First restoration advice/information

Hi,

This is my first time posting. I have been using a gillette safety razor for over three years now and recently decided to explore the possibility of using a straight razor. While I don't mind investing in having a razor professionally restored (even with a full razor restore/replate I had done on my safety razor I still figure I am $50 up over the past 3 years vs the cost of mach fusion blades.

Earlier this week, I started reading about straight razor choices and then I had the opportunity to look at one yesterday. I recognized that it was made in Sheffield and that the edge of the blade didn't seem to have much damage. It was only $5 so I thought I would take a shot (at the worst I have a neat piece to stick on a bookshelf). Below I have included some pictures. I have read around on some of the articles for restoration and a lot of the time the authors suggested posting on the forum for specific advice. I would appreciate any guidance or advice on how to restore this myself. I am looking for a useable razor and I am not concerned about augmenting or damaging its value. Links to helpful articles or other forum posts would be very welcome.

The razor is a Wade and Butcher and the etching on the blade (didn't capture well in the pictures) says Wade & Butcher on the left and Sheffield on the right. In between it says corporate mark with an arrow, there is a B in a circle at its tail and a cross at its head. On the tang there is the same mark, Wade & Butcher Sheffield England. Any information on the razor (date range) would be welcome. I know W&B made razors from the late 1800s to the mid-1900s but I don't know if there is a way to get the dates tighter.

Thanks for taking a look!

Cam
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That looks like a razor with some potential! Did you try honing it first to see if it shaves well? Seeing as it's a W&B, I guess it will.

I suggest starting out first with metal polish, clearing away the active (brown) rust to see what's what. You'll find that it will make a large difference, especially if you are willing to polish for half an hour straight or with a Dremel polishing wheel (I like this option, but mind the heat!). Note that this will remove the nice etch.

After that, get sandpaper ranging from 80 to 1500 grit, car shops usually carry the high grits for polishing. You will spend most of the time with the coarstest grits. Once you are happy with how must rust and pitting has been removed, move on to higher grits to sand out the scratches you left. Patience is key with hand sanding. Also, when you notice a little scratch from a lower grit, sand it out before moving on to higher grits, as it will be more visible when you're finished.


I suggest not unpinning the scales, unless you plan on replacing them, because of the crack at the pivot hole. When repinning, this crack may become bigger and mess things up.

Good luck, and don't forget to make many pictures!

The rust will come off. You'll lose what's left ot the gold wash (yellow paint?) On the blade. There will be pitting left behind, likely too deep to remove easily.

More importantly, I worry that there might be some pitting deep into the bevel. I'd do a little honing on it to see how bad that is before putting much time into it.

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Originally Posted by Laurens

That looks like a razor with some potential! Did you try honing it first to see if it shaves well? Seeing as it's a W&B, I guess it will.

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I am very new at this. I wasn't expecting to buy a razor so quickly, it was just super cheap so I thought I would take a chance. I don't own a hone or strop yet. I went around to a local antique shop and found a "Barber's Friend" hone for $15 which I might pick up (it looked circular, I haven't seen anything like it online). I know I also need a strop and I would appreciate suggestions on that. Would it be better to buy a new one or something used?

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Originally Posted by Laurens

I suggest starting out first with metal polish, clearing away the active (brown) rust to see what's what. You'll find that it will make a large difference, especially if you are willing to polish for half an hour straight or with a Dremel polishing wheel (I like this option, but mind the heat!). Note that this will remove the nice etch.

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Would just the metal polish remove the etch or only the dremeling? I don't mind if the gold paint comes off but would like to try to preserve the etch. Will any metal polish work or should I be looking for something in particular.

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Originally Posted by HNSB

More importantly, I worry that there might be some pitting deep into the bevel. I'd do a little honing on it to see how bad that is before putting much time into it.

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What should I be looking for when I hone. Since I am new to this what I might try is following an online guide for honing and then throw up some pictures.

Thanks to you both.

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Originally Posted by campbellh

I am very new at this. I wasn't expecting to buy a razor so quickly, it was just super cheap so I thought I would take a chance. I don't own a hone or strop yet. I went around to a local antique shop and found a "Barber's Friend" hone for $15 which I might pick up (it looked circular, I haven't seen anything like it online). I know I also need a strop and I would appreciate suggestions on that. Would it be better to buy a new one or something used?

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Ah, now you're making it quite tough on yourself! I strongly suggest buying a Norton 4000/8000 combination, find the thread here about its application and learn how to use it. Setting a bevel after restoring a blade can easily take half an hour on a 4K, and there is no point in attempting to do so on anything finer than that. Also, get a cheap second hand strop and take your time (at least a few months) to learn how to strop. You will cut the strop a few times, hence a cheap second hand :)

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Originally Posted by campbellh

Would just the metal polish remove the etch or only the dremeling? I don't mind if the gold paint comes off but would like to try to preserve the etch. Will any metal polish work or should I be looking for something in particular.

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Both would remove the gold paint very quickly. The etch will last quite a while when doing this by hand, Dremeling is much faster and less controllable. Many here suggest MAAS polish. We don't have that in the Netherlands, I just went with a well-known and yet cheap brand and get great results.

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Originally Posted by campbellh

What should I be looking for when I hone. Since I am new to this what I might try is following an online guide for honing and then throw up some pictures.

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Honing is quite an art on itself. Follow many guides and watch many videos and try try try!

If you have the budget for it, buy another razor (one in good condition: it should have little to no rust, none at the edge and little, even hone marks along the spine and bevel) and have it professionally honed, for instance by any of the members that offer honing service on this forum. That will give you a good reference for your own honing skills. Keep in mind: there is a slow learning curve for both honing and shaving!

Keep us posted and good luck :)

Thank you so much cudarunner!!!

cudarunner very generously agreed to give my razor a light cleaning and then took the time to hone the edge so it is shaveable. I just gave it my first run a few minutes ago and it didn't go to badly at all (the reason it wasn't excellent was certainly because this is my first time with a straight razor... I can tell there is quite the learning curve).

Please see the pictures below. In maybe 6 months - a year, if I am comfortable using it and I find it is working for me I will probably get the scales replaced. They are a little rickety but I have no real need to replace them right now other than aesthetics.

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Thanks again cudarunner!!!!

Is there anyway to determine the approximate age of the razor?

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Originally Posted by campbellh

Thank you so much cudarunner!!!

cudarunner very generously agreed to give my razor a light cleaning and then took the time to hone the edge so it is shaveable. I just gave it my first run a few minutes ago and it didn't go to badly at all (the reason it wasn't excellent was certainly because this is my first time with a straight razor... I can tell there is quite the learning curve).

Please see the pictures below. In maybe 6 months - a year, if I am comfortable using it and I find it is working for me I will probably get the scales replaced. They are a little rickety but I have no real need to replace them right now other than aesthetics.

Thanks again cudarunner!!!!

Is there anyway to determine the approximate age of the razor?

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Campbell,

The privilege was all mine!! I spent less than an hour cleaning up your razor, the honing also went very well and quite quickly, being a heavier grind I was expecting a long haul, but again the Razor Gods were looking out for me!

I feel very blessed, not only do you like my work cleaning it up, but because I provided you with your first truly shave ready razor for your first straight razor shave!

I'm as giddy as a young child on Christmas morning!

I'm so glad you like it!!

Yes shaving with a straight has many trials and tribulations and there is a Huge Learning Curve. However once at least semi-mastered, is a whole new/old and better way to shave!!

Mana, Neil or others may be of help dating your blade.

Again, it was my pleasure! :tu

Hi Cudarunner

Great job Cudarunner. Your a classy guy.

Luis

This is above and beyond.

Awesome!

Michael

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Originally Posted by Luis

Hi Cudarunner

Great job Cudarunner. Your a classy guy.

Luis

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He is, indeed. That's a fact.

One thing that I forgot to mention was how important it was to Campbell that the etching wasn’t lost or diminished!! He fully understood that all gold wash would disappear.

I practice what I preach so just used some 2000 grit wet and dry to see what came off, once I could see a little better I tried some 1000 grit and then 800 and finally 400. At this point in time (thanks Glen hehehe) I was pleased and didn't want to lose the etching so I stopped.I know this process sounds backwards, but when I’m wanting to make sure an etching isn’t lost this is how I do it.I felt it was time to start back up the sanding grits and stopped at the 2K and I finished with some Mothers Mag Wheel polish and was pleased with how it had cleaned up.

I’d told Campbell that I wasn’t a restorer and all I was offering to do was to clean it up a bit and then make it shave ready.

On thing to note is the crack at the pivot. The crack was there when it arrived. This was a Big Concern as I didn’t want it to be me that broke those old bone scales.

My solution was to securely wrap the blade to the scales with plastic electrical tape. The only time this wasn’t done was when I needed to work right around the shank or pivot area and the tail.

It made honing a little interesting but it does shave nice! I set the bevel on a King 1K, then went to the Norton 4/8K and finished on a Naniwa 12K. Initial stropping was 50 laps on the Illinois 827 linen followed by 50 laps on Neil Miller Genuine linen then 100 laps on the Illinois leather and 200 laps on SRD Premium #1 leather. Test shaved, re-stropped on the SRD leather, sanitized, packed and shipped back to the Great White North.

All I was out was some sandpaper, wear in my hones and my time. All Campbell was out was shipping here and back.

It really was my privilege. I'm glad I could help! There's somethings that money can't buy!

Anyway I just thought that I’d add this little bit of info.

Wow, im impressed with the results.
I guess its my feel good story of the day!
That was classy of you cudarunner.

I have that razor, I'm told by an established expert that is also a very rare model, that only hundreds were made. This blade is a true wedge, with bone / horn scales.

The person doing the restore on mine advised me not to get it honed due to it's rarity and excellent condition. He told me it's from around 1840-1890 at first glance, and that the one I have must have been stored and not touched for over a hundred years.

I spent months trying to find out info until I sent it out to be honed, needless to say, got a call telling me that it was a rare find.

I believe these are the same razors:

Attachment 142404

Are these basically the same razor?

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Originally Posted by Phrank

I have that razor, I'm told by an established expert that is also a very rare model, that only hundreds were made. This blade is a true wedge, with bone / horn scales.

The person doing the restore on mine advised me not to get it honed due to it's rarity and excellent condition. He told me it's from around 1840-1890 at first glance, and that the one I have must have been stored and not touched for over a hundred years.

I spent months trying to find out info until I sent it out to be honed, needless to say, got a call telling me that it was a rare find.

I believe these are the same razors:

Attachment 142404

Are these basically the same razor?

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Is not the "England" stamping indicative of POST 1891 manufacture?

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Originally Posted by Phrank

I have that razor, I'm told by an established expert that is also a very rare model, that only hundreds were made. This blade is a true wedge, with bone / horn scales.

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Do you have a source for this? I can't imagine a company with the manufacturing capacity of WB to make only hundreds of this model, especially when this is a very cheap model itself; undecorated horn scales, easy wedge grind, etc. I bought one of this exact model from ebay a year ago for $25 with no other bids. Here's another: http://straightrazorpalace.com/show-...rket-swag.html

If I saw concrete evidence I would be convinced. I am curious.

What I can say is simply what I've been told by a reputable person in the trade. And your point is absolutely correct, this wasn't a popular model by any means, that's why they only made this model in the hundreds.

I've google'd extensively and have only ever seen one other with the square point, in similar condition, and it sold in 2008. Sold for price wasn't listed.

Perhaps you know more sources than I, have a search for this model and see what you can come up...I seem to get everything but this model, and when I do get this model, it's the pics I've posted here.

I don't use this razor, sent it out to get tidied up, and now it's put away, not a big fan of wedges, and if I feel the urge to use a wedge, use my DD Satin Wedge.

Have a go, see if you can come up with more info than I, I maybe own two vintage razors, if you don't count DD's, and have a little to zero knowledge base of them, so any info you could get would be appreciated.

I paid maybe $60 for it?

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Originally Posted by Phrank

What I can say is simply what I've been told by a reputable person in the trade. And your point is absolutely correct, this wasn't a popular model by any means, that's why they only made this model in the hundreds.

I've google'd extensively and have only ever seen one other with the square point, in similar condition, and it sold in 2008. Sold for price wasn't listed.

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I'm sorry, Phrank, but you were misled. Probably not intentionally -- there's a lot of very bad information out there, things like Goin's and the Standard Guide To Collecting Razors are, honestly, terrible. The razor was definitely made after 1891 (which you can identify by the presence of 'ENGLAND' on the tang. As for the rarity of the model, that's a complicated question.

This early 1900's wholesale catalog page will give you an idea (the two columns on the left are all Wade & Butcher razors, and by 1900, Wade & Butcher was in serious decline):

http://theshiveringbeggar.com/wp-con...+VYSW60_57.jpg

Razor manufacturers of the time made many, many different models. I can't find the link at the moment, but the president of J.R. Torrey (who got his start working at Wade & Butcher), in testifying on trade restrictions in the 1880's, said his company made over 150 different models of razor. I've seen numerous Wade & Butcher razors from the same time period with the exact same blade. That particular etching was used on several different styles of blade.

How many were made? Maybe only hundreds with that style blade, those scales and that etch. But there were many thousands of that blade made. Think of the etching less as a mark of the 'model' and more like a paint job.

That said, yours is in good shape (though it has been sanded or buffed, that is not the original blade finish), and more to the point, Cudarunner did a fantastic job cleaning up Campbellh's razor.

+1 to what Zak says...I have several of those W&B 5/8 to 6/8 small wedges with different etchings. Wostenholm and Joseph Allen made almost exact duplicates right down to similar etchings as the W&B. I have examples from each of those manufacturers as well.

BTW...most definitely hone it up...they are very nice shavers!

Well thank-you very much!! It's finally excellent to know the story behind this.

Frankly, I paid $60 for it, and when I was told it was somewhat rare, that was interesting, but on the whole, any razor I have now, I don't plan on selling, it's just money, and I'd rather have the blade.

I'm actually glad that it's not something that's rare, that I might have some "duty" to preserve it. I purchased my razors to use, not to put in a drawer!

So, now just to find someone to hone it up for me. Person I usually use is swamped, so have to find someone who can do that razor, a DD Satin Wedge, and potentially one other blade...but am excited that I can get another razor in the rotation.

Thanks for all your help!!

Cheers!

I also had an etched wedge Wostenholm of the same era, and can second that it made a fantastic shaver, and just feels awesome when you have it in the condition like yours.