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I'm ashamed to say I actually used to live here, I couldn't believe it when a friend sent me a copy of this article http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...d-charity.html
Where would we all be without those delightful people who make it their duty to protect us from ourselves?
Regards,
Alex
If everbody is for it, Christians,Jews and Muslims, why would the council be against it? Oh! I guess I should re-read my sig line!:gaah:
The day political correctness became a religion...
They canceled Christmas in Oxford.
They prohibited crucifixes above the door in mayor's offices in Belgium.
One starts to wonder if important people have nothing more important to do than taking such senseless decisions.:shrug:
And dont forget they have taken the 10 commandments out of the courthouses in the U.S..
Not everywhereQuote:
Originally Posted by nun2sharp
Ten Commandments amendment added to bill approved by Oklahoma Senate | Journal Record, The (Oklahoma City) | Find Articles at BNET
They should call it what it is anyway, Saturnalia. Either that or Horus' Birthday
X
I would just point out that, with the exception of the occasional zealot (Madelyn Murray O'Hair comes to mind), there was very little trouble with religious paraphernalia until the religious right began their efforts to take political power in the name of Jesus.
In other words, we're not the ones who politicized religion. When you consider what's happened (think Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell, Jimmy Swaggert), you might understand how a moderate person might look askance at displays of religious material in the public square.
But I'll make you a deal. Stop trying to teach my kids to believe in talking snakes and that the dinosaurs are extinct because Noah forgot 'em, and I'll support your efforts to have your creche.
Okay?
j
Religious paraphernalia was not erected by the modern day demons that haunt your nights, Nord. These monuments often predate them and their ideas. They are not to blame for the fuss. So, who is? The modern sages who have embraced a modern understand of the separation of Church and State. An understanding that would probably like to see no Church and all State. That is another issue though. Too bad they couldn't have told our forefathers, to their face, what imbeciles they were. Crosses above doors? The Ten Commandments in our courts? Horrors.
I'm just waiting for them to deface the Supreme Court's building. There is religion'n'**** up there.
Yes, some of those symbols were put up many years ago, and they remained unmolested until that pack of grifting Pharisees began to lie, cheat, and steal to promote their particular religious cults.Quote:
Originally Posted by Whiggamore
I stand by my statement.
What haunts your nights? It certainly isn't religious freedom.
j
There is very little in the world that grates on my nerves any more than the Sunzabi***es who say, "Let MY conscience be YOUR guide!"
:chop:
No more Christmas for any of youse. I told Santa I’ve been a good boy this year and he died laughing.
Whatever happened to common courtesy?
Your position is that certain individuals, for argument's sake we'll call them Good Guys, started to complain that religious symbols in public places were being removed, attacked, or what have you and that these other individuals, for argument's sake we'll call them Bad Guys, then started to, as you say, molest them? You're arguing effect and cause, not cause and effect?Quote:
Originally Posted by Nord Jim
That may make sense in Backwards Land, but it doesn't make sense here, in Reality. Capitalized for your viewing pleasure.
These Good Guys may be right or wrong, but they're the reactionaries, not the Bad Guys.
So stand away. Stand until your legs are sore.
What haunts my nights? Tools like Hutch that thank every clown that says anything remotely "left". Honestly, you should be limited to one thank you a month.
I agree, attacks on religious holidays are silly. Christmas is as much a secular holiday as a religious holiday.
I think the problem seems to come from the exclusion of other's religious festivities, rather than do away with the Christian holidays, what's the problem with including others? I think the answer should be ours and everyone else's rather than ours or nothing.
Guys lets be careful here. Talk your opinions do not put down others. Or this thread is going bad and out.
Holidays and Beliefs our your own. No one should be involved need to include or not include. What you believe in is for you and no one else to say right or wrong. When people or body's of people find it to intrude on this it is wrong.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hutch
Thanks for the personal attack.Quote:
Originally Posted by Whiggamore
When small minds have nothing intelligent to say the resort to personal attacks, this has been the the tactic of the Social Conservatives (formerly the Republican Party) for the last 10 years.
I don't look at Nords post as "left" they are basically a position I agree with, until the Social Conservatives (Religious Right) started their quest to turn the country in to a theocracy, most didn't care about religion being interspersed with the government. They have shown themselves as the party of intolerance and bigotry and those symbols are being used by them to add religion to politics. So its not cause and effect, its the unintended consequence of intolerant groups trying to take over a country.
I'll thank who I want and when I want, despite bullys like yourself.
If I were a council member I would have proposed to use the truthful name 'The Big Winter Shopping'.Quote:
Oxford city council confirmed the events in the city would be renamed 'Winter Light Festival' to make them more inclusive, provoking outrage among shoppers in the city who called for a return to tradition.
As far as I'm concerned decorating a tree, depleting your bank account or even worse increasing your debt is not a celebration of Christmas. When I want to give gifts I generally don't need a day or a season that the society has deemed appropriate for that.
Of course, you can easily tell that I have no kids.
Well said but yea you dont have kids lolQuote:
Originally Posted by gugi
I'm not quite sure what you're getting at.Quote:
Originally Posted by Don
Are you saying it is wrong to enjoy someone else celebrations, and learn about them?
I have no problem when some wishes me a Merry Christmas, or my Jewish friends wish me a Happy Hanukkah, or my Indian friends wish me Happy Diwali, these are important things to them and they choose to include me I take that as a compliment.
I think the argument is that there are public displays of religious holidays, in North America they are mostly Christian, what is the problem with allowing other religions to have public displays if they wish to have them?
I take no offense to Christmas, the winter solstice, Chanukah, Kwanza or what have you. I do take offense to Halloween egg nog (yes it now exists) and things like Christmas Creep where the trees come out before Halloween! Lately it's become all about spending which isn't really the meaning... the true meaning is about GIVING and spreading goodwill amongst your fellow man.
I fail to see how bickering amongst ourselves is spreading goodwill.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hutch
No what I am saying is you can enjoy what ever you want and so can everyone else. And if someone chooses not to recognize other beliefs that is their free choice. This country was founded in Christianity but it allows all to choose with out persecution from others. Your beliefs are yours
Very well said spreading goodwill should cross all beliefsQuote:
Originally Posted by AaronX
Hutch, you're welcome. It had nothing to do with your ideas and everything to do with the incessant thanking you do around here. I suppose that just makes me a, shudder, conservateur. Yeah, a conservative in French. Dum, dum, dum!
The answer to your question? "In North America they are mostly Christian."Quote:
I think the argument is that there are public displays of religious holidays, in North America they are mostly Christian, what is the problem with allowing other religions to have public displays if they wish to have them?
I draw the line at Egg Nog, I find it very offensive actually the term would be vile.:eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by AaronX
I guess its your job to police the thanking, and calling me a "tool" was only about my thanking too often. Considering I have thanked 30 times and you have thanked 35 and I've been here longer and have more post. Who "thanks" too much? More rightwing spin, fast and loose with the truth.Quote:
Originally Posted by Whiggamore
Hey, see the badge? They don't hand these out in boxes of cereal.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hutch
Had you simply thanked 30 times, that'd be fine. But you did not. You did it with all this complexity, thanking for all the wrong things. Now, I had to thank the people who said my wife looked nice. Then I had to make a point.
But, you're not the Judge. Next time, check the legislation before you go Thanking like crazy. Motherthanker. Honestly, what is happening to our children?
I'll tell you what... they don't pray before class anymore.
Yes in North America they are mostly Christian, that what I said in my post. So what is the problem including others celebrations and symbols, other than the fact many of the religious right feel it will take away from theirs, just like gays getting married somehow effects their marriages.Quote:
Originally Posted by Whiggamore
The religious right were upset with the inclusion of Wiccan on soldiers graves.
Because, in North America they are mostly Christian. Not the celebrations, but the people. Majority rules, man. It isn't fair, but life isn't fair. Same reason why in say, Saudi Arabia, you don't celebrate Christmas.
Or maybe you do. I never went there.
Wiccan symbols on graves? Well, the desecration of Christian cemeteries upsets me, too.
Which Badge might that be?Quote:
Originally Posted by Whiggamore
And you are the Judge I guess?
Which Legislation would that be?
I guess I'll ask you what the right things are to thank for.
So everyone who isn't a Christian has less rights than you, I see. I'm glad you made your position so clear. The majority are white too, right.Quote:
Originally Posted by Whiggamore
The soldiers give there life so you can enjoy your freedom, but you have no problem trampling on theirs, big of you.