What kind of japanese hone is this ?

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02-08-2013, 02:21 PM
dodi

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What kind of japanese hone is this ?

I bought this hone about a year ago when my wife and I was last in Tokyo, at the Morihei hone shop that is mentioned elsewhere on this site.
Unfortunately we were very much in a rush to get to the airport at the time, so I'd told my wife (who speaks japanese) that I'd like a hone for razors, preferably hard, and the approximate price range. I wasn't looking for a high-end natural hone, just something decent to get me started exploring them. I think it was about $200 but I'm not sure. I didn't have time to get the details about this hone, but Mr. Morihei did mention that I should use just a little water and not work up a thick slurry. Next time we go there I'll certainly allow more time for the visit, as it would be very interesting to see a couple of different types of hones and learn some more from Mr. Morihei.

Any information you may be able to provide is appreciated, as I have no experience with japanese natural hones or how to use them.

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02-10-2013, 02:23 AM
brooksie967

I think your nagura is a Mejiro, but i'm confused cause it looks like it has a nakayama stamp in the corners? I'll shut up now :)
02-10-2013, 02:29 AM
mainaman

Quote:

Originally Posted by brooksie967

I think your nagura is a Mejiro, but i'm confused cause it looks like it has a nakayama stamp in the corners? I'll shut up now :)

I do not think the kanji means Mejiro, and koma is not the finest nagura. Naguras vary in quality just as any other Jnat.
This piece could very well be a Chu nagura, which is very common
02-11-2013, 12:45 AM
Nikolay

Quote:

Originally Posted by brooksie967

I think your nagura is a Mejiro, but i'm confused cause it looks like it has a nakayama stamp in the corners? I'll shut up now :)

The kanji on Nagura is 中, the meaning is here Kanji details for 中

So the 中 is here not for Nakayama ( which is written as 中山 ), but for so-called Chu-Nagura ( 中名倉 ).
Chu-Nagura is not as fine as Koma-Nagura
it could be Meijiro or Tenjou or something like, but not the BOTAN Nagura which is more coarse grained than any Chu-Nagura.

The hone above is looking as quite hard one. And of good quality.
So I think it is suitable for razors.

But I am not able to identify for sure where has it been mined.

The stamp 別上品 has meaning like "Superior selected grade goods".
The stamp 正本山合砥 is for Shou Hon Zan Awasedo
Shou Hon Zan = True source mountain which is usually interpreted as that stone is from Nakayama mine
合砥 ( Awasedo ) = honing stone

the 天然 in the center of stamp on the upper right is for 天然砥石 - "Natural whetstone"

I use water spray bottle for irrigation. It's very handy.
Don't use too much water.
Use some slurry when beginning
avoid to get very thick slurry, add some water time by time
flush all the slurry and hone on clean stone when finishing to get the best result.

Read this book http://strazors.com/uploads/images/a...onkamisori.pdf for more detailed instrustions on how to use japanese natural hones.

There is also some useful info and videos on the site http://easternsmooth.com
02-11-2013, 05:34 PM
dodi

Thankyou for this information. I tried searching for the kanji, but it proved difficult to actually find the right characters. The pdf by Iwasaki that you linked to is very interesting.
02-13-2013, 06:12 AM
Tierdaen

Front of the stone is 天然特選上質正本山合砥別上品 and the nagura reads 中縞 and 中.

I read kanji/Chinese but do not know about rocks, so I lack the context to define clearly. Nothing on the stone really stands out as all those terms are pretty ubiquitous, 正本山合砥 (genuine Honyama whetstone) is used on a variety of stones and as far as I can tell, 特選 (specially selected) and 上質 (top quality) are normal marketing terms, while 別上品 may be a grade indicator stamp...but even that doesn't seem very standardized.

Stamps don't really say too much most of the time.
02-13-2013, 07:07 AM
mrsell63

Allow me to compliment Nikolay on his obvious expertise regarding J-nat stones. He should hold court and lecture us on Japanese stones and their proper use.
I would attend this gathering.

Jerry
____
02-13-2013, 03:32 PM
Nikolay

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrsell63

Allow me to compliment Nikolay on his obvious expertise regarding J-nat stones. He should hold court and lecture us on Japanese stones and their proper use.
I would attend this gathering.

Jerry
____

Thank You, Jerry for your compliment!

Sometimes I actually give master classes on japanese stones and their use.
But I am so far away from most of you... and I am not so fluent in English...it's not my mothertongue.
02-13-2013, 04:11 PM
mainaman

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nikolay

Thank You, Jerry for your compliment!

Sometimes I actually give master classes on japanese stones and their use.
But I am so far away from most of you... and I am not so fluent in English...it's not my mothertongue.

My question to you is do you know Japanese or are you using Google translator. Also have you been to Japan and talk to wholesalers and other experienced people about stones?
02-13-2013, 05:10 PM
Nikolay

Quote:

Originally Posted by mainaman

My question to you is do you know Japanese or are you using Google translator. Also have you been to Japan and talk to wholesalers and other experienced people about stones?

I know Japanese on very elementary level. It is also not my mothertongue.
Google translator give no or little to understand japanese. Usually it gives gibberish.
I prefer to use dictionaries like Denshi Jisho - Online Japanese dictionary for basic words and eow.alc.co.jp and others for advanced.
Also I have got japanese friends and I ask them for help with translation.
02-13-2013, 05:19 PM
mainaman

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nikolay

I know Japanese on very elementary level. It is also not my mothertongue.
Google translator give no or little to understand japanese. Usually it gives gibberish.
I prefer to use dictionaries like Denshi Jisho - Online Japanese dictionary for basic words and eow.alc.co.jp and others for advanced.
Also I have got japanese friends and I ask them for help with translation.

Have you talked to actual sellers of stones not via email, but rather in person??
02-13-2013, 05:45 PM
Nikolay

Quote:

Originally Posted by mainaman

Have you talked to actual sellers of stones not via email, but rather in person??

No. Never. All the communications has been by e-mail, IM, Skype and so on.
02-15-2013, 12:39 AM
RogueRazor

Quote:

Originally Posted by mainaman

I do not think the kanji means Mejiro, and koma is not the finest nagura. Naguras vary in quality just as any other Jnat.
This piece could very well be a Chu nagura, which is very common

that looks exactly like my chu nagura