Lynn’s DVD - Honing Clarification Needed

[NightLad]

Hi everybody,

I bought Lynn’s fantastic DVD and I just finished watching the section on honing.

I’m IMPRESSED! It’s like the Straight Razor Bible on DVD. Best $20 I could have possibly spent when getting started.

However, there is one aspect of this tutorial I was unclear about. Lynn explained about the various types of stones, and while he primarily used the Norton 4000/8000, he also mentioned the 12K varieties for finishing/polishing prior to stropping. I bought a Norton 4000/8000 when I got my razor and I plan to grab myself a 12K too (Belgian Yellow Coticule), but later in the tutorial Lynn mentioned the finishing pastes one can use with flat bed leather strops; like the .25 and .5 micron pastes, red and green, etc.

I’m unclear if Lynn meant that these pastes should/can be used after the 12K stone, or if they were an alternative to the 12K stone. Any advice?

Thanks!

[LIMIT]

My impression of the DVD, was Lynn was showing the different ways a razor can be honed. IE; stone (norton etc), bench leather hones for paste, balsa wood for diamond paste for example. Myself, I prefer the stones (220/1000 4000/8000 12k Kitayama) I do have a paddle strop/hone with red paste (dovo brand). It's a matter of preference.

Good Luck

LIMIT

[Mike_ratliff]

He was showing the wide variety of options available, although I have not used the red or green paste, I go from the 8k to 12k, and use both the 0.5 and 0.25 pastes for my razors. This can sometimes get too sharp, but it serves me well.
The trick is finding the combination that fits both your razor, and your face.

[NightLad]

Hi, and thanks for the replies Limit and Mike,

I go from the 8k to 12k, and use both the 0.5 and 0.25 pastes for my razors.

I realize that there will not be one unanimous reply to the question ‘is this the best way to do it’, but your reply did hit on what I was more-or-less asking. That being; do people use the 0.5 and 0.25 after the 12k stone. Clearly, some do. I was just wondering if it is a step that more people take. Perhaps I should have made this thread a poll. LOL

I was interested in this myself, so it is something I’ll now look further into. Thanks again for your replies! (Any others are still more than welcome!)

[Jimbo]

Hi, and thanks for the replies Limit and Mike,



I realize that there will not be one unanimous reply to the question ‘is this the best way to do it’, but your reply did hit on what I was more-or-less asking. That being; do people use the 0.5 and 0.25 after the 12k stone. Clearly, some do. I was just wondering if it is a step that more people take. Perhaps I should have made this thread a poll. LOL

I was interested in this myself, so it is something I’ll now look further into. Thanks again for your replies! (Any others are still more than welcome!)

Hi NightLad,

The general idea with the finishing grits is to go progressively higher (or if you prefer microns, lower), removing the "scratch pattern" of the previous grit and creating a finer edge as you go. The 12k stone is coarser than the finishing pastes you mention (e.g. a Shapton 16k ceramic on glass stone is, IIR Chrisl's avatar correctly, 0.92 microns). So it would be unusual to use the pastes and then go to the stone, as this would wipe off the edge you just put on with the paste.

James.

[JoshEarl]

I agree with what's been said above, but I thought I'd add that .5 microns is around 50,000 grit, I think. Or possibly 30,000. But it's a lot finer.

Some guys like to use a 10K-16K hone after the Norton 8K and just leave it at that. The consensus seems to be that hones produce a slightly more durable edge that requires less frequent touch-ups.

Pastes have the advantage of being cheap and easy to use, plus they are available in ultra fine grits. The downside is that the resulting edge is a little weaker. But it's not really a huge problem; all you do is give the razor a few more laps on the pasted strop every week or so.

You can't go wrong either way. I'd suggest that a beginner go for the pastes, because it takes some skill to really get the benefit out of a high-grit hone. You have to do the 4K-8K steps properly. The high-grit hone isn't magic, and it won't fix a so-so 8K edge.

Have a great day,
Josh

[NightLad]

Thanks a ton Jimbo and Josh!

I’ve spent an astounding amount of time today reviewing previous posts and scouring the “search” feature. (This place is addictive!) I’ve found answers to a lot of my questions, and many answers that prompted more questions! This place is just amazing. Major kudos to all you great people who keep it running.

The further explanations about the uses of paste were much appreciated. Josh, your points about the finer edges needing more frequent touch-ups was well received. I had not even considered that aspect, thanks for pointing it out.

Ideally I’d like to avoid working with pastes. I just don’t like pastes of any sort; even toothpaste makes me wrinkle my nose, and in the winter I won’t even use hand cream. That said, even if I didn’t have a dislike of pastes I think I’d rather go with a stone anyway; I like the solidity of a nice stone I can actually hold and touch and feel beneath my fingers. I know I’m a noob but I have a strong feeling that I’d be more receptive to stone-honing so that’s where I’d like to start.

I’ve read about the ability to get a ‘scary sharp’ edge with pastes after the use of a 8K hone. Many people feel they can skip the 12K and go right to the .25 or .5 micron pastes. While that does sound impressive, I don’t feel that I’ll require such a fine edge. My beard isn’t overly tough and my skin is rather sensitive and fair, so a ‘scary sharp’ blade does not really appeal to me. (Nor does the equipment cost at this point, although it might be something to consider in the future should I develop the desire to try it out.)

Thanks to the feedback I’ve received here, as well as reviewing other posts about similar topics, I am now I am primarily interested in a good higher-grit finishing stone to use after the 8K Norton. I suspect that this will be all I require, and I know some forum members leave it at the 8K itself.

I’ve narrowed my interests down to a few. The Belgian Yellow Coticule (or course) and the Kitayama 12K both have their individual virtues, yet I can’t help but feel that for the price of either one I could spend an extra $15-20 and get the 16K Sharpton - even though most people would not recommend it for a noob due to its fast cutting. However, I’m a rather cautious person by nature and I’ve already purchased a couple razors on ebay to practice with long before my ‘real’ blade ever touches a hone!

Also, my ‘real’ blade is Stainless Steel, so maybe the faster cutting Sharpton would be a good move for less work. Hmmm…

I’m still kind of up in the air about this. Any other thoughts?

Thanks again for your time!

[Makar]

This is but can't help notice your python regius 'hug' stuff as a strapline. Be interesting to do a bit of research on allied hobbies to note any correlation. Maybe it's 'boys own' territory. I confess to being slightly touched by the scaly brigade over a decade or three myself! Do you keep anything right now - we can shift this to a general reptile thing up in 'general' perhaps...

[Wildtim]

I would try the shave off the Norton first before you try anything else. I have one razor in particular that never gets any better than the 8000 edge. It is nice and keen and comfortable off the 8000 too just like my other razors with finer stones. I don't know if this is a result of my increased honing skill or just a particularity of this razor but it is a very nice shaver with a very durable edge.

As far as different finishing steps there are:

barbers hones of various types
12000 Kityama
12000 Chinese
16000 Shapton
30000 Shapton
pastes of various materials and finenesses.

Eventually you will want to try them all and see what your own personal favorite is. I like the Swaty barbers hone for convenience, or Chromium oxide paste on leather for the smoothness. Thats if I do anything at all after the 8000.