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Hi guys,
I have a Joseph Elliot fine india steel straight with horn scales. On one of the scales there is some carving into the horn "Joseph Elliot Celebrated Razor" with the logo in the middle and a border with leaves. It originally had gold leaf in the carving "there is some left". Does anyone know how to apply gold leaf to something like this? If so, is it easy?
its the bottom razor:
http://i.imgur.com/byeXrHx.jpg
Thanks.
Applying gold leaf is not difficult but it can be fussy. There are kits available in most art supply stores complete with instructions. A base adhesive is applied, dry to tacky state, apply gold leaf (not real gold, unless you find a good source and pay high price) very carefully trying not to breath on it (thinner than thin), gentle press in place and using a large soft brush (like a make up brush) softly "dust" the area removing all the leaf that did not stick to the adhesive. Finish is a varnish like coating, also part of the kit. Good luck.
I occasionally use gold, and other metallic leaf, on my fabric wall hanging (as far as I can tell I'm the only one that has figured out a way to use it on cloth).
If you go that route I would first practice on a scrap of metal to make sure it will work. AND are you sure it was leaf and not a gold wash which is another story altogether?
You will probably have to electroplate.
Gold leaf is not easy to work with and definitely not going to work on a razor.(I mean real gold leaf)
Thanks for the response! I have no clue if its gold wash. Is there a way to tell if it is gold wash?
It would be applied to the horn scales. I figure if the horn was rough enough it could have leaf easily attach to it. I might be wrong though.Quote:
Originally Posted by mainaman
Missed that part, gold leaf would be my guess of going about it.Quote:
Originally Posted by docatduq
Another possibility would be air-bushing with gold paint.
i've used gold leaf (the artificial kind) on a wood carving. it has to be coated with a varnish type sealer so it doesn't tarnish. i thought for all the work it took it really didn't look much better than gold paint would have looked.JMO
In my mind two ways to go about it.
1) Oil size or oil based varnish and real gold leaf, pretty tricky but doable.
2) Rub n buff brand gilding paste, really easy, looks pretty good
I would look into the rub n buff products.
Charlie
hmm these are all good options. The more that are presented the more I dont want to apply the gold leaf. Its very intricate, I may be relegated to using a thin paint brush and gold paint. Ill just have to practice with any of the methods.
I don't think that there is a simple solution, however if you can get it done well, it will look amazing. It is a nice razor and scales.
There is an even simpler alternative to consider: gold paint. I picked up this W&B at a flea market a couple of years ago and it too had a serious case of worn out gold. Not quite as bad as your scales, but nevertheless it needed pretty much a total re-do of the gold:
Attachment 160631
It was Rune (Zephyr) who suggested I try to paint it, and it turned out great. I used simple acrylic paint bought at an art store. It was very easy to paint into the depressions, and to wipe off any excess that got onto bits I didn't want painted.
Attachment 160632
I thought the originals were hot pressed horn with gold leaf ?
But can't wait to see how it turns out either way you do it
Thanks again for the replys guys. The only thing holding me back from using acrylic paint is the detail of the leaves around the border. The leaves aren't just an outline and have veins and textured stems. I'm afraid I would lose this detail. It might be possible to thin out the paint to make it more of a "wash" and just apply it in multiple coats to get a true gold color. Ill do some more research and try to work on it this weekend.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cangooner
True gold leaf usually comes in books with the stuff on paper. It's usually taken off applied and pressed into place. No adhesives are used. It's adheres by itself. It is usually used on decorative things and artwork where wear is not an issue. It stands up to wear very poorly.
My only real knowledge about gold leaf application is from mediaeval manuscripts. In that context (applying leaf to parchment for decorative purposes), one of the most common approaches was to apply gesso to the page where one wanted the leaf to adhere, apply the leaf, brush off the leaf you don't want, and then burnish what was left. It works very well in terms of keeping leaf where you want it, and allowing it to be removed from other spaces, but then you're back at having to deal with the same issue i.e. brushing something (in this case gesso rather than paint) into tiny areas in a way that won't obscure details. It would also have the disadvantage of at least slightly filling the depressions you want to gild. The gesso isn't really an adhesive, but rather presents an excellent surface to which the leaf can adhere on its own. The same issues would come into play with an older mediaeval technique in which leaf was applied to a wet adhesive.Quote:
Originally Posted by thebigspendur
The third mediaeval manuscript technique involved what was known as 'shell gold'. It was powdered gold in a binder such as gum arabic, forming a kind of gold paint or ink.
All of which is likely not much help to anyone when it comes to razor scales. I just get excited when a mediaeval-ish topic is raised here. :)
There are two main ways of applying gold leaf. Oil gilding and water gilding. With oil gilding the gold leaf is applied to a nearly dry oil size or varnish. Oil is more durable but more matte then water gilding. Water gilding is applied to smooth surface made up from clay and hide glue. A barely damp surface causes the gold leaf to adhere hide glue that is mixed with the clay or gesso. When you water gilding the surface can be burnished to high sheen with a burnisher.
I really think the rub n buff brand of products would work well in this case.
Charlie
I would clean the embossing and get some gold paste at hobby lobby and brush it in the stamping and wipe the excess off after it dried. IMO it would last longer than the gold leaf. There is another post on here that address this subject. Good luck with your restoration.
I use a gold acrylic paint ball pen from the art store. You can get a few different colors of gold. The 14K Yellow is closest to the original.
Shake the pen well.Run a little i\on a sheet of paper to get it flowing cleanly. Then trace the design and fill it slowly. Allow it to dry. Do it again in any low spots. Dry it. Then carefully sand it to the surrounding surface if it high and assure the surface around it is clean and smooth. High grit sandpaper is best.
http://i756.photobucket.com/albums/x...sotd5-5-13.jpg
Have fun!
~Richard
Thanks to the rest of you for ideas and possibilities. Some will work well for raised lettering!:rock:
Wow that looks great. Did you use anything to seal it afterwards?
The paint dries like a regular hobby model paint and it has shown no signs of needing a sealer.
~Richard
After a while I thought of application to a raised print above the scales surface, like was mentioned above. As an industrial model maker that was sometimes required.
Gold leaf is nice but is a gold surface usually with some variation. The below process is also usable to have the glue /adhesive product properly applied to the tops of raised letters for a gold leaf application.
What we did was to use a good enamel or lacquer and spread it evenly and thinly upon a bit of shirt cardboard and then use that to touch only the top surface of the letters by rolling the object against the paint surface.
That way, the paint is where needed and not sloppy along the edges of the lettering.
Have fun!
~Richard
Some excellent alternatives to try out, gents!
I don't think they did it like that at the time, though - it was probably done the same way as they tooled books. An iron is made for the design, heated to just above the temperature of boiling water, and pressed into the leather of the book. This leaves an impression for the gold leaf.
The depression is sealed/sized (I have used used gold leaf and dutch leaf and silver foil a lot, and a glue-size is always used) with a sizing agent referred to as 'glaire' (glaire seems to have been used by bookbinders mostly- I used a concoction made of rabbit skin glue for woodwork, etc) it is simply the white of an egg, the same type of stuff used to paint plaster walls in the renaissance - lasted well in my opinion!
Then the gold leaf is put over the sized area and the tool is applied again, once more heated, directly into the impression it made before. If it was not hot, the gold leaf would not stick. It didn't require a varnish - real gold does not tarnish.
In the pressed horn scales example, the lettering is already pressed into the horn. The same die set could be used again, or it would be a simple enough job for a die-cutter to cut another one just for the lettering.
No doubt cheaper, oil-varnish methods were resorted to to keep prices down - you can see evidence of this sometimes when the gilding is tarnished or discoloured - it is quite usual to find red or green discolouration on the designs hot-pressed into paper coffin-cases that have gilding, for example.
Not a trememdous lot of help to us now though, but it is nice to know the basic principles things were made from. Buffing paste, gilding compound or acrylic paint all sound a lot easier!
Regards,
Neil
I used it when I was a kid & back then I bought it from a large art supply in Houston. It came in sheets in a book. My mother had a bad habit of throwing things away when she didn't know what something was. It disappeared after so long & I know what happened to it. It was good while it lasted.
Hi Neil,Quote:
Originally Posted by Neil Miller
You are quite correct in what you say, They, later in 1860's or so, began to hot stamp the items with a roll of the particular metal or foil on a paper backing and that was between the hot "shoe / design stamp" and the object to be decorated. Then the hot press drove the "shoe" design and foil into the surface of the object to be decorated.
Almost all of the logos we see colored into scales since then are hot stamped in one operation.
Hot stamping - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The raised logos may or may not have been hot stamped, but the process is similar. for most jobs, they usually used a pad printer; a flat rubber plate with a very thin amount of colored paint spread upon it and it is touched to the raised logo. It is a simple version of offset printing. I have used it for raised logos like the Crown and Sword of Ern.
Offset printing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Or, it may be that a reversed image was printed onto the pad/rubber sheet and the sheet then transferred that image right side up onto the object to be decorated.
( often the way resist was placed onto a blade prior to the etching and gilding, when silk screening or decals were not used.)
It is now grown far beyond the original usage and tools.
Pad printing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Lots of goodies can be figured from this simple set of links.
Have fun, all!
~Richard
