Straightening bent pin

My Dubl Duck Goldedge arrived from floridaboy today--beautiful razor. Thanks, Phil!

Both this razor and my other Goldedge share a common problem. The scales don't quite line up at the pin. It's like the pin got bent slightly, allowing one scale to rotate with the butt pin as a pivot point.

I'd like to correct this if possible, because the razors are otherwise in fabulous shape and I'm a little Type A sometimes. :)

Any suggestions? The scales are celluloid, so I don't want to risk cracking them.

Suggestions?

Josh

I hear you mate... I'm a little type A all the time

But you need to be so so careful... i have a beautiful tort-shell Flic that needed exactly that kind of adjustment and so remembering what i had learned from Happy Gilmore i gave the head pin a tiiiny tiiiny tap and split the scales right at the pin hole.

They've probably spent some time in that condition and become stressed into the shape they currently are.

Without actually seeing how much twist they have in them I am imagining that they are about the same as the Flic i tried to "adjust".

If i had the chance again... in fact it's what i had to do anyway... I'd de-pin the razor, check and correct the twist in the scales then repin them with new pins.

I know this means sacrificing the original pins but it's often the best solution.

Greg Frazer

If the pin is bent, it'll have to be replaced. That's the only way your scales will line up properly.

Yes with the celluloid scales your limited as to what you can do so you'll have to repin them. Does it really bother you that much?

OK, this is really weird. I have a third Goldedge that I'm cleaning up for a member. It's in great condition--as good or better than either of mine.

But the scales show the same offset that my other two do. How is this happening, especially on a razor with three pins? Seems like it would cause damage to the scales for the pivot pin to get bent like this...

If you're having a hard time visualizing: Imagine holding the razor, closed, with the tang pointing up. The spine is on the side opposite your body, so you can see both scales at once. One of the scales looks like it's pushed forward from the other one at the pivot.

I just can't figure it out. I'm starting to wonder if they were designed this way, possibly to make the razor easier to hold while stropping? (I don't find this to be the case, actually. It's a little harder to grip the razor for fast stropping. But it's my only theory...)

:shrug:

Josh

I'm looking at my Goldedge now. It's tight and square at the pivot point, so your issue does not seem to be a design issue. Mine appears never to have been honed, so I take this to be the way they left the factory . . . well except for the rust and pitting on my poorly stored razor.

Is it possible that prolonged and vigorous stropping can cause this? I've always wondered a bit about the structural integrity of the pivot pin on some razors under stropping - depending on how you hold it there'd be some force exerted at that pin. But then again, there's no reason why it should all be in one direction...:shrug:

James.

Having just viewed the Bill Ellis CD, he mentions that celluloid is extremely heat sensitive. If someone had the blades displayed in case perhaps differential heat slightly warped them. :thinking:

I too just received a Dubl Duck Goldedge and while viewing (as per Josh) the right hand scale seems just a smidge longer at the pivot, it appears to be because of fit in the bolster is off perhaps a bit. Ya gotta look real close. The blade is just a little loose when fully closed but snug in the shaving position. Other than that, the razor looks like new.

Oddly enough I have a tortoise-shell Flic razor, probably a lot like Greg's, that suffers from the same complaint. I had put it down to someone trying to tighten up the scales by re-peening the pin, but buckling it instead.

I've resigned myself to having to re-pin it at some stage.

I just disassembled two Henckels razors in preparation for a rescaling job for a member, and the pins on both were bent. Has to be from retightening over the years. The scales seemed to line up fine, but I didn't take a real close look.

I've seen your work, Josh, and I know you know how to peen a new pin. Is there any reason not to just do it? It's not unusual material is it, just brass?
I think it's the only way to fix it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kyle76

the pins on both were bent. Has to be from retightening over the years. The scales seemed to line up fine, but I didn't take a real close look.

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I too have found bent pins on about 20% of the razors i have pulled apart for re-scaling or cleaning etc. I would agree that it is from retightening but i also suspect some left the original workshop that way.

I am guessing it would depend on how experienced the pin fixer was or even how many he had done that day... you're bound to smack one or two too hard when you've got to work your way through a bucket of razors fresh from the grinding shop.

Greg Frazer

To DEwey's point, I could just repin them, but since they're otherwise in great shape, I'm thinking I'd like to just leave the original pins in. Right now my replacement stock is all brass, and the originals are nickel silver or something...

Greg, I agree with what you're saying. It just seemed odd that these Ducks were all messed up in the same way, especially given Pearlduck's reputation for quality control... The razors are otherwise marvels of quality.

I have seen this same kind of twisting on other razors, but it's really not very common. Maybe one in 10 razors, if I had to make up a number... :) Not common enough that I'd expect to see the same thing in three of the same model...

Anyway, it must be a coincidence. Of course, if enough of us started complaining about Ducks and lousy quality control, maybe eBay prices would come down enough that we could all grab some bargains. :D

Thanks, guys!

Josh

Well, just a quick update here... I had another member send me a Goldedge with the scales misaligned the same way--that's five out of six, I think. He'd asked me to repin it to alleviate several issues, so I drilled out pivot and tang-stopper pins.

The pivot pin was badly bent--it was almost twisted in the middle. The tang-stopper pin was likewise bent, although not as badly.

I repinned the razor with the Dovo replacement pins, since they better match the original left in the spacer end of the razor.

Wow--what a difference. You can really tell that the razor feels more solid, and it flips more nicely when you're stropping it. I've ordered some more Dovo pins from Classic Shaving and I'll be repinning my other two Ducks this weekend.

I still have no idea why this seems to be a particularly common problem on this model. :shrug:

Thanks for the advice, guys!

Josh

My NOS Wonderedge was like this (and it really was NOS, not just "really good condition"). So at least some of them left the factory like this.

Out of curiousity - does anyone have any thoughts on why this occurs?

Certainly the factory has/had some qa/qc. I can't imagine a badly misaligned razor would leave the factory. Although mparker762 indicates that at least some did.

I was wondering if it were either:

a) initial assembly was too loose and to save money they let the boss's infant son whack on them to tighten them up.

b) the metal used for the original pins is/was substandard and normal assembly would warp them.

Josh, the pins that you've taken out. Are they softer than the pins you've replaced them with??

I don't think the original pins were any softer. If anything they were harder; they can be a bear to drill out. I'm out of theories. :shrug:

Josh

When I stumbled over this thread, I was hoping there was a shortcut. No such luck, huh? :mad:
I often make the mistake of cutting the pin not short enough before I start peening. Then of course I get a little impatient, and hit it just a little too hard, which inevitably results in a bent pin. Oh well, eventually I'll learn it, hopefully, ...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by CatMan

I often make the mistake of cutting the pin not short enough before I start peening. Then of course I get a little impatient, and hit it just a little too hard, which inevitably results in a bent pin.

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Welcome to my world, Klaus. I hated pinning when I first started replacing scales for that very reason. I was afraid to leave too little pin and not have enough to hold everything together. I have pair of wire cutters that I use to cut pins, and I have learned that I need to cut as close as they will allow and that many light taps are better than one hard tap.

I hated pinning for the same reason. I always ended up having to sand or file down one end of the pin to make it short enough... It's hard to come to grips with the fact that it's almost impossible to cut the pin too short. Almost. :) You really don't need much exposed rod to make a nice peen.

Josh

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kyle76

Welcome to my world, Klaus. I hated pinning when I first started replacing scales for that very reason. I was afraid to leave too little pin and not have enough to hold everything together. I have pair of wire cutters that I use to cut pins, and I have learned that I need to cut as close as they will allow and that many light taps are better than one hard tap.

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I usually cut the pin with a thin (0.2mm) separating disk [the one on this photo is 0.4mm]. Then - lately - I trim it even further down with a hard rubber wheel. Seems to work.

I just re-pinned my Micarta scales on a Torrey blade. I had a hard time pulling out the old pin. Analyzing the problem, I found that I made an even dumber mistake. Disregarding Bill's advice from his CD (I still can't believe I did it!), I widened the pivot hole of the blade with a cylindrical carbide burr a bit to insert a brass tubing in which the pin would fit exactly. Actually not a bad idea, except for the fact that I did it "free hand". That means, the wider hole that fits the tubing is now not exactly 90 degrees to the blade, which forces the pin to be at the same angle, which forces the scales to be non parallel, ..., you don't want to know where the edge of the blade ends up when closing the razor! Oh well, I removed the tubing, re-pinned, everything works as it is supposed to now.

I also found that Micarta can be polished with Maas and a rotating linen buff, and the hammer doesn't hit too hard so easily if you hold it closer to the head.

Hopefully someone learns from my mistakes! Then they were worth making. ;)

I repinned both of my Goldedges this weekend, and both had bends/kinks in the pivot pin. However, there seem to be multiple factors contributing to the out-of-alignment scales issue. The original pin holes weren't perfectly aligned, one of the razors had a wider scale on one side, and the scales are slightly warped. It actually appears that the bent pivot might have been an effort to counteract some of these other problems.

Both razors are a lot better, but they're not 100 percent. I'm happy, though. :)

I have come to the conclusion that there was a good bit of variation from razor to razor, even at a well reputed company like Pearlduck.

One thing that I noticed is that Pearlduck used the "bullseye pins" like Dovo instead of pins that are peened on both sides. Made me feel less guilty about using Dovo replacements. :)

Josh