor on the strop. The strop simply has to be taut enough so that it provides a stable surface for the razor, that is all. Or, you can pull it tighter if you want - it doesn't matter in my experience. What matters is the hand holding the razor.

What I have found worked well when I was learning to strop was 1. Getting that flip down (practice, practice, practice!); 2. Keeping the arm, from the elbow up, fixed in space and just moving the forearm - this creates more of a "C" stroke on the strop (as opposed to a linear, or straight line, motion), and really helped me progress my stropping as it put me in more control of the razor, I think.

Anyway, those are just some thoughts. Concentrate less on how taut the strop is and concentrate more on what the edge of the razor is doing on the strop - you'll find it is like steering a motorbike. If you look where you want to go, your body will automatically make the adjustments necessary to get you there. Same with a strop - if you concentrate on making sure the edge is getting stropped, your body will make the necessary adjustments to ensure the strop is doing what it needs to in terms of tautness.

James.

I think one of the problems I have is that I like my edges to feel smooth. I think that some deflection, all the way up to about a half an inch (max) helps prevent the razor from skipping, digging into my skin, and getting stuck in my beard. I can use some pressure and a litlle defection to smooth out the edge quite a bit. It might need to be honed again earlier than expected, but I'm okay with that. My stropping, if my edge doesn't feel very nice, resembles Mr. Finnegan's. This aggressive stropping can create a nice edge that is easy to shave with. I think making the edge easy to shave with, as opposed to wicked sharp, might be appreciated by both barbers and beginners. Problem is you need to know how to hone.

Razor Strop - YouTube

Question, when I strop ( just started ) there is a high pitch sound, is that normal? I just got a Boker King Cutter

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JimBob

Question, when I strop ( just started ) there is a high pitch sound, is that normal? I just got a Boker King Cutter

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Is the razor leaving scratches? A re you lifting the spine and not keeping the razor flat? Using too much pressure? If these arent problems you may just have a singing blade.

got to be too much pressure.. I am using a board...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jimbo

Hi Rick,

As others have said, it is a personal preference a lot of the time. You remember when I stropped those couple of razors at the Brisbane meet? That strop was retractable and spring loaded - there was no way it was able to be pulled tight, there was only the tension provided by the spring, which was not a lot.

The secret is not how taut the strop is (although completely slack will never work, obviously). The secret is how you move the razor on the strop. The strop simply has to be taut enough so that it provides a stable surface for the razor, that is all. Or, you can pull it tighter if you want - it doesn't matter in my experience. What matters is the hand holding the razor.

What I have found worked well when I was learning to strop was 1. Getting that flip down (practice, practice, practice!); 2. Keeping the arm, from the elbow up, fixed in space and just moving the forearm - this creates more of a "C" stroke on the strop (as opposed to a linear, or straight line, motion), and really helped me progress my stropping as it put me in more control of the razor, I think.

Anyway, those are just some thoughts. Concentrate less on how taut the strop is and concentrate more on what the edge of the razor is doing on the strop - you'll find it is like steering a motorbike. If you look where you want to go, your body will automatically make the adjustments necessary to get you there. Same with a strop - if you concentrate on making sure the edge is getting stropped, your body will make the necessary adjustments to ensure the strop is doing what it needs to in terms of tautness.

James.

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Hi James

Your tips and those from other members make sense
I'm thinking I will go back to the paddle strop for now
and practice with the hanging strop on a cheapie blade for now
Thanks for your input and help
Rick

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AFDavis11

I think it's possible to be too taut. The signs of this are a razor that hops when going down the strop. If the razor feels like it's bumping along instead of smoothly gliding along you might have the strop too taut. If you grab the strop end with confidence, but only use two fingers, index and thumb, you'll probably improve the strops ability to deflect. The deflection allows the strop to absorb motion better. If the strop remains relatively flat, yet still has some give in it to absorb mistakes, you'll strop better.

To find the correct amount of pressure to use, use the least amount of pressure that creates draw.

The most difficult thing for me to teach is stropping and one of the challenging factors is that the pressure of both hands is related to each other. Think of the pressure needed to hold the strop taut as related to the pressure you apply with the razor. Think of the strop as a simple machine, like the fulcrum or the screw. Extend the strop so that it is flat, but can absorb energy if applied by accident. Then strop lightly with you controlling the razor's flat motion. You should, for example, be able to move the razor back and forth without the strop in place. As the razor moves it should feel like the flattened strop is catching/abrading/rubbing on the razor. If you wave your hand in the air it's like using too little pressure or a strop that has too hard of a surface. If you rub your hand back and forth over a rug you'll feel a huge difference, like a "pulling" sensation. That is your goal.

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Hi AFDavis11

I have watched your stropping video a few times now, very well done btw
One thing I have done is try to maintain very light pressure on the razor during stropping
I haven't noticed any skipping while I strop, maybe pressure is too light for good blade contact
It feels very slick compared to my poor mans strop and my roo hide paddle strop
My hanging strop was purchased from a member here, no makers name on it

I like your explanation of draw using the rug as a guide
One wonders what my wife will say when I stop in the middle of stropping and rub my hand on the rug
She may call the men in white lab coats to take me away

Many thanks for your input
Rick

Something that made a big difference to me was switching from stropping vertically to horizontally. - now I just hang my strop from the door knob and pull toward my hip. Makes me think how much easier a paddle strop would be. ... one day...

i prefer a hanging strop because it allows some give to it i dont like the feeling of using a board like strop. i also use a dresser draw to hang it on because its hip high and it keeps be for pullign the living daylights out of it i know if it starts to move the drawer then i need to back off on pulling just a bit.

Learning to strop well was the key factor in learning to get a good shave. Every time that I was getting ready to shave, I would practice a bit stropping with a butter knife to get the feel for the correct movement. When I felt ready, then I stropped the razor.
That helped me to "warm up" without risking dulling my razor. It also allowed me to experiment with different movements and strop heights without fear of making one wrong stroke that could send me back to my hones.

A quick update
Had a few shaves now using the paddle strop prior to shaving
Touched up 1 razor on my barber hone
Then on to the Roo Hide paddle strop for bout 80 strokes
Certainly popped arm hair easily

Test shave went well enough
Probably could have spent more time on the strop
I put it down as part of the learning experience

Thanks again for all the tips
Have a great week

Rick

I used to pull my hanging strops tight when I first started and I was rounding the edges of my razors and didn't realize it. I recommend some deflection as it always leads to a better shave for me. Some of the old timers on Youtube (Liam for example) use a big amount of deflection but they're pros and know how to control the spine and edge to stay even on the stropping surface.

Just using a barber's hone and a strop is a great way to find out how to keep your edge working nice. You may need to strop more after the barber's hone to smooth the edge out, I find that works well.


We really need more topics on stropping in the forums...more important than honing imo.

I personally get the best shaves from a really tight hanging strop.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Disburden

We really need more topics on stropping in the forums...more important than honing imo.

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I agree.

I've recently backed off just a bit on the tension on my strop and seem to getting much better results. I think, as someone else here said, that I get slightly more even contact with the edge with just a bit of deflection. I was so worried about turning the edge that I keep the stop really taught and focused on keeping the spine on the strop. Mine spines were getting great stropping action! Since relaxing my off hand and applying more of an X pattern to my strop stroke, my results are significantly better. Same holds true my touchups on my pasted strops.