Newsprint on Glass

I've been using my razor for about 2 months now --just stropping before and after each shave. The shaves have been very good but the razor seemed to need a touchup on a paddle strop , maybe with some chromium oxide. Well I own neither, so having heard that newsprint has a slight abrasive action, I taped some newsprint to a pane of glass and started to work on the razor. I used the typical stropping motion and put about 1000+ strokes on the razor. I could tell that the edge of razor was more polished and uniform. So I stropped it up on a hanging strop and tested out the shave ---the shave was definately better. It usually would take me two passes on the cheeks to get a smooth result but this time only one was needed. Overall. it was probably the best shave I've had yet. So, if all you have is some glass and newsprint, then try it out and see how it works for you.

Justin

It's substantially faster if you stretch the newspaper tight and use a honing (edge-first action), but you've got to get the paper nice and flat...

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Originally Posted by mparker762

It's substantially faster if you stretch the newspaper tight and use a honing (edge-first action), but you've got to get the paper nice and flat...

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thanks--I'll try that next time ---


Justin

Wow - never heard that one before. Thanks guys. :tu Kind of puts into perspective honing on a stone: if newsprint can sharpen up an edge, imagine what's going on on a hone! No wonder a light touch is required!

James.

I read about using newspaper for just this reason on the forum of straightedgerazor.com I wasn't sure if it would actually work or not - nice to know that it should work. I know you did ~1000 roundtrips...do you think you actually have to do that many? How long did that take you?

As with everything else, YMMV. The better the initial edge, the fewer laps you need. It also helps to make sure there's a big photo on the section of newsprint you're using.

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Originally Posted by Razorburne

I read about using newspaper for just this reason on the forum of straightedgerazor.com I wasn't sure if it would actually work or not - nice to know that it should work. I know you did ~1000 roundtrips...do you think you actually have to do that many? How long did that take you?

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I'm new to this so I don't even know how many strokes you would use on a pasted paddle strop. I used a pane of glass that was about 8" x 12" --so each stroke was about 10". I guess it took me about 1 hour . Before I started, I could see slight irregular reflections on the blade edge when it was held in light ---I kept checking the blade this way -and the blade edge seemed very uniform at around 1000 round trips. Evidently this can be improved if you use the edge first method as in honing. The results weren't dramatic but noticeable. I think it is worth a go if you don't have the full gear available to you.

Justin

That's an interesting point. There are quite a few things out there with abrasive properties that may not be very obvious.

One case in point. I built (copied an existing unit that they supplied to me) some machines used to grind styrofoam into a smaller dust like state. This dust is then added to a binder liquid which is sprayed on building beams and girders to protect them from heat annealing during a fire. The company I built them for had an away team buying up lots of styrofoam all over the world to grind for this purpose. Some areas gave it to them for free, as they had no other good use for it. Anyway, back to the point. The grinders consisted of 250 carbide tipped skil-saw blades modified with a D3" keyed center hole mounted on a 3" shaft driven by a 15HP synchronous motor. Effectively, it was a 2 1/2' wide array of saw blades (very scary). There was an adjustable block of consumable aluminum that could be forced into the blade. The blades would cut a round into the aluminum, then the block would be backed off to maintain a gap of ~0.050-0.075". The styrofoam was then fed by conveyor into this gap and was ground by the blades against the aluminum.

The interesting point is that the blades would wear down and have to be replaced far more often than expected. The reason? It wasn't the carbide cutting into the aluminum (that's like a hot blade through butter), it was the extremely abrasive nature of styrofoam. Turns out, it's one of the most abrasive materials going. It isn't known for this at all, mainly because it crumbles and compresses under normal use. But, in our grinder, the carbide was forced to come into contact with it constantly, and it really wore it down.

Just my $0.02, on something that I found very interesting.

Take care- John

Damn interesting, John. I guess everything has an abrasive action --makes me want to take a closer look at things.


Justin

Think of all the beer coolers I've wasted:roflmao

You know, now that you say that... Not that you might want to (unless you're camping or on a multi-day tailgate party, but could you strop against a flat styrofoam surface? I bet you there would be some draw.

Remember those pictures of the Grand Canyon? It was all done by water. Put a straight under some running water and in about 1000 years or so you'll have a great edge. Now how many laps would that be? Lets see...

I would wager that the rate of wear to the carbide was more related to the heat generated from the styrofoam over the absariveness of it. Having previous experiance in trades retail I've sold many blades and received many more for resharpening in addition to all that I have personally used. The heat caused from cutting is more damaging to the edge of the teeth than the abrasiveness in most materials.

The newsprint, I imagine, is also generating a fair amount of heat relative to the amount of steel in the razor edge much the same as a linen stop would but in a much smaller scale.

Someone has got to expariment and grade different papers for sharpening- construction, fish paper, tissue, etc....

This could be the ultimate low cost sharpening system:w

I've used paper for sharpening for years. Paper wheels are used to sharpen knives. Newspaper will cut you like a knife and the abrasives in the processed paper and ink are so fine that they'll polish glass. You can't make a dull razor sharp by backhoning or "stropping" on a newspaper wrapped hone, but you can make a reasonably sharp razor wickedly sharp that way. If you can't effortlessly take hair off your arm, the blade is too far gone for newsprint stropping, in my opinion. If, on the other hand, it will but is an uncomfortable shaver that pulls or stalls, this is very likely to straighten it right up, depending on how far gone it is. It works a lot like a pasted strop - more like 0.025 micron diamond paste than .050, in my opinion (but a little slower, a little more forgiving and a lot less expensive). Lynn reports that too many strokes on the newsprint will cause the razor to shave very, very close, but have a more "prickly" feel when shaving and that could well be because it an edge just a wee bit too keen.

You know, I haven't really used newsprint since I started using my chrome oxide-on-hardwood paddles, but I may have to play with this again.

Did this with a stainless Puma that was already quite sharp off the chrome oxide but had never been quite as sharp as my better carbon-steel razors or my Friodurs. I gave it 100 laps on newsprint last night and it was noticeably sharper this morning, right up there with my Clausses and Sta-Sharps and Heljestrands. Fun stuff, and it's tough to beat the price.

The price is impossible to beat and it fine tunes an edge more effectively and reliably than anything else I've ever used. It can't replace honing, but it can sure take the edge up a notch.

Ok, who's already thinking about the newest stropping craze....they Styrofoam Strop...or STYROSTROP.

I had good results in my office using the paper and my desk but have not done this for several months. I was actually doiong it edge leading (vs stropping motion)

Guess I'll have to try it again very soon

Cheers
Ivo

I used this while I was waiting on my chrome oxide from handamerican but hadn't used it since then, so I was pleased to discover that it improved the chrome oxide edge.

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Originally Posted by izlat

I was actually doiong it edge leading (vs stropping motion)

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It works a bit faster if you do it edge-leading, but you get the same results either way and you're less likely to make a mistake if you do it edge-trailing.

I'm not really a sharpness fanboy so I'm not sure I'll be doing this on every razor but it certainly kicked this one example up to where it needed to be.

I also recall it working faster if there were a photo on the top sheet, I think the ink really helps.

Yes on all counts, Michael :)

1) Stropping motion is less involved
2) I seem to get great shaves even with razors, which aren't scary sharp
3) The more ink (photo) - the faster it works

Cheers
Ivo

I just want to thank Justin for starting this thread -- very informative.





Justin

Here's a question: How do you manage to go edge first without ripping the newsprint? Any special way of adhering the paper to the glass (or whatever).

Here's another: Any benefit to using a slightly softer surface ?--maybe would polish a little faster with the stropping motion used.


Justin

Ya gotta keep it flat :-)

I use a lapped tile, and tape one side of the paper on the back of the tile, wrap it around tightly and tape it again on the other.

You don't want to get too soft a substrate, the paper itself compresses a bit.

Besides, it's not like hones compress any...

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Originally Posted by jaegerhund

Here's a question: How do you manage to go edge first without ripping the newsprint? Any special way of adhering the paper to the glass (or whatever).

Here's another: Any benefit to using a slightly softer surface ?--maybe would polish a little faster with the stropping motion used.


Justin

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Lol!

Light even pressure, paper on the corner of my desk with a book, folder, etc at one end (sth heavy) and free on the other = no shredding

With softer surface it may be easier to catch the leading edge but should work ok for stropping motion

I would also like to thank Justin for starting the thread

Cheers
Ivo

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Originally Posted by mparker762

Ya gotta keep it flat :-)

Besides, it's not like hones compress any...

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Thanks for the info on keeping the paper taut

I agree hones do not compress but strops do --- and I believe in general the softer the strop surface, the faster the compound will cut (hone, polish) . So maybe if you use a slightly softer surface and use a stropping motion, then you can cut down on your stropping time --- just wondering --- please be gentle.

Justin

Give it a try and let us know :-)

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Originally Posted by mparker762

Give it a try and let us know :-)

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Sounds like a plan -- not an immediate one ---but a plan. thanks.


Justin

You might want to try wrapping the newspaper around the hone several times - that will give you a softer strop and it would be easy to vary the amount of cushion.

So is it defined yet that the ink is the abrasive agent, the newsprint (a component of) , or a combination of both?

Justin

I'm guessing both. You can do this with a blank sheet of typing paper, but newsprint seems to work better, and ink-heavy newsprint even better.

Well, I always thought it's mostly the ink but that doesn't mean much :)

Cheers
Ivo

Newsprints use the cmyk (blue,red,yellow,black) ink method right? Any idea how these inks rank in abrasive quality (coarse to finest)? Maybe finding a higher concentration of certain colors might affect the polishing .


The reason the newsprint might polish faster/better than a smoother more refined paper with the same ink might be the same reason why a stropping compound polishes faster on a leather vs a balsa wood strop. softer,rougher vs smooth,hard.


Justin

The only time CMYK would be used is in color photo's etc. For black print in a news paper it's just black in.
Donald

Dont forget the type of paper (not only the type on paper) and the thickness! There are two types of paper "wood" pulp... Mechanical and/or Chemical... (the manner woodfibers "treats" in the making process) The first one are representative to newspaper (at least in my country)

Interesting thread! /stefan

How about the quality of the news printed... does that matter?
Would news on 'war in Iraq' be too abrasive, and would the womens underware section be too soft? How about the personals?
:shrug:

(Ok, I'll sit down now...)

C utz
:roflmao

Thanks for the thread...this sounds like a very good idea and a good way to give your razor that little extra push.

-Pary

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Originally Posted by Rusty Shackleford

Thanks for the thread...this sounds like a very good idea and a good way to give your razor that little extra push.

-Pary

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You're welcome Pary --Justin's one hell of a guy.;)


Justin

I would think the razor would have to be darn sharp already to get much from this process.