Is making/having money a bad thing on SRP?

I didn't read the other thread, and am not going to read ALL of this one. but will give my opinion.

there are assholes in every income bracket. I think as far as people that get windfalls, many that get the BIG money, lose it real fast too. plain and simple, being rich isn't for everybody. some people have no idea what to do with it. not saying that I do by the way, but let's just say Chandler would be under exclusive contract.

In my experience, the most annoying, grating people are the ones that are really just upper middle class. the ones that make the quarter million a year, maybe more. but they're not truly wealthy. the truly wealthy, they're the ones that are still spending right now when the economy is tuff.

the problem with the ones that make good money but aren't really wealthy, they want to pretend, they want to put on airs. even the ones that aren't jerks can stometimes behave aloof because of that feeling that they need to act like they're rich.

for instance, my mom has friends, the husband is an attorney, the wife is a lucky woman that came from a working family, got an art degree and her highest paying job was a bank teller. but she is sweet, don't get me wrong. they're both good people. I was in their wedding. BUT, he makes enough that they live on the "lake" (man made at nice development.) so they are pretentious. Like eating at the golf course all the time, and him liking the few hundred dollar bottles of wine talking about how much difference there is, him being able to taste the difference etc. the funny part, the money is hit and miss, depends on the cases. so sometimes they're eating at taco bell to conserve money. things like that. that is what gets on the nerves, when people are pretentious, go fancy places and live it up but don't really have the money to live the lifestyle.

I like people that have lots of money but are really cool. I was talking to a coworker that is actually really a great lady, very sweet, but her husband is a doctor (she's a nurse practitioner actually) and makes good money, really good, in the 7 figures. they belong to a yacht club, had a <40ft. motor yacht. they sold it and are looking for another one. we were tlaking one time about it and I mentioned a friend of my dad's who used to have an 85ft. sail yacht. I don't know if I just hit a button or what but she made a comment about oh, she'd never own one, they were too slow blah blah, very snooty tone. I killed it fast with the comment,"he never cared, he just flew in on his plane wherever he wanted to meet it."

King Air and sail yacht trump small yacht I guess. :D

none of that probably mattered to the thread, but was an attempt to illustrate the attitudes that I do find irritating, from non-jerk people that have "some" money. I've met really cool rich people, and really big jerk people with no money.

BUT I will say that most people I've known that were truly poor, I mean poor not just can't afford new cars etc., I'm talking about barely can afford to eat, live ina shack built on the side of a barn. most of them have been very kind people, good people. and they know how to really enjoy life, to be happy with nothing. lots of them have close knit families, do more together than peop;le that could afford to go on vacations, go to restaurants and so on.

as for me, as i'm sure so many people wonder about the other guy behind the keyboard, and especially about their buying power when it comes to the auctions. I'm not even true middle class. I'm middle class by common definition. but my wife said real middle class is something like one person could be out of work for two months and they don't have to change their lifestyle. that's not us. we live, like 99% of Americans, at the limit of our means. I'm an information systems analyst/technician, my wife a special ed teacher. we do well together, have a nice house, two cars with payments still. we're at limit evey month. part of it though is the kids, a 3yo and a 18mo old. the cost of childcare alone would get me great razors etc.

I do have a thing for collecting, great vices which I indulge well. so my extra income does get used on nice things.

I'll make you all a promise though, if I"m ever rich I won't compete against you on any livi razors ;)

Red

So, first of all my apologies for not participating more in the discussion I started. :)

Second, thank you all for sharing your views. I think (almost) all of you got a thanks, and I just want to say thank you for popping in and adding. Whether I agree is another story. :D I'll respond to a few things, but please don't feel ignored if I don't include your view. ;)


Regarding personal finances, I think I've been fairly lucky. First one in my family to get a university degree, moving around internationally, all the good stuff. Paid resonably well, playing in the front of the field, all that blah blah. Brain work though, but I think that brain and manual work both have their value. A skilled craftsman deserves a good income as well as a skilled "brainworker".

Money-wise, I admire people who have been able to make a difference in their field and make a success out of what they do, including the financial reward. This applies to someone "running the show" in a manual labour field (think of Livi), as well as the brain work. Some people, like Red in the post above, talk about the "show" some people have. I think the other side, this "false modesty" is as bad. On the other hand, I don't really care. I can taste differences between expensive wines and enjoy fancy food. But a pitcher of beer with a dish of overspiced chicken wings is just as much fun, right? ;)

If I manage to have some (more) coherent thoughts, I'll do my best to formulate a few. :)

My wife and i are both 1rst generation American. Even though I am a teacher, my wife until last December was a vibrant and high achieving part of the buisness world. Her rise and meeting so many people in the small buisness community gave me a perspective on how many oppurtunities this country affords ordinary people when motivated. No not to be Bill Gates, or Warren Buffet, but true and real oppurtunity.I hope that does not change.....
If you learn one thing is that free advice given by a member earlier from the finacial buisness about living within your means. My sweetie got very sick and has been medically retired since December and living on a modest teacher's salary. If we "lived la vida loca" we would never have been able to get through this time. Rich is appreciating your health and living within your means and still getting a good shave.
Mike

Money does not make people bad/jerks, jealousy does. People are "that way" before they get money and people who don't have or wish they had money despise those who have it.

I make my living in an industry that thrives on excess. Restaurants and Hospitality. When you go on vacation to a place like, oh I don't know, Florida, where I live, you don't want to pull in to a hotel or nice restaurant and say "Oh honey, isn't it adequate?" Of course not. Sure there are economical versions of everything but you get what you pay for. So the people who work in the biz are around it all day and then when they go home they think they should have it too. It doesn't mean you're a bad person.

It works like that until you leave the industry or, in my case, you get laid off and take a position making 1/4 of what you made before. I adjusted my priorities. I'm not wealthy and I don't live in a huge house. I struggle to put gas in my truck from the 1980's.

But I will never, ever call myself poor.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Kingfish

Rich is appreciating your health and living within your means and still getting a good shave.
Mike

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I think this encapsulates it for me. It's not the money you have but how you live your life that makes all the difference. You can be poor or broke and still be a jerk because you're not happy with what you have. Let's all just enjoy ourselves here and like Lynn always says "Have Fun!"

I'm surprised ReardenSteel hasn't joined the convo. This is the stuff Ayn Rand spoke of...

I completely agree that there are all kinds of people in all income ranges!
This summer I am working as a rafting-guide and it is a great chance to meet all kinds of people. We have lived at one of the girls parents house quite a few weekends and they are really well off, (3 new SUV's, Porche and lexus, big house and nice cabin) but they are also some of the nicest people I have ever met. Down to earth, interesting and all that.
Another friend of mine is a college-student and every time anyone visited he would keep nagging about how we were sitting in HIS couch, HIS this and that. He was far from well off and kind of a jerk about things.

I think the important thing is to try to be generous and welcoming regardless of income and so on.
Right now anyone is welcome to come and stay in my tent, if I ever get a mansion I hope I will have the same attitude.

Making money is not a bad thing. There are however a couple of things that really annoy me about the way some people make their money.

Over the last 2/3 years, there has been a loanshark agency called 'Leemans Credits'. They are headed by an elderly lady whose catchphrase is 'Getting a loan with Mrs. Leemans is like getting a loan from a friend. Call me'.

Their commercials always follow the same pattern: you hear a conversation of 2 persons who actually sound like trash. In the conversation, they'll say things like 'I want a sparkling holiday' or 'I want a big tv' or 'I want to hand out ridiculous christmas presents' and of course, they have no money. Cue Mrs. Leemans telling them that she has the solution. 'If you get a >2500 euro loan this summer, you'll get a free bottle of fizzy wine'

:soapbox::soapbox::soapbox:

Imo this is just preying on the weak and the poor. If they had the financial room for making monthly payments, they wouldn't have needed to loan money. They'd have saved up and avoided the significant interest. And if they already have money issues, then getting a loan for a tv, new couch or a megabucks holiday is NOT a good idea. She pretends to be a friend... well, friends don't talk each other into buying stuff they cannot afford.
I'm sure that what she does is perfectly legal. But that doesn't make it honorable to prey upon people.

Hell has a circle for people like her.

Just wanted to say that I did not think, not even for once, about how much anybody was doing around here, ne ver occured to me, as why would I do that?

And as to the issue of "having money makes you a bad person", I disagree. I know personally good and bad examples of poor and rich people, and of course, If I can choose, I rather have money. I am not rich but any means, nor even close, but cannot consider myself poor, quite the opposite, I am very lucky to have just enough to give me and my family quite a nice life...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Hillie

So, first of all my apologies for not participating more in the discussion I started. :)

Second, thank you all for sharing your views. I think (almost) all of you got a thanks, and I just want to say thank you for popping in and adding. Whether I agree is another story. :D I'll respond to a few things, but please don't feel ignored if I don't include your view. ;)


Regarding personal finances, I think I've been fairly lucky. First one in my family to get a university degree, moving around internationally, all the good stuff. Paid resonably well, playing in the front of the field, all that blah blah. Brain work though, but I think that brain and manual work both have their value. A skilled craftsman deserves a good income as well as a skilled "brainworker".

Money-wise, I admire people who have been able to make a difference in their field and make a success out of what they do, including the financial reward. This applies to someone "running the show" in a manual labour field (think of Livi), as well as the brain work. Some people, like Red in the post above, talk about the "show" some people have. I think the other side, this "false modesty" is as bad. On the other hand, I don't really care. I can taste differences between expensive wines and enjoy fancy food. But a pitcher of beer with a dish of overspiced chicken wings is just as much fun, right? ;)

If I manage to have some (more) coherent thoughts, I'll do my best to formulate a few. :)

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Hillie,

Its an interesting thread you bring up (and Big Red thanks for your post too, I can very much relate to your points made). I am sorry to join the discussion so late, but I would like to add a few thoughts. At first glance, one might say Hillie, you're rich and your a freakin ladies man to boot, what more do you want? Certainly you should not care about what a bunch of anonymous yahoos on the internet think of you. But its of course deeper than that.

In certain ways we are similar. Like you, I put myself thru school and was the first person in my family to graduate from college, let alone med school. I did not have anyone in the medical profession in my family to show me what being a doctor was like, I had to enlist in the army as a medic in an infantry division to learn that. In the Army, I had a chance to meet a lot of different people, mostly poor people from appalachia or inner cities like detroit or philadelphia, who basically saw the army as a way to escape from the ghetto or other forms of poverty. It really gave me an appreciation and identification with the poorer and less empowered people in our society, and I suppose thats why politically I am on the liberal side of the spectrum.

In my professional life, I come across people all the time who have had a much easier time of things than I did, having their parents support them thru school or use their connections to get them into ivy league schools, etc. When I was younger and less mature, I used to have a chip on my shoulder with such people. But that did not last long. I realize that rich people, or poor people, they are all human beings and no one is more or less worthy than anyone else based on how much they make.

I could make twice what I am making now and working half the time I do each week if I had decided to go into private practice rather than going into academics and do research. But I find the work fullfilling and if I can make one good discovery it could help more people than a person could see individually in their lifetime. I feel extremely lucky to have the opportunity to do what I am doing, and it really is that I love my job, not the money. But I am not starving and feel very fortunate for being able to make a comfortable living too.

Every year, I help select which students get into our dermatology residency program, and we interview a lot of them. Many simply are out to have an cushy private practice job and make a lot of money, others try to tell me that they really like to forgo that, stay in academics and want to be a teacher like me. I would say two thirds of the ones who say they want to be an academic just end up going into private practice and inject botox do face lifts and make tons of money, doing very little teaching or research at all. Only about a third actually go into full time academics, and I consider that lucky because of the enormous draw of the increased money in the private sector. It just seems that making a lot of money can be a big thing to some people, and others have motivations in other directions. I think a lot of what makes people choose one way or the other is their previous life history, role models, etc. and their impressions of what would be fullfilling or what would not be fulfilling.

Finally, to finally close this subject, I should mention that I was listening to the song Richard Cory by Simon and Garfunkel the other day (variation on that is a song called "Lucky Man" by Emerson Lake and Palmer) and it reminded me that money does not really buy happiness or at least long term satisfaction in life and that being rich is really nothing someone should be envious of another person for.

Anyway, thats my two bits.

Pete

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They say that richard cory owns one half of this whole town,
With political connections to spread his wealth around.
Born into society, a bankers only child,
He had everything a man could want: power, grace, and style.

But I work in his factory
And I curse the life Im living
And I curse my poverty
And I wish that I could be,
Oh, I wish that I could be,
Oh, I wish that I could be
Richard cory.

The papers print his picture almost everywhere he goes:
Richard cory at the opera, richard cory at a show.
And the rumor of his parties and the orgies on his yacht!
Oh, he surely must be happy with everything hes got.

But I work in his factory
And I curse the life Im living
And I curse my poverty
And I wish that I could be,
Oh, I wish that I could be,
Oh, I wish that I could be
Richard cory.

He freely gave to charity, he had the common touch,
And they were grateful for his patronage and thanked him very much,
So my mind was filled with wonder when the evening headlines read:
Richard cory went home last night and put a bullet through his head.

But I work in his factory
And I curse the life Im living
And I curse my poverty
And I wish that I could be,
Oh, I wish that I could be,
Oh, I wish that I could be
Richard cory.