Buffers and Grinders and Baldors and what should I buy, Oh MY??????

Guys there are all of a sudden an abundance of threads on Buffing....

I am seeing links to variable speed Grinders too...

Here are a few tips from the bench!!!

First what is the difference between a Grinder and a Buffer????

Really for razor work, it comes down to clearance...

To use a Grinder as a Buffer you have to tear off all the safety guards !!!!

Now that really should be your first clue this might not be a good idea !!! (he says as he looks at his torn down Craftsman grinder)

Next is clearance.. look here ...
http://www.woodcraft.com/Images/prod...rand=408192781


See the very short arbors??? the things the wheels bolt onto... and how large the diameter of motor is???






Now look at a buffer

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/gifs/clear.gif


http://base1.googlehosted.com/base_m...c3eed197&hl=en



See the difference???? See how a true buffer gives you nice room around the wheel to move the razor???

Now the next thing you figure out is how to buff the blade,,,

Either from spine to edge, or lengthwise... So you ask which is correct????
Well now that brings up a good question, for which everyone seems to have a different answer for...

But equipment wise the Buffer can at least do both directions where the Grinder can only buff spine to edge on one side of the blade easily, then you have to start doing the "Contortions of the blade Dance" not real fun, nor safe with sharp thin steel, and a fast wheel.. (trust me here, been there, done that, refer back to the torn down Craftsman grinder :) )

The grinder gets your hands in the way quite a bit..

If you decide to get into Buffing razors on these things for God sake please think safety first, then think about what you want to accomplish ...

Caswell plating is a good source for information and gear for razor restoration. They are working with Lynn to put a package together for razor restores. If you read through their site they suggest alternatives to buffers. One is the use of old washing machine motors. They also mention bench grinders as a good inexpensive alternative. Read through their site and gleam all the info you can. I won't spoil you fun of finding the items to 'mod' a bench grinder or washing machine motor because there is a lot of good information on their site regarding different tools and safety. I've been using a bench grinder wheel guards removed for almost a year now w/ no ill effects. The wheel guards are to protect the user from exploding grinding wheels which is caused by a crack in the wheel. When using grinding wheels be sure all guards are in place. Buffing wheels are made of cloth and do not explode. The main difference between buffers and bench grinders is that buffers are designed for prolonged continuous use. For a hobbiest bench grinders will work just fine. If you are going to be buffing all day long for days on end a buffer is the more economical choice. A variable speed bench grinder will give a diverse wheel diameter range that is only limited by the horse power of the motor. Caswell also gives a chart as to what size wheels work best with the motors horse power.

My best advice is to study up on Caswell's site and other resources on the web and always put safety first, last and always.

I don't have a buffer yet, but I do know that when I do, I'll spend a couple of bucks extra to use felt wheels and not the standard stitched cotton wheels. I've read enough horror stories about a cotton loop grabbing the razor and flinging it towards the person doing the buffing.

Felt wheels are still dangerous of course, but with such flimsy things as razors, it is one less thing that can go wrong.

Lessee now:
- Joe Chandler nearly lost a finger to a razor that went spinning.
- That English guy whose name is eluding me atm would have been a eunuch if not for the heavy leather apron
- One of Gary's employees had a thumb ripped off by a buffing wheel.

Buffers are pure, concentrated evil. They are out to get you, and unless you take all precautions, they will get you and bathe in your blood.

These extension spindles will help with the clearance on grinders but not much good for mops that don't have reinforced centres.
Yep I have a torn down grinder too :)

Oh yeah,,, & the amount of toxic dust & gunk these things throw into the air demands a good dust mask at least.

Many moons ago I used to do alot of work with metals for a living. I used a buffer almost daily. A bunch of big buffers, IIRC. The smallest was about 3.5 hp and the largest buffer was around 16 hp. The bigger ones were kicking out over 7000 rpm at the shaft. It was a dirty job and that's for sure.

I'd like to input some info on this thread, if I could.

I have yet to see anyone mention a 'rake'. It's a medeval torture device looking tool ... used to clean the buff wheel from old tarnish, polish, etc... It refreshes the buff wheel. It also cuts any looped strings in the cotton. They work great and I do recommend them.

A buff wheel that is sewn in concentric circles should be plenty for rough buffing a razor. I have noticed that some of these particular wheels are quite thin for the arbor size(s) being discussed on this board. When I was in the shop using these small arbor buffers, I would double and/or triple up the buff wheel on the arbor. This did make the motor easier to stall or approach stall conditions, but it worked great for materials that didn't require much force between the buffing wheel and the work piece.

A good choice for a final buff wheel would be a cotton wheel only sewn in the center. I used to call them a 'floppy' wheel because buff wheel has no rigidity to it and it was quite floppy in use. Used with a white or blue polish, this type of wheel worked wonders as a final polish. Using this type of wheel should generate little to no heat. If the piece is becoming heated during this stage, something is wrong.

Interestingly enough, another point I have yet to see being discussed is the actual removal of polish from one buff wheel to another. For instance when I would run a piece under a concentric sewn buff wheel with a cut polish (or loosely termed - a lower grit polish), I would then run the piece on the same type of buff wheel without polish to remove the polish from that 'stage'. Not only does it help to keep the separate wheels respective to their polish, it actually allows a higher level of polish to be presented to the next stage of polishing. Plus hand removing the polish between stages opens the door to rag scratches and such, but this is dependent on the type of metal being polished. I dont think this would be too much of an issue with razor blades... but it is a heck of alot easier to remove warm polish on a buff wheel than it is to remove cold polish by hand. Also, this 'cleaning' wheel would see the rake most often.

One mention of proper buffing wheel use. Lets get our bearing first. Imagine a clock face on a buffing wheel with the rotation of the wheel going in a clockwise manner. The buff wheel should be rotating down and away from the operator. The work piece should contact the rotating buff wheel from approx. 4 o'clock to 5 o'clock. This is the optimum location, really. If the buff wheel catches an edge and yanks the work piece out of the operator's hand, the tangent line from the contact point will point away from the operator. In other words, the work piece will move away from the operator if dropped. Any other location used on the buff wheel is quite dangerous and considered misuse. The last thing an operator wants is the work piece to strike him/her if dropped. Not only is the work piece usually hot but if dropped, it will move so fast an operator will not have time to get out of the way. It's much better the work piece gets flung away from the operator and into plywood than the operator's leg or chest at the speed of light due to misuse.

Never use the top (10:00 - 2:00) or the back (6:00 - 9:00) of a buff wheel.
Ever.

Misuse of this type of machine can cause serious injury and/or death.


I've buffed everything from +$1m chandeliers to every last piece on a prewar Bentley and almost everything in between and along the way I've picked up some tips:

- Big pieces are miles easier to polish than small ones.

- Buff 1/2 of the piece, rotate the piece 180 degrees and buff the second 1/2.

- Keep the buff wheel away from any work piece edges where the wheel can grab the piece out of the operator's hand.

- Don't fight the buff wheel. Don't be afraid to push the work piece into the wheel either. Work with the rotation and not against it.

- Consider use of a clamp to hold the work piece.

- Practice moving the part around on the buff wheel before use. Know your moves before operating the buffer and be aware of any edges the wheel can catch. It's not the brightest idea to experiment working the piece on an already spinning buff wheel.

- Buffing/polishing requires a very small amount of metal to be removed from the work piece. Usually, this metal is collected on the buff wheel due to the polish. A clean buff wheel works much better (and more consistent) than a buff wheel loaded with old polish, tarnish, old metal, and grit.


There's more, I'm sure ... but my coffee is getting cold.


This method of finishing metal works wonders. The results can be fabulous.



Remember, Safety First and practice makes perfect.

The above assumes the operator read and understands the manufacturer's manual and understands standard shop safety practices. If not, just ask.

Removing polishing compounds !!!!

Go to Walmart or any auto store
Buy Brake Cleaner
Place razor full of compound on rag
Spray
Wipe
Done

Continue on to next step...

And adding to Glen's great comparison is the HP and Torque. Buffers rule in that aspect. Most grinders are just fine and can do an OK job with the right amount of pressure and wheels but will never be able to compete against the mean raw power of a decent buffer.

Grinders are a good value for people on a budget but will always lack the power for the heavier buffing and polishing job needed on a pro level.

Many of the 'cheaper offered grinders only list the Peak HP, not the continuous HP. Never forget you always get what you pay for.

And yes. safety first.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by gssixgun

Removing polishing compounds !!!!

Go to Walmart or any auto store
Buy Brake Cleaner
Place razor full of compound on rag
Spray
Wipe
Done

Continue on to next step...

---

This is interesting to me ..

I've used ultrasound machines for small parts .. you know .. the small ones that jewelers use. With that and a toothbrush, I found I could get pretty far with clean up.

I've also tried a dry cleaning solution, but since it was flammable, I had to rinse it completely before going into the ultrasound machine.

Just another step, really.

Honestly I've only used the grease compounds so I really wouldnt know what chemicals would work on a greaseless compound ...

Brake cleaner does destroy alot of stuff ... It doesnt surprise me that it works well. Nice one, 6 gunner.