If a tree falls in the forest..you're gonna hate this one.

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Originally Posted by richmondesi

If you see the light from a star, is there really a star?

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Hypothetically, when viewing stars that are from waaaaay out on the edge of our percievable universe, the light has travelled for billions of years, and there is a good chance that the star indeed no longer exists.

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Originally Posted by richmondesi

Sound is defined as :
The free dictionary

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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=8 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Vibrations transmitted through an elastic solid or a liquid or gas, with frequencies in the approximate range of 20 to 20,000 hertz, capable of being detected by human organs of hearing </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

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I think sound is being confused with communication by some here. Communication requires someone to receive the message. Sound just needs to be capable of being heard (not heard necessarily). If a deaf man stands was standing close enough to the fallen tree to feel all the vibrations, but didn't hear it, does it not make a sound?

The fact that we observe something does not make it so, either. We see stars in the night sky every night that burned out millions of years ago (according to scientists). So, some of the stars no longer exist even though we "see" them... Human observance or nonobservance is not required for something to "really" happen.

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Aha!

By the very definition you quoted about it states detection by human organs of hearing as part of the quality of sound.

Thus, if no human is around to detect the sounds.....

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Originally Posted by Seraphim

Aha!

By the very definition you quoted about it states detection by human organs of hearing as part of the quality of sound.

Thus, if no human is around to detect the sounds.....

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No, Sir. You need to reread that. It says capable of being heard. That's not the same thing.

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Originally Posted by richmondesi

No, Sir. You need to reread that. It says capable of being heard. That's not the same thing.

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How will one know if it is capable of being heard unless someone can hear it?

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Originally Posted by Seraphim

How will one know if it is capable of being heard unless someone can hear it?

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They won't. Isn't that basically the original question ;)

It makes a sound whether anyone is there to hear it or not.

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Originally Posted by Seraphim

How will one know if it is capable of being heard unless someone can hear it?

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The same way we know you don't vanish into thin air when you log off of SRP. We know it makes a sound irrespective of direct observation. Sounds do not require detection/observation to be sounds. We know because every time a person has seen a tree fall they've heard a sound. Observing and detecting sound is totally passive. The presence of a person doesn't cause sound that otherwise wouldn't exist.

By capable I believe it refers to dBA and Freq.

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Originally Posted by richmondesi

The same way we know you don't vanish into thin air when you log off of SRP. We know it makes a sound irrespective of direct observation. Sounds do not require detection/observation to be sounds. We know because every time a person has seen a tree fall they've heard a sound. Observing and detecting sound is totally passive. The presence of a person doesn't cause sound that otherwise wouldn't exist.

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You only have data for when someone is present. All the rest is hand waving and conjecture!


And how do you know I don't vanish into thin air?

The screen persona known as Seraphim is actually a rather crude computer program that spews forth random statements, assertions, bombast, empty rhetoric, etc.

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Originally Posted by Seraphim

You only have data for when someone is present. All the rest is hand waving and conjecture!


And how do you know I don't vanish into thin air?

The screen persona known as Seraphim is actually a rather crude computer program that spews forth random statements, assertions, bombast, empty rhetoric, etc.

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My whole life I've been monitoring this question. I've had cameras and recording devices in every major forest in the world and have captured thousands of falling trees on them. They all made a sound

Now, stop being silly :p