Thread: What I'm learning...and amateur's restoration

So, today I decided to get my 'feet wet' trying to fashion a set of scales from scratch. (images will be posted on the bottom)

I started my first 'full' overhaul/restoration. I have a 6/8 Wade&Butcher 'Special' spike point that was carbon black with age, pined to black celluloid scales that were degraded to light tan/brown (pewter end spacer, might make this an older version of the brand).

I started hand sanding the blade using some tricks from Bill, Vlad, Joe, and much of the others that have been posting here. This is something I played around with last weekend. This weekend when I started the scale, looking at the blade, I realize I need to redo them....especially after seeing Vlad's recent post.

The scales are going to be made out of blood wood (1/8" thick), brass liner, and blue plastic liners (I'm not that crazy about the blue, but it was all the texasknife store sent, since they were out of the black...we'll see how they look when this is done. Sort of reminds me of a "Bluefooted Boobie")

What I have learned, and am learning......

1. I do not think I have the patience or shoulder/hand endurance to sand the blade as well as Vlad does. (This is a WHOLE nother topic to write on 'learning').

2. Using a Dremel with buffing wheels (mesh = 220-400grit), flap wheel (120 grit) or any rotary sanding of pitting only makes my job last longer, because I wind up going back over the work with 100grit paper to make the surface smooth......There is too many wavey lines and dips in the surface when holding the dremel or blade. Sanding this with a dremel does not look nearly as good as when the blade is flat on wood and I am holding the sandpaper (wrapped around a rubber tube for support), which disappoints me, because I REALLY wish I could save time using the dremel!! Also, some sort of lubricant works great when sanding (since I do not have any mineral oil on hand, I am using a drop or 2 of Tuf-Glide while sanding).

3. Dremel cutting wheels. What the hell are these good for?! I find them a bit brittle, and while I do enjoy the nice wood-burning smell they make when trying to cut wood, they only scorch the wood, and take for EVER to make any progress on.

4. Using a coping saw cuts better than a dremel cutting wheel, but sucks rocks, when you do not have a clamp to hold down the wood. This takes longer than I had hoped, and made me really wish I had access to a jigsaw. Also, while the wife HATES the rediculous noise I make trying to cut this wood, she loves the 'wood smell' of the saw dust.

5. Palstic liners (HIGH TECH PLASTIC SPACER from texasknife.com) does not like to be cut with a scissor (chips and cracks). Since the Dremel wheel sucks versus cutting, a small router/engraving bit slices nicely through the plastic liner.

6. Brass sheets cut nicely with titanium metal cutters. Escpecially when the brass is 0.005 thick! (Thinner cuts better)

7. T-88 Epoxy is not as scary to use as I thought, and excess NyQuil cups are great for mixing the epoxy in. Also, the epoxy is thick as honey and spreads easy on the wood/brass/liner. If you do not have a roller, a round marker seems to work great! I rolled the brass on the wood to work out excess epoxy.

8. Wearing a mouth/nose mask when dust starts flying helps me breath easier, reduces the headache, and my snot is not dark Also, rubber gloves are key when sanding down the metal or working with the epoxy.

9. Paper clamps (the one's with the 2 swinging arms) work GREAT for clamping together the drying/annealing the liner/wood/brass and holds the set off the table.

10. Waiting 24 hours for epoxy to dry is a LONG time. Especially when you want to keep playing I guess this is the time to start cursing at the hand sanding of the blade.

Till the next posting.....(for anyone who cares)

C utz

** cough ** where are the pictures that you said would be at the bottom?!?!

C utz, at least you've persevered and are going through the same learning curve most of us have had to endure.
Oh yeah...where's the pics.

Gary

LOL!
Ok! OK! Here are the pictures (sheesh!)
Sorry for the delay. I wrote that while I was at work (yes I have to go in this weekend), and expected to be home shortly there after...not 7hours later!

Anyway, here is what I have as 'before'....
Sorry, no blue liner images yet. I'll have those when the T-88 is done drying (it's a little tacky now at 9 hours of curing).

Any suggestions and advice is MORE than welcome.

Check out the old "coffin box" for this 'Special'. I did not know they made this 'brand' of W&B this far back.....As for the razor, the blade IS/was that dark. That is not due to the way the image was taken. The only thing that IS hard to tell in the image was how brown the celluloid was turning (I hate that!).

C utz

Chris,

The epoxy sets according to the time given in its instructions only at room temperature (20C/68F).

The setting time is halved for every 10C (18F) increase. So at 30C it is 12 hours, 40C 6, etc. Similarly every drop in temperature by 10C, doubles the setting time. So if you keep your scales in a cool (50F) garage expect the setting time to double to 48 hours.

When I started out I used to bake the scales at 50C so I would only have to wait 3 hours. These days I learned that I am better off waiting 24 hours rather than risk warping of the wood.

BTW, if you run out of the NyQuil cups you can get more at Lee Valley they are about $4 / 100. I also got the wooden picks they have and they are great for mixing and applying small amounts of epoxy.

Great! Thanks Vlad!!

That IS useful info. It is unseasonably warm here right now so it should take no more than 24 hrs.

On a different note, I was sandin' metal tonight (one of my favorite past times...) and when I got to the 320 grit (alright, that is as far as I got tonight), I noticed on the front of the tang, under the cross after "Special" I could make out some stamped letters of old. Almost as if they ground out the original stamping and restamped it. Is this possible? Am I seeing things? I tried to scan it, but can only get it to 'sort of' show......

C utz

P.S. I'll show the sanding progression (220, 320, 400 grit etc...) when I get closer to 2000+ grit

Originally Posted by C utz

I do not think I have the patience or shoulder/hand endurance to sand the blade as well as Vlad does. (This is a WHOLE nother topic to write on 'learning').

I feel your pain

I've spent the last few nights in front of the TV sanding away (I think I'm up to about 7 hours on the 120 grit sandpaper). I thought vladsch was stretching the truth some what with estimations of hours sanding..... until I started doing it myself. I find it strangely relaxing and am amazed how different light shows different stains, marks and scratches.

I said I found it relaxing although I have to keep looking over my shoulder to see if my is going to kill me for making the constant scratching noises.

Please keep posting comments and pictures cause I'm going to give this a shot after cleaning this blade.

WELL, the scales (aka bluefooted-boobies) are dried...or at least the T-88 epoxy is Tonight I'll be cleaning off the excess epoxy (I'll go with the dremel on the sides, and hand sanding on the surfaces (~220 grit), and then I'm not quite sure, but I was thinking of rubber cement glueing them together (Bill Ellis making scales blog), however if you can see in the one picture the wood has a bow to it.

I cut the scales knowing the bow was there, and cut them so that the bow would work with how the scales would pin together.

If I can get the rubber cement to hold with the bow I'll sand them together. Otherwise I'll have to work on them one at a time.

Also, I'll try to work up to 400 grit on the blade. I can see that there is pitting that is deep, and probabluy too deep to sand out (the blade is VERY thin so I am reluctant to sand down TOO much). I'm thinking of ordering some Por15 "metal ready" (http://www.por15.com/PRODUCTS/CLEANE...0/Default.aspx) to get down in those pits and stop the progression of any further rusting/oxidation.....

We'll see!

drsch3, Post pictures of your progress!!!

C utz

Chris,

I use turner's tape which is a double sided carpet tape used by wood turners. [Lee Valley caries it] The stuff is vicious when left for a few days. So use narrow strips. Don't use the full area of the scales. If you do you may find separating the scales without breaking them difficult or it may even pull off the liners. I even had it pull chunks out of the wood once.

I use one or two 1/8" strips to hold the scales together. Sometimes only 1/8" by 1" long on both ends of the scale halves.

Another option is to use an adhesive dispenser. It is sold at Staples and comes in a roll-on dispenser which puts a layer of adhesive (same as used for tape but this is adhesive only). This one is much easier to take off with lacquer thinner. I stopped using it when I decided to try the double sided tape. It does not hold as strong but sometimes it is a good thing.

I never tried rubber cement. Don't know how easy it will be to separate and wash off once it dries.

Originally Posted by drsch3

I thought vladsch was stretching the truth some what with estimations of hours sanding..... until I started doing it myself. I find it strangely relaxing and am amazed how different light shows different stains, marks and scratches.

Hand sanding a blade is Zen of Razor Restoration.

C Utz, it's funny you should ask that about the possibility of a re-stamped name. I was trying to research a razor today and came across an article about collecting that said there are people who grind out the name on a blade to re-stamp it with the markings of one more valuable (original article here: http://www.auctionbytes.com/cab/abu/...08/abu0149/s07 )

Can't say for sure, of course, is this is what's going on with your W&B but I thought I'd throw it out just the same. I'm sure the wiser among us have better explanations.

-S