Diamond spray carat question

Diamond spray comes in different carat designations: 10, 15, etc..

I understand the meaning of grit size (.25, .5, etc.) but am not sure of the significance of different carat designations. Can anyone enlighten me?

My *guess* is that it is a measure of how much diamond is in the mix. Is that measured in carats per some volume of liquid? For example, 15 carat would have half again as much actual diamond grit in the same quantity of 10 carat spray mix.

If I am right about that it would be OK to refresh a strop with 15 carat .5 micron spray if the strop was initially sprayed with 10 carat .5 micron spray.

This is something I pulled from a cached Handamerican page; not sure if all manufacturers follow the same criteria.

"Some things to consider:
12 carat of diamond is 12 carat whether it is in a four ounce bottle or eight ounce bottle. The only difference is the concentration - the smaller the bottle the greater the concentration.
The difference in price between the 4 and 8 ounce bottles is based on the bottle cost."

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Sailinblues

This is something I pulled from a cached Handamerican page; not sure if all manufacturers follow the same criteria.

"Some things to consider:
12 carat of diamond is 12 carat whether it is in a four ounce bottle or eight ounce bottle. The only difference is the concentration - the smaller the bottle the greater the concentration.
The difference in price between the 4 and 8 ounce bottles is based on the bottle cost."

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Ah, so it is an absolute number.

Thinking a bit about this, seems a lower concentration (same carat, bigger bottle -or- same bottle, lower carat) might actually help in delivering a more uniform coverage.

Bob, if it helps. The .50 Diamond Spray on wool felt work wonders...I have the large bottle, I'll never use it in my lifetime, it's like the old hand american Crox. You buy that tub, you have crox for life, like Chris L is dishing out. A small bottle should do you fine...
All the carat stuff aside, it works great....I was impressed....My two cents....

Carat is a unit for weight
1carat=200mg.
so 15 carat spray for example is 3g.
As said above the volume in which it is suspended will determine the concentration, and has nothing to do with the size of the diamond particles used.

The way I see it is how fine the diamond powder is.

1 carat is 1/5 of a gram. So 15 carat is 3 grams. It doesn't matter if it goes in a one ounce or two ounce bottle. What will make the difference is how fine the diamond is processed and powdered. That's the only way imo to be able and offer different micron sizes like the ones SRD have to offer.

Maybe Lynn or Don will chime in and correct me if I'm wrong

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mainaman

Carat is a unit for weight
1carat=200mg.
so 15 carat spray for example is 3g.
As said above the volume in which it is suspended will determine the concentration, and has nothing to do with the size of the diamond particles used.

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So if I understand this correctly that HA is saying that a 4oz bottle will give you the same amount of diamond as the 8oz but the larger bottle has more solution .... or vehicle but no more diamond than the 4oz ? That doesn't make sense if you're spending half again as much for the 8 oz. Am I missing something ?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JimmyHAD

So if I understand this correctly that HA is saying that a 4oz bottle will give you the same amount of diamond as the 8oz but the larger bottle has more solution .... or vehicle but no more diamond than the 4oz ? That doesn't make sense if you're spending half again as much for the 8 oz. Am I missing something ?

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Correct,
and again 15 carat in 8oz or 4 oz is same amount of diamond just diluted 2 times more in 8oz than in 4 oz.
as far as HA as quoted above

Quote:

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"Some things to consider:
12 carat of diamond is 12 carat whether it is in a four ounce bottle or eight ounce bottle. The only difference is the concentration - the smaller the bottle the greater the concentration.
The difference in price between the 4 and 8 ounce bottles is based on the bottle cost."

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I can't answer for their pricing logic though

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mainaman

Correct,
and again 15 carat in 8oz or 4 oz is same amount of diamond just diluted 2 times more in 8oz than in 4 oz.
as far as HA as quoted above
I can't answer for their pricing logic though

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Yeah, I guess that is what it is saying but it seems to me that more solution dilutes the abrasive so you're in effect paying more to get less. :confused: It doesn't make sense to me unless the 15 carat is mixed in a large volume and then poured into the 4 & 8oz bottles so that you are getting more of a 15 carat solution .... that must be the way it is. :beer2:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by JimmyHAD

Yeah, I guess that is what it is saying but it seems to me that more solution dilutes the abrasive so you're in effect paying more to get less. :confused: It doesn't make sense to me unless the 15 carat is mixed in a large volume and then poured into the 4 & 8oz bottles so that you are getting more of a 15 carat solution .... that must be the way it is. :beer2:

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This is a logical explanation, although based on their info, the 4oz solution has same amount diamond as the 8oz, which means higher concentration.
I am having hard time to contact Keith, I always get answering machine and he does not reply to e-mails. I wanted to ask him about those things and get some diamond spray if they still sell it but no answer so far.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by mainaman

This is a logical explanation, although based on their info, the 4oz solution has same amount diamond as the 8oz, which means higher concentration.
I am having hard time to contact Keith, I always get answering machine and he does not reply to e-mails. I wanted to ask him about those things and get some diamond spray if they still sell it but no answer so far.

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I imagine it is the holidays. I spoke to him before xmas and he was swamped with orders for strops. He is probably playing catch up.

in the handamerican site is written that the price difference for the larger bottle, is only for the cost of bottle itself not for the material contained

OK, I was real clever and Googled "Hand American diamond spray" and turned up the currently hidden page handamerican Diamond spray For Razor Sharp Edges.

As Sailinblues quoted above, the amount of actual diamond for any given carat designation is the same no matter the bottle size. The prices reflect this. For example 0.5 micron 12 carat spray is $23.40 or $24.90 for either 4oz or 8oz, nearly the same price with the difference easily being explained by the cost of the bottles, also as quoted by Sailinblues.

Furthermore, the prices are the same for different grit sizes (microns). So price is explained entirely by the amount of diamond (carats) with a small adjustment for bottle size.

Quoting Hand American: "The suggested retail price for our diamond product is $1.95 per carat."

It all makes sense and is all consistent.

Googling other retailers, I see that they also offer diamond spray solutions priced by amount, regardless of grit size. Retailers that offer very large grit sizes have an increase in price for those sizes (6 - 15 microns). I guess a single "particle" of a million microns would be priced differently as well and probably be in a museum!

I can give some insight here, we actually hired a Chemist to design our diamond spray. There are some very unique things we learned.
1. Carat weight is by dilution so it is how many Carats you add to the solution. For example our spray is 15 carats per every 4 ounces so if you get 8 ounces there are 30 carats of diamond.
2. The other issue is the suspension of the particles. To keep the Diamond particles to maintain their specific micron properties you can just not add them to the medium. You need to ultra sonically suspended them or they will not maintain there properties.
3. Through our Chemist testing, we discovered that more then 15 Carats actually caused negative effects on the results. The million of particles actually started to build up and take away the effect of the diamond particles.

I hope this helps your understanding.

That's what I thought Don!