Summerhill School

[xman]

I know there has been some discussion about the state of education in America and I thought you guys might find Summerhill School of interest.
There's a basic article here.

X

[gugi]

Yes, things like this may work in few limited cases, but I doubt that they can work on a large scale. I'm not sure how they do their selection of students, but achieving above average results is pretty meaningless. Few elite schools are always at the top year after year and it's not their unique system. It's the quality of the teachers plus the selection of the best students that makes that.
As far as setting public policy goes, you've got to take into account the middle, not the ends of the curve.

Case in point: a friend of mine is a teacher at a very small elite high school in Seatle, where he replaced a former top Microsoft executive (after the great success at Microsoft he went on to teach in school for 10 years before moving on to something else). The tuition at that school is higher than at Harvard. Their approach is in many ways similar to that school in X's link and they are extremely successful school.

[Quick Orange]

What a waste. I mean, charming

[azjoe]

My guess would be that they have pretty through screening of candidates prior to admission... whereas the normal US public school has to accept everyone, regardless of their handicaps, abilities, state of mind, and discipline problems. Also, it's a little different at Summerhill which has only 80 students... vs the typical US elementary school with 500-1500 students. Nonetheless, an interesting experimental school with interesting results.

[WireBeard]

It is an interesting approach, exposing young kids to pure, ancient Greek-style democracy and I like their view that education has a higher purpose than just getting a job. However, I also note the deep involvement of the parents and the $20,000 tuition.....

It sounds like they are instilling self-discipline, accountability, and self-determination. I would be interested to see how the curriculum is determined and how they ensure they kids will be able to function (literacy, etc.).


I hope they show it in BBC America.

[WireBeard]

Another alternative education approach is the Waldorf method...started back in 1919. The approach seeks to make the kids well-rounded, better people, not just little "test passing" machines.

Some of the background philosophy from the found, R. Steiner, may seem odd, but nearly a century of amazing results support the approach.

If I had kids, I would send them to a Waldorf school.

[azjoe]

My wife says she was intrigued by some of the alternative education approaches when she was an undergraduate in education... Summerhill was one she remembers. Now that she's much older and has the scars of many years of teaching she still regards the alternative approaches highly, but says she just can't imagine how they could ever work in the mainstream... mostly because of class sizes. Her recollection was that most of the alternative situations had 5-8 kids in a class, whereas the typical US school has 20-30... her point was that it's a lot more difficult to build consensus and share ideas amongst 30 people than 5. But she does embrace the idea that for some students alternative schooling could enable them to break through to success when they're failing in more traditional situations.

I was curious last night as to whether there were any notable Summerhill alumni... google didn't yield many, the few I found were mostly people involved in the arts... actors and musicians. I got the impression from one piece I read that Summerhill students often have to go to traditional school for a couple years to get a high school diploma so they can go to college, and that they often have great difficulty adapting to the traditionally structured ways of high school and college.

[majurey]

I worked for a guy (in my first job in publishing) who went to Summerhill. He was the son of the owner. He was a lazy, unmotivated, over-priviledged a$$hole.

I like the idea of less strutured alternative education, but if it churns out individuals like this then perhaps those institutes are missing something and have gone too far to the extreme?

[bjrn]

I haven't been part of the Dutch schooling system (in uni now and that's a different thing) since I lived Sweden, but my understanding is that Summerhill and the related philosophies are the basis of the current Dutch system, which recently has been getting a lot of flak. Basically what I've been gathering without really following it, it seems many kids need some boundaries and support and not total freedom.

I think it's a fair point that many "alternative" approaches can work well in small classes but might be difficult to adapt to the large classes found in most schools.

Another alternative education approach is the Waldorf method...started back in 1919. The approach seeks to make the kids well-rounded, better people, not just little "test passing" machines.

Some of the background philosophy from the found, R. Steiner, may seem odd, but nearly a century of amazing results support the approach.

"Odd" is putting it lightly. There are some weird ideas there, and certainly some racism as well, although almost (if not all) schools really don't have any hints of that in any way.

I've gone to a Waldorf school, and I'm convinced that it can be great, but it really depends on the people involved in the school. With many of these alternative schools you've got people (teachers and others) involved who are really passionate and that helps a lot, but I've also seen examples of other Waldorf schools which were so-so either through overly dogmatic teachers or other causes. And in some countries there seem to be systematic problems, for instance in the Netherlands the Waldorf schools have a reputation that isn't too good, which at least partially is deserved from what I've been able to gather.

I'm glad I went to the school I did, I without a doubt got a better education than the "normal" schools in my area would have given me. The only criticism would be that the smaller classes mean you get somewhat isolated, and have to make a bit of effort to meet new people (something which would be more automatic at a larger school).

[majurey]

I've gone to a Waldorf school, and I'm convinced that it can be great, but it really depends on the people involved in the school.

Actually, I think this is a great point. In any given education system, it's the staff that make all the difference. There are some state schools here that churn out great results, and some super-priviledged private schools that churn out totaly unremarkable results despite the high fees.

Children respond pretty well to most environments when helped by an adult who is motivated, fair, enthusiastic and understanding.