Thread: Does Anyone have a Devonshire Oil Stone?

Do any of the collectors here have a Devonshire Hone? I've never seen pictures of one, and can't find an actual description of the stone in any pertinent literature. It was mined near Tavistock, but that's all I know.

It is described as being excellent in use, and was only unavailable due to a lack of distribution.

Kindest regards,
Alex

This is tough to swallow. if you don't know color etc how we find out this is particular stone.? At least it is oil stone or water ?
Alex i hope you can find a little more information then we could get together and find out may be some one has it.

Hi Sham,

This stone is proving to be a major hassle to track down. I've asked about it a number of times over the years but no one seems to have any experience with them. The only reference that I can find is a transcript from a talk that a collector gave about his stones. This transcript was published in a collection of articles that's dated from 1835, I don't have any reference after that. In the article it said that the only reason the hone wasn't in wider use was because it didn't have a distributor.

I asked about this stone on a forum about English History, and one member said he thought I might be talking about a particular type of slate that was quarried in the same area, Tavistock in Devon. Unfortunately, he couldn't tell me anything more.

Finally, I have emailed the Tavistock History Society, to ask if they have any records concerning this particular hone, but am still waiting for a reply.

Tavistock is 200 miles from where I live, but I'm seriously considering trying to look for the stone near to where it was quarried, but seeing as I don't even know what colour it's supposed to have been I have no idea what I'm actually looking for.

Kindest regards,
Alex

This is the article I was talking about, the transcript of the talk concerning various grindstones and hones can be found on pages 267-269. The Mechanics' magazine, museum ... - Google Books

Kindest regards,
Alex

thank you Alex for the information.
it does says it is oil stone . at least we know now it is oil stone. Read 13 more information in there.

The problem is we don't know what it looks like because we don't know anyone who has it, and no one knows if he has it, because no one knows what it looks like...



The quoted source is the only one I know too. It must, by the way, be read with a healthy dose of scepticism. Read eg. the descriptions under 15 and 16:

Originally Posted by The Mechanics' magazine, museum, register, journal, and gazette

15. German razor-hone. This is universally known throughout Europe, and generally esteemed as the best whet-stone for all kinds of the finer description of cutlery. It is obtained from the slate-mountains in the neighbourhood of Ratisbon, where it occurs in the form of a yellow vein running virtually into the blue slate, sometimes not more than an inch in thickness, and varying to 12 and sometimes 18 inches, from whence it is quarried, and then sawed into thin slabs, which are usually cemented into a similar slab of the slate, to serve as a support, and in that state sold for use. That which is obtained from the lowest part of the vein is esteemed the best, and termed old rock.

16. The same, with the hone in natural contact with the slate.

Surely nothing else can be described here but the Belgian coticule. Yet the origins are placed six hundred kilometres away in Regensburg (S.Germany).

Similarly:

Originally Posted by The Mechanics' magazine, museum, register, journal, and gazette

17. Is a dark slate of very uniform character; in appearance not at all laminated; is in considerable use among jewellers, clock- makers, and other workers in silver and metal, for polishing off tbeir work, and for whose greater convenience it is cut into lengths of about 6 inches, and from a quarter of an inch to an inch or more wide, and packed up in small bundles of from 6 to 16 in each, and secured by means of withes of osier, and in that state imported for use, and called blue polishing-stones.

18. Is a stone of very similar properties, but of a somewhat coarser texture and paler colours, and thence termed grey polishing- stone. Its uses are the same, and they are manufactured near Ratisbon.

must be about Thuringians from Sonneberg, but here also situated in Regensburg, two hundred kilometres to the south. Could it be that an important international hones distributor was located there?



I do incidentally think I might have Cutler's Green - at least I have an English green hone that fits the description and isn't like any of the other known hones, but to date I haven't found anyone who owns a certain CG or can confirm anything about mine. Maybe I should post some pics.

When you find out what one looks like, get in touch with me. I've got a lot of unknown stones in my collection and could at least get you a decent picture of one.

Progress is now non-existant, I thought I was finally getting somewhere with this stone but alas, leads never panned out and many emails went unanswered.

However, during the course of my investigations I came across some odds and ends of information concerning other types of British Hones and thought I'd share these before finally throwing in the towel.

Number 1: Whittle Hill may not have been the source of the best Charnley Forest Hones after all. There is an article which describes how the hones were processed as a cottage-industry in the area of Cole Orton, and according to those who worked there, Charnwood Hones from a quarry near Thringstone village were superior to all others. However, the material was apparently difficult to extract and consequently this particular stone was never widely appreciated.

Also, I have found reference to an area known as Whittle's Warren that yielded Charnwood hones that were used specifically as razor hones. This area is mentioned in an 1800's work, and thus predates the Whittle Hill Quarry by 37 years, although it is possible that the stone was exploited before the quarry was officially opened and Whittle's Warren and Whittle Hill may be one and the same; although I've never seen another reference to Charnwood Hones being used specifically for razors so it may be something different.

Number 2: Another area producing a Whetstone in the UK is Kilburn. I have seen a reference in a suppler's catalogue naming the Kilburn Whetstone. I don't know if this is Kilburn in London or Kilburn in Yorkshire. If we have member's local to either area they might be able to find out some more for us.

Number 3: Ironstones from Codnor and Woodthorpe in Derbyshire are used as hones. These may be the same Ironstones that were used to smooth out an edge mentioned in earlier works. Apparently these were so hard that only a couple of strokes were used, otherwise an edge became too smooth.

Number 4: Richard Williams & Co's Works at Portmadoc mined slate from the Corris area in Wales which was used to make curved Safety Razor Blade Hones for the UK market as well as Flat Hones for export.

Number 5: I've found hones from Wales, Scotland and England but had never heard of hones coming from Ireland. Well our Gaelic friends need no longer feel left out in the cold as I've found a type of Razor Hone that hails from the Emerald Isle. And I quote, " On the mountains of Mangerton, near the lake called The Devil's Punch Bowl, is a species of Whetstone, the grit of which is as fine as that of many common hones, and being shaped properly and afterwards boiled in oil, it serves the country people for whetting razors." It is described as being a bright Olive Green colour, darkening after being boiled.

Well, that's it for me. It's been fun playing detective, but after months of heartbreak, hard work and ultimately, failure I'm forced to concede and admit that it will take a better man than me to find any, if not all, of these hones.

Regards,
Alex

Some more information about Derbyshire Hones:

Mr. Farey enumerates 138 stone quarries in Derbyshire, some of which produce an ashlar of a good and durable quality for building. Some excellent specimens of these are seen in the principal seats and public edifices in the county; and great quantities are exported, particularly from the mill-stone grit quarries in the parish of Crich. Grindstones made of the mill-stone grit are in great request, and are exported in great quantities by the canals to the south-east parts of England. Of late there has been a great demand for the coarse grind-stones from Gregory quarry at Overton in Ashover. Mr. Farey enumerates 19 quarries in Derbyshire, from which the grind-stones are procured. Coarse whet-stones for sharpening scythes, called scythe-stones, are procured from 13 quarries in this county; the finer whet-stones from seven others. The finest whet-stones, called hones, for setting a fine edge on knives, razors, &c., are procured from quarries at Conor-park and Woodthorp near Wingerworth. The Heage whetstones are used by the petrefaction workers at Derby.

From: 'Produce and manufactures', Magna Britannia: volume 5: Derbyshire (1817), pp. CXCII-CCIII. URL: Produce and manufactures | British History Online Date accessed: 07 September 2009.

Regards,
Alex

Do we have any members here from Staffordshire? The reason I ask is because sorting through the information I've gathered I've come across a discrepancy that could do with some clarification. In the Knight article that I linked to on the first page of this thread, the grindstones hailing from Bilston, Staffs are described as occurring in a very small spot of limited extent and thickness above the coal layer. Although the stone was described as being of great excellence and as having a very fine grit, I wasn't initially interested in it as even a fine grindstone is likely too coarse for razors. However, I then found an article that specified that grindstones quarried near Bilston were used for sharpening straights, I assumed that this meant the grindstone catalogued by Knight. The discrepancy arose when I found this article which describes twelve prolific layers (whereas Knight has it as limited) of very hard (whereas Knight says not too hard) and valuable stone, including amongst them the best grindstones and whetstones in the world. History, gazetteer, and directory of ... - Google Books

So now I'm not sure whether I should be looking for one stone from the Bilston area or more? I like the sound of the best whetstones in the world, but my OCD demands that I need to know exactly what I'm looking for.

Regards,
Alex