Protesting in Wisconsin....Just the beginning?

I think theres going to be more and more of this over the next 2-3 years. We've all borrowed far too much money from each other (countries, banks, governments and individuals) and everyone is going to end up paying through the nose for a long time to clear all the debt off.

I fully appreciate that not everyone was recklessly borrowing, but the nature of the beast is that we're all going to be taxed until the pips squeak as a result.

Our government has recently said that public sector workers (who tend to, on average, get pretty good pensions) are going to have to work longer and get less of a pension when they retire. Asa reuslt the teachers are now talking about strike action this summer.

What ****es me off in Ohio is that Kasich is part of the reason for the short falls right now. He helped get the state to reinvest the pension funds into Lehman brothers mortgage backed securities and is now blaming the unions.

Personally, I think public employees being public servants after all should be... well.... servants. That's how they should be treated. If they don't like that let them quit and work on the outside. They should never earn more than any private employee or ever have any benefits better then any private employee. We should probably pay them the minimum wage afterall we pay their salaries.

These teachers are the biggest crybabies of them all. heck when I went to college and we needed some easy A's we'd take those Education Courses. Then they get months off with summer vacation and all the time off during the year and work short days. I think we should cut their salaries in half or when they aren't working make them clean the streets or put them on a road crew building highways.

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Originally Posted by thebigspendur

Personally, I think...

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I have to disagree They should work for free if they really love their country

There was someone quoted within the last few days on a news site who said something to the effect that it was maybe a bit surprising that it took several years longer for the government sector to catch up to the private sector in regard to economic crunch and how it has impacted so many.

The loss of rights, the loss of union power to defend workers, etc. Right, wrong or otherwise, to me the issue is very simply that the bad economy and massive debt repercussions have broken into the government sector now whereas many of us in the private sector have been affected by this for years now.

I can understand the screaming of the protesters (not the death threats), I really can, but as someone in the private sector, again, this has been a reality for many of us for some time now.

Rather than have this mentality about it: :boohoo:, my feeling toward the government sector is simply: "Sorry, we no longer have the resources to support those who work in government to the level that we've supported in the past. It's a reality, period.


Chris L

I am not a fan of Public Sector Unions, I am all for unions in the private sector if employees want to organize. What bothers me is that after Nafta and Gatt as well as the "replacement worker" has destroyed the union in America. No matter your viewpoint we are quickly moving back 100 years to a time when there were two classes of people. There were the "robber barons" and then there were the rest of us turds in the bowl. Without Unions there will be no middle class. I remember the strikes of the early 1970's when inflation was rampant, if not for the strikes keeping wages up the middle class would have been wiped out. We have had inflation rear its ugly head again in the last few years but now there is no one to protect us. Without strong unions your employer will pay you in "cheaper dollars" until he is paying you nothing,


BTW A CEO way back in the 60's would make 51x what a worker on the floor would, now its over 540x.

well I am not sure what the national news has shown but the bill has been split. The collective barganing has been voted on as a seperate issue and has been passed. They did not need the democrats for this special vote because it did not have a financial impact. Now they can vote on the rest of the budget.

What people have to realize is that state by state and city by city things are different for public employees. I can tell you that I pay 25% of my healthcare and also contribute a considerable amount to my pension system. I also have to work 32 years and be at least 55 years old before I can collect my full pension, which will be 80%.

Most pension abuse problems come at the hands of the politicians who find a loophole (they're all lawyers so it isn't hard) and after serving one term retire and collect a full pension. Then when people find out and are up in arms they agree that there should be pension reform...and go after the public employees and blame them.

Again, these benefits that we do have were bargained for and agreed upon by both parties. I think most of us can agree that we're in this mess because of the excesses of those at the top, not the working class. Don't let them get away with blaming the workers like they are and they skate free. We've all been divided against each other long enough. It's time to put our petty differences aside and turn our attention to those who are really at fault. United we stand, divided we beg!!

John

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Originally Posted by nun2sharp

BTW A CEO way back in the 60's would make 51x what a worker on the floor would, now its over 540x.

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Very different marginal tax rates back then than today. But I suppose that's just a small part of keeping America safe from socialism.

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Originally Posted by knightwolf

well I am not sure what the national news has shown but the bill has been split. The collective barganing has been voted on as a seperate issue and has been passed. They did not need the democrats for this special vote because it did not have a financial impact. Now they can vote on the rest of the budget.

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pretty smart eh :)

now the question is whether that is going to end up as political gain or political liability for the republicans. they're obviously betting that with more corporate money for them and less union money for the opposition the voters would be swayed by the more expensive/better advertising.

i wonder whether the public employees would just go for bankrupting the state. supposedly the reason to kill their collective bargaining power is so that the past contracts can be unilaterally amended, but there's still the rule of the law and it takes a bankruptcy to cancel a debt.