Masonic Lodges

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Originally Posted by jjpharris

Sorry to hear of your bad experience with Freemasonry, FP. Isn't it true though that every organization has it's faults as well it's bad apples?? How about the church, or every government, or any corporation, or anyone in history who has held power?? Do we condemn all people because of the few who choose to operate without decency??

Hmmmm, maybe we shouldn't lump everyone in the same narrow minded point of view. I am also a Mason, and I take great pride in my charitable works as well as an active interest in my community. I am sure that others here do as well.

I have never once regretted joining a Masonic Lodge or its appellate bodies, rather I consider it one of the best and most honorable things I have ever done with my life. I have met so many good and life-long friends there. I would recommend it to any man who lives his life with morality and respect for his fellowman. I am proud of the mostly positve "light" freemasonry is represented in here at SRP.

Of course it's just MHO.

Proud Freemason and straight razor user,

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Hello, there!
It wasn't my objective to rant at any of the free-masons here... I see that you all have a very positive atitude towards the whole thing. And you should know... you are part of lodges and comprehend the full extent of what Masonry is... I was only ranting at the Portuguese Masonry, probably out of touch with american Mansonry... I also have to agree with you, jjpharris, that indeed my view is, perhaps, narrow-minded. But I know nothing of your masonry, you see. I only know what is said (by trust-worthy people) about the portuguese masonry and we all can see the results...
I sincerely believe that the ideals are good and that the institutions can be good. But yes... there are bad seeds everywhere... I like your way of putting things. Spoken like a true free-mason I suppose? :hmmm:
Take care!

There are many organizations who have lain claim to the title of "Freemason" and there have been many scandals throughout history, both with actual lodges and with spurious lodges. There are many, many groups not recognized by the main global bodies of Freemasonry, specifically because they are involved in politics or influence peddaling/corruption or becasue they do not follow the basic tents of Freemasonry.

This link is to the Grand Lodge for Portugal. It appears that it was founded to distinguish itself from some of the other organizations claiming to be Freemasons, possibley due to the points you noted. It also has had a name change since its founding.

Grande Loja Legal de Portugal / GLRP

Here is the link for the United Grand Lodges of England. While there is no single global Grand Lodge, the UGLE is recognized as one of the earliest organized lodges and a great deal of the structure and standards came from this organization. It is a good place to start if you are not sure about a organization in your region using the name "Freemason".

http://http://www.ugle.org.uk/provin...es/olodges.htm

I hope this helps. Also, do not worry about offending any of the Masons here....I am sure we have all run into similar situations. In my view, the best response is to provide as much information as possible and allow each person to decide for themsleves.

:tu

Greg

Well said Greg. And I didn't mean YOU wre narrow-minded FP. I meant that it's narrow- minded to assume that everyone in a particular group act or behave the same way. Just as I don't believe everyone shaves or lathers their face the same way.

You are correct Greg, we Freemasons are used to lively debates, no offence taken or directed towards any member here I hope.

Interstingly enough, it is still dangerous in some places to be known as a Freemason. The website for the recently re-established Grand Lodge of Russia list most of the officers only by their first names.

When I was in Moscow, it was very difficult to make contact with them without a reference. I did not wear my Masonic ring at work. There is a lot of opinion regarding the organization still left over from the Soviet Union. Freemasons are not popular with extremists of any kind (I guess the Liberty, Equality, Fraternity thing makes them choke on their morning orange juice....)

I got to know a brother from the Ukraine and he was also very secretive about Freemasonry. I guess he never got used to the fact that America was more tolerant than Russia. Or maybe he concealed the fact because you never know what might happen here in the future.

He did tell me that there are a lot of Freemasons there. They practice the Craft in private homes in small groups. One thing that I found contradictory and a bit hypocritical was that a lot of high ranking government officials there were also Freemasons. I never did understand that. Sadly, I also don't see him anymore to ask him questions.

A lot of people don't know that Freemasons were persecuted by Nazi Germany. They could be found in consentration camps along with the Jews and others. They actually had lodges there in secret. They were some of the first people rounded up by the SS. Hitler found them an extreme threat because of their beliefs.

Just a little FYI.

Maybe I misread or misunderstood. I was just wondering... why cant an atheist join? If your choice of religion is no relation on your successful admission. It just confuses me. And what about agnostics? Can you be agnostic and join? :thinking: :shrug:

I once stayed a week in a bed and breakfast (B&B) and a fellow guest was a Mason. After sveral long conversations and bottles of wine in the living room, he told me I was "exactly the type of man that would be an outstanding Mason". I tried changing the subject but he kept hammering me on it. He repeatedly said, "If you want to be a Mason, ask one". I continued trying to change the subject. He continued telling me to ask him how I could be a Mason. Finally I said, I belong to the Groucho Marx school of club membership. As Groucho said, "I will never belong to any club that would have someone like me as a member". He responded by telling me the Masons aren't a club. I went to my room.

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Originally Posted by sidneykidney

Maybe I misread or misunderstood. I was just wondering... why cant an atheist join? If your choice of religion is no relation on your successful admission. It just confuses me. And what about agnostics? Can you be agnostic and join? :thinking: :shrug:

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The rule regarding atheism was one of the basic rules put in place back in the 17th-18th century, when the various rules weer being standardized and codified. Then, an atheist was viewed as amoral, untrustworthy, etc. as they could not be held to an oath. Now, people have more open views regarding this.

A larger aspect of the issue is the very nature of Freemasonry's philosophy, whereby men come together in Unity under the auspices of a Supreme Being (however they may personally understand the concept and by whichever name the use for it) for a common struggle for the Divine (however they may understand it) and to work against those things that divide us (our families, communities, nations) as we discover them in ourselves. Thus, someone who does not believe in the Divine would not be happy or contented in the organization. That being said, I have never heard a Mason disparage someone for being an Atheist, with regard to their moral character or quality oas a person.

A friend of mine asked the same question and I said: "If you don't like to sing, why join the choir?"

An agnostic theist would be accepted, for while they do not claim to know the existence of a Supreme being, they believe in such an existence, and can answer the question in the affirmative.

Greg :)

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Originally Posted by icedog

I once stayed a week in a bed and breakfast (B&B) and a fellow guest was a Mason. After sveral long conversations and bottles of wine in the living room, he told me I was "exactly the type of man that would be an outstanding Mason". I tried changing the subject but he kept hammering me on it. He repeatedly said, "If you want to be a Mason, ask one". I continued trying to change the subject. He continued telling me to ask him how I could be a Mason. Finally I said, I belong to the Groucho Marx school of club membership. As Groucho said, "I will never belong to any club that would have someone like me as a member". He responded by telling me the Masons aren't a club. I went to my room.

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Did he sell cars by chance? That is not how the conversation should have gone. There should have been a discussion about Masonry, what it is, what it does, history, etc. and then he should have advised you that to join, all you have to do is ask a Mason or contact your local Lodge. End of discussion. As I said earlier, as with any organization made up of people, you get all kinds of people. I'm sure he was excited abut the possibility of a new member....but recruiting is not one of the things we do. Some grand Lodges have encouraged awareness building to help boost membership (competing against longer owrk hours, both parents working, after school activities with the kids, etc.), but I doubt they want anyone to feel they have just bought some aluminum siding.....
;)

Greg

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Originally Posted by icedog

I once stayed a week in a bed and breakfast (B&B) and a fellow guest was a Mason. After sveral long conversations and bottles of wine in the living room, he told me I was "exactly the type of man that would be an outstanding Mason". I tried changing the subject but he kept hammering me on it. He repeatedly said, "If you want to be a Mason, ask one". I continued trying to change the subject. He continued telling me to ask him how I could be a Mason.

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Originally Posted by WireBeard

That is not how the conversation should have gone. There should have been a discussion about Masonry, what it is, what it does, history, etc. and then he should have advised you that to join, all you have to do is ask a Mason or contact your local Lodge. End of discussion.

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I'm guessing the bottles of wine were as long (if not longer) than the conversations? ;)