Thread: Is my grind not steep enough?

Hi all, I am a blacksmith and bladesmith, but razors are not my specialty. I am making one for my brother for christmas because he's a barber. It's a 3/4 damascus rounded end razor, about 7/32" at the spine. BUT I ground in the hollow with an 8" wheel and the grind really just doesn't look steep enough. I'm worried that as it gets sharpened and worn over time and the edge moves back, it'll be too thick to cut anything. I'll attach a pic. I don't have any 3, 4 or 6" wheels. I only got 2" and 8" as well as larger ones. Should I give it a go with the 2" or is that too small? I have yet to start on the stones, so it's not the final edge, just the edge after the grinder.

I am neither blacksmith nor bladesmith, but blades come in all types of grinds from wedge to full hollow. Check out this image and see if that helps you.

https://images.app.goo.gl/JZ8bGC7bKCRfD9Ve6

Yeah I've seen that image, but I was under the impression that the more wedge/flat grinds were much thinner at the spine. The way my razor is, I'd say it's maaayyybbeee a quarter hollow. I just don't know if mine is too thick. Would it only work for coarser hair, and not give a very close shave?

Originally Posted by LeviPrince

Yeah I've seen that image, but I was under the impression that the more wedge/flat grinds were much thinner at the spine. The way my razor is, I'd say it's maaayyybbeee a quarter hollow. I just don't know if mine is too thick. Would it only work for coarser hair, and not give a very close shave?

There is a general spine the width (distance from spine contact with the stone to edge of the blade) that you want to find. You want the angle to be in the 17 to 20 degree range (that is total triangle). The way knife people talk about it would be an 8-10 degree bevel angle. There are plenty of places to look it up, but I think it is something like 0.25" thick spine for a 0.75" wide razor. Here is one thread that talks about it.

https://sharprazorpalace.com/general...e-width-2.html

A straight edge razor is honed with the spine on the hone. So, technically the whole blade is the bevel. Regardless of what the grind is, you still have the hone touching the spine and the edge. If your spine is too thick you will never be able to hone it at a sharp enough angle.

By the way, that is a nice looking blade. I got so wrapped up in pretending to be smart I forgot to mention it .

Originally Posted by planeden

There is a general spine the width (distance from spine contact with the stone to edge of the blade) that you want to find. You want the angle to be in the 17 to 20 degree range (that is total triangle). The way knife people talk about it would be an 8-10 degree bevel angle. There are plenty of places to look it up, but I think it is something like 0.25" thick spine for a 0.75" wide razor. Here is one thread that talks about it.

https://sharprazorpalace.com/general...e-width-2.html

A straight edge razor is honed with the spine on the hone. So, technically the whole blade is the bevel. Regardless of what the grind is, you still have the hone touching the spine and the edge. If your spine is too thick you will never be able to hone it at a sharp enough angle.

By the way, that is a nice looking blade. I got so wrapped up in pretending to be smart I forgot to mention it .

Thanks alot for the info and the compliment! So I just remeasured and my blade is 3/16 at the spine with a slight hollow (because of the large wheel size). It's a 3/4 razor so I'm guessing I'd have to put some tape on the spine to get it closer to 1/4" when I hone? Also, because this is more of a quarter hollow would it only be good for coarse hair? And do you know if a 2" wheel would work to give me a full hollow or half hollow?

Close. I don't have the time at the moment to do the math but... A 1" wide blade needs a 1/4 thick spine. Go from there. 4 to 1 is the magic number. So you're in the ballpark. I read a lot of folks use 4 to 6-inch wheels for grinding. But I have never made one so its just what I remember reading. A Razor Maker will be along shortly.

Oh cool, more experiened people showed up. But, the grind should not have any difference on hair texture. Again, regardless of the grind the edge of the blade will be at the same angle. So a wedge and full hollow grind will be equally sharp (all else being equal).

As for the tape question...I'll just say it is a matter of personal preference. The effect on the bevel angle is pretty small. If you have never honed a razor you may want to hire someone to do it. Or if your brother does hone them, give it to him dull and let him do it. It isn't brain surgery, but it takes a bit to learn. I wouldn't try to learn it in a handmade razor that was to be a gift. If you are going to do it yourself, I would definately use tape (3M electrical).

Originally Posted by LeviPrince

I just remeasured and my blade is 3/16 at the spine . It's a 3/4 razor so I'm guessing I'd have to put some tape on the spine... And do you know if a 2" wheel would work to give me a full hollow or half hollow?

If the grind goes all the way to the top of the spine one layer of electrical tape will give you 15.26º which would be what I would personally shoot for. If your grind does not go all the way to the top the angle will be greater. If your brother is new to straights a more obtuse angle may be more appropriate, but I would not go beyond 2 layers.

There is no mathematical rule for what constitutes 1/2 hollow, 1/4 hollow, etc. but with my way of thinking a 5" wheel on a 6/8 razor (leaving a 1/16" or so of spine un ground) would give you a quarter hollow. And a 4" wheel should get you close to a half hollow. The wheel diameters act more true to size as your skill improves. For a full hollow I'd be following the 4" with a 1.5".

The 8" wheel will be a near wedge. I'm personally not fond of heavy grinds, but it should shave fine.

Originally Posted by planeden

...
By the way, that is a nice looking blade. I got so wrapped up in pretending to be smart I forgot to mention it .

Ditto that.

Originally Posted by PaulFLUS

Ditto that.

HEY! The nice looking blade or that I am pretending to be smart?