Slurry Dulling

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Originally Posted by mainaman

Close to what I thought.
Still may be someone will come an share experience with hones other than J-Nats.

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Seconded. I completely agree! If there is more to it and something to learn I will be all ears. Learning is the most fun you can have. as I said 'cheeky'. Not authoritative or omnipotent. My sincere apologies if it is, or is taken, in bad form. If you or OP would like me to remove it, I will or you can and I'll be fine. That is my hunch/thought/advise, not a proven solution to an unverified problem on every hone in the world. I'm glad you got it, I planned for those that got it to chuckle and the thread to go on as if it never happened. I'll just drink my glass of water now. "Everyone you will ever meet knows something you don't" -Bill

Here is my theory. If you hone an edge to a fairly high level and then hone on slurry you are going backwards in grit. The edge will then be more dull than it was before. However as you progress to dilute the slurry, and the slurry begins to dull, then the polishing then increases and the edge then begins to return to where it was before. This is presuming that the cutting properties of the slurry are friable and that the razor was honed past the lowest cutting point of the slurry. I said grit but I am stuck for better words to describe my thoughts.

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Originally Posted by RezDog

Here is my theory. If you hone an edge to a fairly high level and then hone on slurry you are going backwards in grit. The edge will then be more dull than it was before. However as you progress to dilute the slurry, and the slurry begins to dull, then the polishing then increases and the edge then begins to return to where it was before. This is presuming that the cutting properties of the slurry are friable and that the razor was honed past the lowest cutting point of the slurry. I said grit but I am stuck for better words to describe my thoughts.

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Ok but how does the dulling happen? There is no way the impact of the grit particles can deform the edge itself. The keenness of the edge is achieved by abrasion not plastic deformation. The grit particles float in fluid so can they cause abrasion at the very edge that can be felt in a shave compared to water only finished edge?

If you think about it. a slurry is particles mixed with liquid. If you think about it enlarged it would be like water and sand. push a blade through the water and sand and it becomes bright and shinny but the edge round off a little. This is just my way of thinking. when I finish a blade I use water only but then again I use naniwa hones up to 12K then finish on the suehiro 20K. like I said it's just my thinking.

If that's the case then how would you explain the standard JNAT progression of different particle size Nagura's (Bot, Ten, Mej, Koma, Tomo). Is it suggested that you are constantly dulling and then re-sharpening the edge? That is not my experience...BUT maybe I just never paid attention!

Ive only heard slurrydulling spoken with cotis where slurry doesnt break down.

Well in the theoretical example in my head there were a variety of things going on. First off the edge was very advanced, the second part in my head was the dulling was slight. For example if you took a 12 or 16K edge back to 8 or 10K. Something I have thought about when people are talking about honing quite high on synthetics and then finishing on a natural. As far as jnats and nagura goes I have near zero experience.

Slurry a "special stone" & get back with me. It's the only razor stone i have had that the slurry would not break down. Sham then confirmed my find...i had gotten the stone from him.

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Originally Posted by Wolfpack34

If that's the case then how would you explain the standard JNAT progression of different particle size Nagura's (Bot, Ten, Mej, Koma, Tomo). Is it suggested that you are constantly dulling and then re-sharpening the edge? That is not my experience...BUT maybe I just never paid attention!

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Now i'm not an expert. but my way of thinking if a slurry is particles mixed with fluid and an edge bumps the particle. I may be over thinking all this. I do know I sat beside who I consider the best at honing and watched and talked and most important listened. this gentleman used mostly naniwa hones. I could see no slurry just a little discoloration in the water. I really believe his edge would cut Addams. The older stones worked with slurries great but it seems like maybe the newer syn. hones do better. I know I get decent results. I know that the older barber hones like the swaties did well for finishing. or at least that's what I've been told. but then again i'm no old time hone master. Just old.

Someone should test honing a thick slurry on a jnat for an absurd number of laps. Will the edge inifitely get more keen, plateau at a max keeness, or lose and regain keeness in a cyclical fashion?