Fur stubble on leather strop, do I need to remove it?

Hey Guys,

So I'm pretty new to using a straight razor, and thought the first thing I should do (after getting a razor), is to get a strop.

I bought some kangaroo leather strips (perfect size for stropping) to make a paddle strop from. When they arrived though,
I noticed that you can feel some fur stubble when running your hand back and forth over it.

My question is, will this be a problem for stropping my razor? The seller has agreed to replace it if I like, but I'm not
even sure if I need to (and wouldn't know until I make a strop and start stropping with it, and by that point it would not
be in good enough condition to return!)

Any pointers would be great,
Thanks!

I think you would do best to either replace it or sand them down. If you're new to straight razor shaving, you take a risk of dulling the edge of your razor with this leather. If the seller can provide you with a stubble-less piece, I'd go for that!

I'd replace it.

I'd lather the strop up, shave it, and then you're good to go. There is no need to apply after shave.

See if you can't get leather from the tail when you replace it as roos have naturally hairless tails.

Also the untreated reverse-side of the roos leather is great for compound, in case you didn't know. So if you plan to use them on opposite sides then maybe be nice and return only one of them?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by kalium

Hey Guys,

So I'm pretty new to using a straight razor, and thought the first thing I should do (after getting a razor), is to get a strop.

I bought some kangaroo leather strips (perfect size for stropping) to make a paddle strop from. When they arrived though,
I noticed that you can feel some fur stubble when running your hand back and forth over it.

My question is, will this be a problem for stropping my razor? The seller has agreed to replace it if I like, but I'm not
even sure if I need to (and wouldn't know until I make a strop and start stropping with it, and by that point it would not
be in good enough condition to return!)

Any pointers would be great,
Thanks!

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Have it replaced! You bought it as a smooth hide then you should receive smooth hide. If you ordered something for a floor mat then that's different.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nathanael

See if you can't get leather from the tail when you replace it as roos have naturally hairless tails.

Also the untreated reverse-side of the roos leather is great for compound, in case you didn't know. So if you plan to use them on opposite sides then maybe be nice and return only one of them?

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The tail section of the leather is very strong, but it has more grain to it, making it courser. You won't get as fine a finish on your edges...As for "naturally hairless" that just isn't true. The hair is shorter and courser on the tail.
I would consider a strop made from the tail as second grade, but my standards might be considered high, so you would have to take that opinion with the proverbial pinch of salt.

If you use a paste on one side of your strop, then don't expect the other side to remain uncontaminated for too long. Keep the pastes on a separate strop.


Mick

Sorry, I was wrong. The tail is not hairless. The tail is the firmest leather though, which is great for stropping. Kangaroo leather also has very fine fibers for a leather.
With the lack of understanding of what stropping really does it is hard to argue whether one quality is truly better than another.
Some say course is better others say worse. Some say fine fibers are great, others say it doesn't matter and will even take longer to strop.

Like suggested, thanks to Mick, keep each strip separate and use a fabric in-between the pasted strop and clean strop to make sure it is nice and clean.

Anyhow, thanks for correcting me Mick. I would like to ask anyone, if the hair is courser then could this be why it still feels less than ideally shaven? Or is it really just a bad one?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nathanael

Sorry, I was wrong. The tail is not hairless. The tail is the firmest leather though, which is great for stropping. Kangaroo leather also has very fine fibers for a leather.
With the lack of understanding of what stropping really does it is hard to argue whether one quality is truly better than another.
Some say course is better others say worse. Some say fine fibers are great, others say it doesn't matter and will even take longer to strop.

Like suggested, thanks to Mick, keep each strip separate and use a fabric in-between the pasted strop and clean strop to make sure it is nice and clean.

Anyhow, thanks for correcting me Mick. I would like to ask anyone, if the hair is courser then could this be why it still feels less than ideally shaven? Or is it really just a bad one?

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It wouldn't matter how coarse the hair is on any part of the hide. the tanning process has the hides soaking in a variety of solutions, depending on the sort of process that the hide is being given. One of those process' is scraping off the hair, not shaving it. Essentially a rubber squeegee is pulled across the hide which removes the hair by the very roots. There simply should be no 'stubble' on the hide at all.
The question of just how smooth or not a leather needs to be to be effective is a bit open, but I would hazard that the smoother the final leather strop is the smoother the edge will be. For example, when you put your razor to the finishing hone, pluck a hair from your chest or head and put it on the hone. Feels like you've hit a speed bump yeah?! Now just imagine your strop being like that all over. That's a very thin edge your running over all those little bumps. Do you think it's going to give you the best possible shave. There is no "lack of understanding of what stropping really does". It's easily understood; The smoother the leather, the better the final polish, the smoother, and more comfortable the shave.


Mick

You know Mick, I am learning quite a lot from you. I always used to prefer cow leather because it was a classic and I thought its roughness made it work faster.
Now I'm seriously considering getting a roo strop because of what the ebay add says:

"DOES THIS MAKE BETTER STROPS THAN OTHER LEATHERS?
Most leathers, like cow leather, have the collagen bundles oriented at all angles, contain sweat glands and erector pili muscles and have a poor elastin structure. Some leathers have a epidermis tissue on the surface. This leather does not have a epidermis tissue and the collagen fibres are arranged in a very orderly way. It has no sweat glands nor erector pili muscles. The elastin is also evenly distributed. The result is a incredibly smooth and accurate surface."

Only, the add doesn't mention grain and you said earlier:
"The tail section of the leather is very strong, but it has more grain to it, making it courser. You won't get as fine a finish on your edges."

Now if stropping was only about aligning the tip of the blade then which is more important, uniformity of the surface or smoothness of the surface? Remembering that it is a small difference, I've even heard many people say it feels like the blade slides more smoothly against a roo strop.
Should I even believe what the add says, people often lie to sell products? Some consumers even lie to justify a purchase to themselves.

Edit: This is the listing:
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/271185028...84.m1436.l2649

It is talking only about leather from the tail.

I am not endorsing this product and would personally recommend to people not to replace their strop unless they need to and that they should then stay with what they feel comfortable.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Nathanael

You know Mick, I am learning quite a lot from you. I always used to prefer cow leather because it was a classic and I thought its roughness made it work faster.
Now I'm seriously considering getting a roo strop because of what the ebay add says:

"DOES THIS MAKE BETTER STROPS THAN OTHER LEATHERS?
Most leathers, like cow leather, have the collagen bundles oriented at all angles, contain sweat glands and erector pili muscles and have a poor elastin structure. Some leathers have a epidermis tissue on the surface. This leather does not have a epidermis tissue and the collagen fibres are arranged in a very orderly way. It has no sweat glands nor erector pili muscles. The elastin is also evenly distributed. The result is a incredibly smooth and accurate surface."

Only, the add doesn't mention grain and you said earlier:
"The tail section of the leather is very strong, but it has more grain to it, making it courser. You won't get as fine a finish on your edges."

Now if stropping was only about aligning the tip of the blade then which is more important, uniformity of the surface or smoothness of the surface? Remembering that it is a small difference, I've even heard many people say it feels like the blade slides more smoothly against a roo strop.
Should I even believe what the add says, people often lie to sell products? Some consumers even lie to justify a purchase to themselves.

Edit: This is the listing:
Sharpening Strop Kangaroo Tail Leather Vegetable Tanned TWO Pieces 300mm X 70mm | eBay

It is talking only about leather from the tail.

I am not endorsing this product and would personally recommend to people not to replace their strop unless they need to and that they should then stay with what they feel comfortable.

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Nathanael, The advert blurb you provided is accurate in it's description of 'roo leather. They aren't lying too you. As for your question on grain of leather. All leather has grain, but like the grain of different species of tree, so too the grain of different species of leather. You will get fine grain and you will get coarse grain, and depending on the location of the wood or leather, the grain will have slight differences that will affect the quality of the finished product.

'Roo hide has the finest grain of all leathers, and, is in my opinion at least, the best stropping material bar none. Having said that I would not use anything other than a first grade piece of 'roo leather to make my strop out of, because I don't want to have to work around scars and hard lumps left by tick bites. And I certainly don't want them on my strop. That may or may not be the case with the tail of a 'roo, but the fact is that the grain is courser there than anywhere else on the 'roo hide.

Does it make it a bad strop? No, providing the leather is first grade. Does it make it as good a strop as one made from the body of the same hide? No it doesn't. Does it make a strop that is comparable to other (different species) good leather strops? Yes it does.

When I said it makes a second rate strop, understand my background has been in using only first grade 'roo hide in making strops, and that is what I am comparing to. Not cow hide. If you want the best that 'roo hide can provide, you won't get it from the tail section.

Stropping isn't "...just about aligning the tip (sic) of the blade...", it's also about giving the edge a final polish, and the best polish can only be had from the smoothest surface. As to how stropping feels on 'roo hide, well it will vary depending on what kind of hide and the finish. Something with a higher tallow finish is going to have more draw than something that has a glazed finish.

Now how did I go? Have I satisfied your questions or have I left something out or not been clear on anything?

Oh yes, cow hide is used traditionally because, for a long time there, the Aborigines had the sole rights to the 'roo hide ;). You use what you have on hand until something better comes along. 'Roo hide, compared to cow hide, is still a scarce commodity, it just isn't readily available to everyone.


Mick

Sounds like you need to send it back and let the seller know you want the best hide for a razor strop. My leather guy always wants to know so he can get me the best stuff for what I am doing with it. They want you to come back, after all they are businessmen.

Thanks. That's answered what I needed to know.

My own strop is in need of replacing and I want to get a quality strop this time. I was very rough on my first strop and nicked it a lot but it cost only $30 as I was told not to get an expensive strop until I'd had lots of practice.

Smart move. I still have my first one, and though it isn't too bad a condition, I won't use it anymore. I've moved on from there now as well. All the best with your next strop.


Mick

Thanks for all the replies. I'm certainly a bit wiser for them.

I ended up taking some very fine grit sandpaper and sanding smooth the section(s) of slight stubble. Even though the buyer offered to replace it, I thought this would be a suitable solution (I can't feel the difference anymore, so it must be good..right??). Maybe time and experience will prove otherwise. Anyway I'm sure I will end up filling the thing with little nicks as I get more practice, so I doubt it will last a long time regardless.

MIckR, that's an Interesting point about tail leather. I got a couple of pieces of tail leather, and one of them does have a scar. So I will know about that for next time. And yes, I do have some seatbelt that I am planning on using with stropping paste (rather than the kangaroo leather).

Thanks again for all the responses.

Just ensure you've left no residue from that sandpaper in the leather. I refuse to touch a strop with sandpaper. Again, that's just me. I know others that do with out issue.


Mick

The tail leather from eBay is what my strop is made from, the piece of leather was quite unevenly textured when I received it. I sanded the life out if it, and it seems to be serving me well.

That's the main thing Ed. But when it doesn't...Well it's the users face that will find out I suppose ;).


Mick

Normally falconers look for really high quality leather for all of their needs. Here are some good websites to check out.
https://www.pineofalconry.com/product/kangaroo/
Grommets - Setters - Leather Supplies
Leathers & Leather Tools
and one for you guys across the pond
Kip leather
I don't know how it would work for stropping, but I know along with you gents here falconers are pretty anal retentive about quality gear.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lt12b

Normally falconers look for really high quality leather for all of their needs. Here are some good websites to check out.
https://www.pineofalconry.com/product/kangaroo/
Grommets - Setters - Leather Supplies
Leathers & Leather Tools
and one for you guys across the pond
Kip leather
I don't know how it would work for stropping, but I know along with you gents here falconers are pretty anal retentive about quality gear.

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Hey boyo's this bloke here has just called us Anal! Where's 'e think 'e gets off then 'ay!:p


Mick

My sincerest apologies Mick. Perhaps I should have used the term particular or perhaps snobbish? No, no even better! Elitist... Yeah, that's the one, elitist. Nothing wrong with being orderly and knowing what you want. :p

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ace

I'd lather the strop up, shave it, and then you're good to go. There is no need to apply after shave.

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Are you sure about that? I heard strops like English Leather ;-)

Sorry about that - weak joke.

Mick,

Don't spit the dummy, sport! Get yer laughin' gear around a few tinnies and kick back for a bit!

Hooroo!

Neil (gnarly ol codger) Miller

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Originally Posted by bruseth

Are you sure about that? I heard strops like English Leather ;-)

Sorry about that - weak joke.

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I thought they liked Cuir de Russie....?