"Softness" of a Naniwa 8K

Recently, I'd posted about gouging the point of a blade which needed correction into my Naniwa 8K.

I didn't receive much feedback about it. I was wondering if this stone is softer than the 3K side, and softer than the 1K(I'd imagine) or had I done something horribly wrong. I don't think I soaked it for more than 5 minutes(maybe less) and I use distilled water, dry it with a towel, never leaving it out to the sun for any extended period.

Can someone kindly share some light on this subject for me?

Regards,

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Originally Posted by Siguy

Recently, I'd posted about gouging the point of a blade which needed correction into my Naniwa 8K.

I didn't receive much feedback about it. I was wondering if this stone is softer than the 3K side, and softer than the 1K(I'd imagine) or had I done something horribly wrong. I don't think I soaked it for more than 5 minutes(maybe less) and I use distilled water, dry it with a towel, never leaving it out to the sun for any extended period.

Can someone kindly share some light on this subject for me?

Regards,

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I am fairly sure that you aren't supposed to soak naniwas, I think you just spray the surface, nortons need soaking.
Sorry Siguy that's all I have got.

I had read they don't require long soaks, but nothing about no soakings at all. :shrug:

Thanks for the input, Ed.

Very, very respectfully,

Siguy

Naniwa superstones are resin bonded stones. Stones made from this method are less prone to damage from sun and submersion in water. That's also why they are softer than the naniwa Chocera. The ceramic stones are the ones that develop the hairline cracks this way.

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Originally Posted by Siguy

I had read they don't require long soaks, but nothing about no soakings at all. :shrug:

Thanks for the input, Ed.

Very, very respectfully,

Siguy

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No worries, that's just what I took from a variety of threads from when I was trying to find out about different hones though there were two camps then if I recall, I am pretty sure that's how Lynn does it in his vids too. Though I don't know if soaking is in any way detrimental.
Considering how soft my 10k was when I lapped it I imagine it would be fairly easy to damage the surface.

Ed, I vaguely remember Lynn saying that about the Shaptons(spray and go stones), but I distinctly recall soaking Naniwas for a couple of minutes(maybe Lynn or Glen's vids). I've read 5-10, but I soak mine 2-5 minutes.

@Vasilis,
Informative. I have one question, I was performing the same sort of honing gymnastics on the 3K Naniwa with even more pressure and never gouged it. I believe that I let that stone soak 1-2 minutes longer than normal as well. What might account for that, I wonder. :hmmm:

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Originally Posted by Siguy

Ed, I vaguely remember Lynn saying that about the Shaptons(spray and go stones), but I distinctly recall soaking Naniwas for a couple of minutes(maybe Lynn or Glen's vids). I've read 5-10, but I soak mine 2-5 minutes.

@Vasilis,
Informative. I have one question, I was performing the same sort of honing gymnastics on the 3K Naniwa with even more pressure and never gouged it. I believe that I let that stone soak 1-2 minutes longer than normal as well. What might account for that, I wonder. :hmmm:

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Ok, I have been known to be not correct from time to time. I wonder what not soaking mine has done.

Porous stones do generally get softer after soaking. And naniwa superstones are indeed quite soft, but I like it.
If you have to use pressure to remove more metal, you might as well try a coarser stone.
There is no reason to use too much pressure, and, this way the edge is not evenly honed, as the pressure is uneven on the whole surface that touches the stone.
For your stone now, if you can't feel the damage with your finger or nail (and the stone is not defective, a rare thing) don't worry about it.

I just spray my Naniwas , tap water, and hone, no soaking. When you are working on the toe of the blade you just have to be careful about the angle and pressure you put on the point or you will gouge the Naniwa.

Bob

Before I use the Naniwa 12K I just spray some water on the surface, wait a few minutes
to let it soak in, and then give it a light lapping on a DMT 325. During use, I just spray
it enough to keep it wet on top.

You could take a sharp pencil and "write" inside the gouge. Then lap the stone until all
the pencil marks are gone. It is a very soft stone, so that shouldn't take too long,
unless the gouge is really deep.

Vasilis is right about the use of pressure: a very light touch works best...and a minimal
number of strokes.

Naniwa SS are a much "Softer" hone then most others they just are , in fact that is one of the properties that makes them excellent "Polishers" and a perfect match for the Finicky, Chippy, Harder, blades.. (We are talking perspective here)
Keep that in mind when doing Gymnastics on them... I have shaved the sides of mine every now and then with a razor that has a Off Shoulder :(

You should not Soak them, that being said I am pretty bad about doing it, and I have had no issues with mine so I seriously doubt your 5-10 minute "Faux" pas will hurt anything :)

Where on your stone is the gouge? If it's close to the end you could just leave it and let it lap out over time.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Vasilis

Porous stones do generally get softer after soaking. And naniwa superstones are indeed quite soft, but I like it.
If you have to use pressure to remove more metal, you might as well try a coarser stone.
There is no reason to use too much pressure, and, this way the edge is not evenly honed, as the pressure is uneven on the whole surface that touches the stone.
For your stone now, if you can't feel the damage with your finger or nail (and the stone is not defective, a rare thing) don't worry about it.

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@Vasili,
I started with the troubled toe at the 1K and kept up the "creative honing" right through the 12K. Shaves fine. The tip *was* a problem area when honing, but with the lifting of the spine and consistent passes(as much as I could do by hand), I achieved some success.

As per you advice with my stone, that's exactly what I did... Kept on a keepin' on.

So softness. Does the lower grit of a 3k have anything to do with the softness of the Naniwa stone over the higher grit 8K? Just by experience, I'd imagine, yes, but I'll wait to hear more. I would say the 12K feels pretty soft and smooth and gives great feedback through the razor to the hand.

@Ed, no worries. The stuff you've already learnt... You can't even see me in the rear mirror. ;) btw- you're right. It will lap out over time.

@Glen, sorry I missed you post before posting this. Very appreciated. I'm a little anal on the soaking I'd done. It has *never* been 10 minutes, maybe 5 minutes *once*.

Attachment 154621
...... Here ya go, Ed.

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Originally Posted by Siguy

Attachment 154621
...... Here ya go, Ed.

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You forgot to draw the smiley mouth ?:)
So that looks kind of 2/3 of the way down, and fairly shallow, so the question is, can you work with it and lap it out over time, or is it in your way?
And seriously, I have only received my 1-8k hones today, up until now I have had a 10 and 12k so I wouldn't say I know more, I just know different.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by edhewitt

You forgot to draw the smiley mouth ?:)

So that looks kind of 2/3 of the way down, and fairly shallow, so the question is, can you work with it and lap it out over time, or is it in your way?

And seriously, I have only received my 1-8k hones today, up until now I have had a 10 and 12k so I wouldn't say I know more, I just know different.

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Dear Ed, to do so might be construed a bit to forward in some circles. I'll have to hone my interpersonal skills ;) (har, har)

And, yes, Yep, Affirmative. Honed through the 8K, 12K with no problems. CrOxed, stropped and shaved. SRPers to the rescue again.

Smiley and Kudly Regards,

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Siguy

@Vasili,
I started with the troubled toe at the 1K and kept up the "creative honing" right through the 12K. Shaves fine. The tip *was* a problem area when honing, but with the lifting of the spine and consistent passes(as much as I could do by hand), I achieved some success.

As per you advice with my stone, that's exactly what I did... Kept on a keepin' on.

So softness. Does the lower grit of a 3k have anything to do with the softness of the Naniwa stone over the higher grit 8K? Just by experience, I'd imagine, yes, but I'll wait to hear more. I would say the 12K feels pretty soft and smooth and gives great feedback through the razor to the hand.

@Ed, no worries. The stuff you've already learnt... You can't even see me in the rear mirror. ;)

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My experience with tips is, when it's a pain to hone it, you will actually experience pain on the shave.
I don't think the softness has something to do with the grit. The ratio of binder/abrasive is somewhat specific, for stones of similar grit of a line from a company, as far as I know.

It looks to me that your kind of worried because you think you made your Naniwa 8k softer because you soaked too long. I got the Naniwa 8k and let me tell you, it is too soft, I think it is softer than my Naniwa 12k. that is the way the stone is made, soft.

I'd use a dmt 325 then lap with a nagura and work away the gouge. Rinse well and carry on