Thread: Coticule producing good results but am searching for that perfect edge

After refreshing some razors on a yellow coticule, I am getting a good, close shave but the blade does not glide over my face like it does when sharpened professionally. I am interested in the possibility of adding the Shapton stones in 16k and 30k as finishers. What do you think? I did some research on esher stones and their site indicates they are not compatible with coticule edges. What are your opinions on the Shaptons? Thanks.

Sorry to hear that your coticule does not perform as you want it to, but I doubt it is the coticule alone. The disappointment in the close shave could be many issues.

I started with the Shapton 16k as my only finisher, it took a while to get the shaves out of it, that I liked. Any finisher will take some time to learn, some more time than others. I have 4 different finishers & I get the shave I want with each; some of my best shaves came off a $40.00 piece of Welsh slate. My coticule gives great shaves, but it took some experimenting & learning.

The statement about Esher stones not being compatible with coticule edges, I don't understand,,,I would like to read about that , if you still have the reference. I'm sure there are several members here who can enhance a coticule edge with an Esher.

This is taken from the Timber Tools website:

Can I use it as a final hone after using the Belgian garnet stone?

We are often asked this question. If you have used a high quality natural Belgian stone, the Escher/Thuringian stone is NOT recommended as a final hone, because the edge profiles created by these stones are different and not complementary. A high quality Belgian stone (such as the ones we sell) produces an edge without burrs, therefore that edge is already drawn toward attaining an ideal finish, so you wouldn't gain any advantage by using the Escher.

However, if you happen to own a low-quality Belgian stone (more aptly: a stone containing fewer garnets of large size, therefore cutting a coarser edge profile), there can be some improvement with the use of the Escher.

The Escher water hone is completely free of pyrites, which could otherwise hamper the honing effect.

Originally Posted by dcaven

This is taken from the Timber Tools website:

Can I use it as a final hone after using the Belgian garnet stone?

We are often asked this question. If you have used a high quality natural Belgian stone, the Escher/Thuringian stone is NOT recommended as a final hone, because the edge profiles created by these stones are different and not complementary. A high quality Belgian stone (such as the ones we sell) produces an edge without burrs, therefore that edge is already drawn toward attaining an ideal finish, so you wouldn't gain any advantage by using the Escher.

However, if you happen to own a low-quality Belgian stone (more aptly: a stone containing fewer garnets of large size, therefore cutting a coarser edge profile), there can be some improvement with the use of the Escher.

The Escher water hone is completely free of pyrites, which could otherwise hamper the honing effect.

I have seen that and to me it makes no sense!

I'm not sure I can answer your question,,,I don't own an Escher/Thurigan,,,I was loaned a very small Thuringian by Double0757 to try, it did improve the edge on one of my coticule finished razors, mind you, that was only one razor I tried it on.

I find the quote from Timber tools to be confusing,,,I cannot determine if it follows fact or a simple sales pitch.

Timber Tools "Escher" (note the quotation marks) are not finishers, at best 8k level, and that is pushing it.

If you want that awesome edge get 20k Suehiro Gokumyo, you will not be looking for other finishers anymore. This stone will save you a lot of money in the long run.

The perfect edge is subjective. What one finds perfect the next finds lacking or too harsh, as they say, etc. etc. What you have to find is what is perfect for you.

Stefan beat me to the 20k Gokumyo (my phone kept ringing), but I agree totally that it's the best, most consistent finisher there is....at the moment. Stefan, Birnando, JimmyHAD, etc. sold me on it months back in another thread about it.

A lot of members seem to like the Gokumyo finish after the 16k Shapton. I tried it for awhile and for me it was sporadic. I'm sure that was me and not the stones, but I started going to the Gokumyo after the 8k Shapton and that's "my perfect edge", and with consistent results.

Chasing a perfect edge with a coticule is challenging, IMO!!

Howard

ps: This thread just precedes yours, but Disburden's thought on the coticule edge is worth reading. http://straightrazorpalace.com/honin...rp-enough.html

Originally Posted by dcaven

After refreshing some razors on a yellow coticule, I am getting a good, close shave but the blade does not glide over my face like it does when sharpened professionally. I am interested in the possibility of adding the Shapton stones in 16k and 30k as finishers. What do you think? I did some research on esher stones and their site indicates they are not compatible with coticule edges. What are your opinions on the Shaptons? Thanks.

I have been a Shapton GS junkie for several years and the main reasoning is that I like what I call a "crisp or semi-crisp" edge. These edges feel as sharp as they are...thus the coined saying "Shapton sharp". My set-up that I use is Chosera 1K, Shapton GS 2,4,8,16, then actually backwards in "grit" to a yellow-green Escher. I do not use slurry. This combination works on any razor of quality steel. Professionally honed razors are most likely honed on synthetic stones to 12 (Naniwa) or 16K (Shapton). These edges will feel just as sharp as they are.

Refreshing on a coticule, especially if you don't have a BBW on the backside to use, can be a labor of love. I've only owned about 10 coticules in my honing time, but I have learned this: They aren't as fast as a synthetic nor as "fine grit" as a finisher like Naniwa 12K or Shapton GS 16K, or the naturals like a quality Thuringian, Charnley Forest, Zulu Grey, and so on.

If you are wanting to learn to touch-up a razor, you might pick up a quality barber hone, Naniwa 12K or Shapton GS 16K. My 16K stays in the bathroom so I can touch-up on the fly.

If you are looking at really learning to hone, pick up a Norton 4/8K, Naniwa 3/8K, or my personal favorite Shapton GS 4&8K. With any of these three "systems", you can build on them & get quality/specific advice. This isn't so with honing with a natural, that is why most all will recommend someone learn to touch-up & hone from synthetics to build a solid foundation.

I think I am going to go with the Naniwa 12k and the Suehiro 20k.

That's a great combination IMO. The 20 k really produces. It had the same softish feel at first as the naniwa, but after using for a while and lapping it, it gets real hard and doesn't need lapping often. They give you a slurry stone with it, its 1k,4k. This is for resurfacing the stone and removing swarf, it works very well. Good luck with it.