3M Micro Abrasive Film, A Usage Guide and Review

About two weeks back this method for honing a razor was mentioned and at that time I said I would be posting a review of it in the coming week, well, I'm a little late. Here is the review and honing guide for the 3M honing films, or the scary sharp system as it applies to razors.

You might notice that I use in this guide a product I make, the glass bed hones, so yes this is another example of industry funded research but I hope I was able to keep my conclusions and analysis detached from my mercantile nature.


Without any further ado!!!


3M Micro Abrasive Films, Their Usage as a Razor Honing System


Summary

Since there is very little information about using the 3M films or the "scary sharp" system of honing on razors I set out to first, use it successfully for this purpose and second develop a set of procedures anyone could follow when using this method. In both I was successful. This guide follows every step I used to bring a out of condition razor back to shaving sharpness using the 3M films, and I did so with a minimum of difficulty as discussed in my conclusion.


Materials

Everything I used in this experiment is pictured below

http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p...m/IMG_1082.jpg

The water is simply from my tap.

The microscope used for testing is the one from Radio shack set at 60x.

The bottom razor is in need of a refresh honing, and will be covered in the future.

The top razor is the one I used in this experiment, it is a Geneva Cutlery Company 5/8's round point razor. I obtained it from my mother in law as it was her fathers or grandfathers. It had not been used in at least thirty years and was simply stored in a drawer for that time. Prior to this experiment it was polished using a Dremmel and MAAS with the felt pad as shown in Lynn's video. Nothing else has been done to it.

The beds for the films are glass over MDF treated to resist water with rubber feet to make a secure smooth surface for honing.

The papers/film were cut to roughly 3 inches by 11 inches and the grits used are as follows from left to right:
1000 grit 3M wet dry sandpaper form the auto parts store.
5 micron 3M Abrasive PSA film from http://www.toolsforworkingwood.com
1 micron 3m Abrasive PSA film from the same source, I chose this source as they have the best price in a quantity I desired.

Finally The laminate roller on the top is from Lowes.

Note: There is .5 micron film available as well, I didn't fell that it would be needed to make for a good shaving edge, and the ease of use of pastes in this grit make it superfluous.

Procedure

In order to develop this method and be successful I needed a place to begin. So for this experiment I started with the Pyramid method of honing as enumerated in the "Norton Pyramid Honing Guide" by Randy Tuttle which used to be available in the permanent archive off the main page but since the upgrade I can no longer find it (thank God I have a hard copy). This guide is for the Norton 4/8 K stone and I used it along with common sharpness tests, microscope views and my knowledge of honing on stones to sharpen the razor as follows.


step 1: Asses the razors edge. This is done to see where to begin in the honing process. I looked at the edge using the microscope and was able to see many tiny chips, most less than naked eye visible, all along the edge. The Thumb Nail Test (TNT) was then performed and the razor just slipped along its entire length with no bite, or total failure. This led me to decide that 1000 grit was the place to begin honing, or setting the edge.

step2: Prepare the 1000 grit hone. I took one glass bed and wet it with about 2 tablespoons of water. I also put water in a bowl and soaked the 1000 grit paper until the backing was wet (less than 1 min). I then smoothed the paper out on the wet glass bed where it sticks because of the waters surface tension.

The prepared hone:

http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p...m/IMG_1084.jpg

step3: Set the edge. The total was 28 strokes on the 1000 grit as follows.
a: 10 laps on the 1000 grit. Then I tested with the microscope seeing most of the tiny chips gone
b: 5 more laps. Then observed the most of the razor is free of chips excepting the toe area. The TNT confirmed this with biting over much of the length and slipping only near the center and on the toe of the razor.
c: 10 laps. the microscope now showed a perfectly set razors edge excepting a tiny chip near the toe.
d: 3 laps toe only. These laps were taken very lightly the intention being to emphasize the chipped area only. This got rid of the chip according to the microscope and the razor now passed the TNT, with the razor smoothly biting along its entire length.

Note: had these few strokes not worked I would have gone back to honing the entire edge to prevent wear to one section only.


My honing strokes are pictured below note the angle of the razor, I also use the x pattern even on such a large surface. This stroke is taken the same way using only the weight of the razor or less on every grit of hone I use.

http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p...m/IMG_1085.jpg
http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p...m/IMG_1086.jpg

setp4: Preparing the hones with the PSA films. I peeled the backing paper off the honing film and setting it gently on the glass beds as it appears in the pictures below. if you set the film gently enough on the glass surface it does not stick right away allowing you to slide into perfect alignment with the edge. I then used the laminate roller with moderate pressure to press the film to the glass and to roll out any bubbles that appeared. This was the most difficult step and will be discussed in my conclusion below. Each hone was then lubricated with about a tablespoon of water, no more is needed or wanted, and kept this wet throughout the honing process as needeed.

5 micron hone just before spreading the water across the surface:

http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p...m/IMG_1087.jpg


step 5; At this point, with the edge just set, I find an aggressive pyramid is usually in order when using waterstones so that what I did here as well. The strokes were as follow with the first number being the 5 micron and the second being the 1 micron honing films. This is exactly as taken from the Norton Pyramid Honing Guide:

15/5
10/5
5/5
3/5
1/5
1/5

At this point the edge looks much improved with the 1000 grit scratches removed but the razor barely pops hairs off my arm and fails the Thumb Pad Test (TPT) badly. Obviously we don't have a shaving edge yet.

step 6: I move to the conservative pyramid because the razor is getting an edge but it isn't shaving sharp yet. This is laid out like the Aggressive pyramid above and from the same source:

1/5
1/5
3/5
5/5
3/5
3/5
1/5
1/5
1/5

Now the edge looks very well polished to the microscope aided eye but still fails the TPT though it is much sharper than before.

step 7: This is where my experience steps in. This razor is quite sharp and almost ready to shave, another pyramid might lead to overhoning. So I did 30 laps on the 1 micron only. I'm done with the 5 micron It won't help me any more, and neither will my microscope as the edge looks the same as above. The TPT again show some improvement and the edge smoothly removes hair from my arm but the TPT also tells me the edge could be a bit better.

step 8: I gave it 20 more strokes on the 1 micron, and now the TPT tells me this is a shaving edge. So I move upstairs for a shave test.

Note: The stroke totals were 54 on the 5 micron and 125 on the 1 micron with the whole process from start to finish taking less than an hour and most of that being spent making notes and testing the edge. Very little actual time was spent scraping the razor up and down the hone.

The 1 micron hone showing the swarf when I was done with it.

http://i127.photobucket.com/albums/p...m/IMG_1090.jpg

step 9: Shave test. Surprisingly, this was a very good comfortable shave. I was expecting the edge to need a little refinement, perhaps on a pasted strop but I got a very nice and comfortable shave. I used TGQ Black Cavendish as this is a good performing and very consistent soap for me. I also used this razor for the next several shaves with various soaps and cremes and its performance remains consistent.

Conclusion

This proved to be a viable and not particularly difficult method of honing for me to use with several advantages over the more common stones. I felt it was quite fast. The films are very consistent. There is no soaking time. There is no break in time. The cost is extremely low for very large hones. It worked better than a two sided stone for pyramiding.

There is, on the other hand, one big drawback to this system. You must build your own honing surface. The glass beds worked well and, for me, were easy to make and I even sell them quite inexpensively so they aren't the problem. It is applying the honing film to them that can prove quite difficult. It was only on my third strip of film that I got the film stuck to the glass in a satisfactory manner. The first piece had to many bubbles and the film was misaligned, I removed it and reapplied it scratching it in the process. The second piece also had to many bubbles that would not press out and on removal from the glass the adhesive came loose in patches causing me to discard this piece as well. The third one went on quite well and easily making me wonder what the fuss was about, but I can't count on this every time. I also don't know the longevity of a piece of film, but I suspect that it is only three or four razors.

Because of the difficulty of applying the film and the fact that it will have to be reapplied at intervals I would not recommend this system to a beginning honer. Once someone has a good grasp of the quality of surface needed for honing a razor it isn't to hard to get it using the method described but this is outside the experience of the beginner. It is exactly those beginners whom will be most attracted to this system due to its low price so I highly doubt this will ever become a mainstream method for honing razors. It remains a very effective but outside of the ordinary honing experience, and one I will personally stick with, but not for everybody.

Tim,

Very, very nice job. :)

A couple of things: I think you put 100 when you meant 1000 a couple of times.

Also, I'd be very curious to see whether you can touch this edge up on a traditional hone when it starts to dull. Does the film leave a slightly rounded bevel? Maybe you could dull the razor by cutting paper and then try to touch it up with a barber hone or similar slow cutter.

That would help newbies troubleshoot if they ran into issues....

Josh

Tim, I'll let you and everyone else in on a little secret. When you apply PSA films to a smooth surface like glass and you don't want bubbles, wrinkles and the like, do what the pros do. Take a container of water and add just enough laundry detergent to make the water feel slippery between your fingers... when I used the stuff by the bucket, it was a handful of the old style powdered detergent (not the new triple concentrated stuff we buy now) to a bucket full of water. Splash some of that water onto the glass and the lay the psa backed film on top. It should slide around and let you get it just where you want it. Now you can start to squeegee the water out from under the film. If you are careful, it should only be water bubbles instead of air bubbles which can be manipulated much easier than air bubbles as air is easy to compress. By using detergent instead of soap, you'll find that as you squeegee the water out, the film will start to stick just fine. If you do run into a bubble that's hard to remove, it should still be easy enough to peel the film back and allow you to splash some more water underneath and let you try again... Once you start to use pressure though, the film will really stick so try to get it as perfect as possible before you grab the roller and start to put pressure on the film.

Regards

Kaptain "Scary, but not known to be all that sharp." Zero

Josh

You are right I did make that mistake a couple of times, Its hard to proofread your own work, thanks.

Kaptain,

I never thought of the detergent, I'll give it a shot when I need to change papers. I tried water under the film on my first attempt but it didn't make any difference. The soap would suspend the sheet beter though. The worst part was when the adhesive remained on the glass rather than on the film in my second attempt, I had to scrape it off with a razor blade, goo gone the residue off, and then wash and dry the glass to get rid of the goo gone before I could try with a new piece.

I still think a laminate roller is needed wether or not you use a wet application or a dry one.

Yes, do use the roller once you've gently removed all the bubbles etc. but use something like a credit card (I cut squares from margarine tub lids) to gently smooth things out first.... When I was installing signs on car doors and the like, we would use a sponge to apply the soapy water and then use the sponge to squeegee most of the bubbles and water out and then switched to a firmer squeegee to finish the job.

Christian

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wildtim

Josh

I still think a laminate roller is needed wether or not you use a wet application or a dry one.

---

If you get air/water bubbles under the film you can use a pin to prick the film from the other side to allow the water/air to escape.

The pin hole wont affect the honing.

That's a fantastic guide, Tim... Thank you very much. I was actually intending to stop by Lee Valley sometime after work this week and grab myself some of those sheets, so in actuality, your guide wasn't late at all, very timely in fact, from my perspective. ;)

I'm really glad that this worked out so well. For a lot of us younger folks getting our starts in life (24 still counts as young folk, right?) the costs of some of 4k - 8k stones can be a little prohibitive, so an inexpensive method of self-honing is pretty instrumental in making this a viable hobby.

Thank you again for this great resource. :)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by smythe

If you get air/water bubbles under the film you can use a pin to prick the film from the other side to allow the water/air to escape.

The pin hole wont affect the honing.

---

Some of the air bubbles that I had were only about twice the size of a pin hole.

My criteria for smooth enough for honing on is when I can feel NO surface imperfections, ie.. bumps or wrinkles. I can feel the edges of a pin prick, so I assume it isn't smooth enough when I am looking for a 1 micron or less hone.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Cobo

That's a fantastic guide, Tim... Thank you very much. I was actually intending to stop by Lee Valley sometime after work this week and grab myself some of those sheets, so in actuality, your guide wasn't late at all, very timely in fact, from my perspective. ;)

I'm really glad that this worked out so well. For a lot of us younger folks getting our starts in life (24 still counts as young folk, right?) the costs of some of 4k - 8k stones can be a little prohibitive, so an inexpensive method of self-honing is pretty instrumental in making this a viable hobby.

Thank you again for this great resource. :)

---

I don't know if you read this paragraph.

"Because of the difficulty of applying the film and the fact that it will have to be reapplied at intervals I would not recommend this system to a beginning honer. Once someone has a good grasp of the quality of surface needed for honing a razor it isn't to hard to get it using the method described but this is outside the experience of the beginner."

But I would caution anyone who hasn't used a stone before that making a honing surface can be a little tricky.

Don't worry, I read it all. If I bugger up I won't hold you responsible. ;)

In all honesty neccessity is a great dictator. Eventually my razor will become dulled, if I can't afford the stones or to send it off to be honed at that point I'm going to wind up back with my DE, which I'd rather not have happen. I understand your concerns and don't expect it to be idiot proof by any stretch of the imagionation, but at very least your guide will be a big helping hand, which I appreciate.

I don't use the self-adhesive lapping sheets, just the plain, no stickum kind.

Wet out the sheet of glass, lay down your lapping sheet, work out the excess water and air bubbles and the film stays put pretty well like that. Or if I'm feeling nervous about it, I'll tape the edges to make sure it doesn't move.

Once the sheet is down (make sure the film is right up to the edge of the glass sheet, and thet the edge of the glass plate is smooth!), you use it like any other hone. I don't feel that this is an advanced technique, as I. myself have been using this since day one as a straight razor user.

I think the adhesive sheets are harder to use.

I'll give the plain a try once I run through the stock I have.

The thing I like about the PSA sheets is that I still have the hones set up right now, several days later, if I splash a little water on them they are ready to go. All the convenience of a diamond plate none of the cost.

My experience told me that the method I used isn't one I would recommend to a razor newbie. Even if someone had experience working with decal application or laminating things I would hesitate to recommend what I did as there are just to many variables to juggle for someone with no experience, and for the person who will have to help them through it via e-mail or here on the boards.

Perhaps the method can be refined over time bringing the startup cost of our hobby down in the process and making it just that much less intimidating to the uninitiated.

really informative post great read thank you and you can do touch ups with a pasted strop

Excellent thread! I really enjoyed reading about this technique...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wildtim

I think the adhesive sheets are harder to use.

I'll give the plain a try once I run through the stock I have.


My experience told me that the method I used isn't one I would recommend to a razor newbie. Even if someone had experience working with decal application or laminating things I would hesitate to recommend what I did as there are just to many variables to juggle for someone with no experience, and for the person who will have to help them through it via e-mail or here on the boards.

Perhaps the method can be refined over time bringing the startup cost of our hobby down in the process and making it just that much less intimidating to the uninitiated.

---

Tim, I was just reading your comments and I happened to look at my shelf above the computer monitor where I saw a jar of SuperGrip from Hand American that I had forgotten about. This is the stuff they suggest for attaching non PSA film to glass. To me it feels like a medium hard waxy kind of substance, not sticky but slightly tacky. A smear spreads quite easy onto a piece of glass and the 3M 0.5 micron film I have seems to adhere well enough. Keeping the area scrupulously clean is imperative to avoid bumps in the film but bubbles seem to be a non issue using the SuperGrip paste. Frankly, I don't care for the feel of honing film on glass and have ditched it all in favor of natural hones, blue and yellow coticules to be exact. I have made a "scrubbed" leather bench hone for myself and use that with chromium oxide but I find the waxy stick type used by polishers for loading buffing wheels seems to work better for me than the powder/liquid from HA but I'm still experimenting with that so my opinion might change down the road.

I'd have to agree with Tim that while the honing film works, I'd not recommend it if you can afford a hone or two... Between the ongoing cost of replacing the film as it wears and the hassle in applying it to the glass properly, there's really not much good to be said about the scary sharp system except for it's fairly low entry fee. If you have to go out and buy a few pieces of cut glass and mail order the PSA films, you might even be getting close to the cost of some hones!

Regards

Kaptain "Kaptain like rock..... rock good." Zero

I've seen that stuff on his site. Yet another option to try. If the bubble problem is solved and there is an easier way to get the film applied to the glass this really does make sense for someone who wants to try honing with little outlay.

I'm really having fun with this:) given all the options you guys have given me in this thread I think I can keep my HAD in check for a couple of years while spending less than twenty bucks :roflmao

I have a feeling this is going to be my honing method of choice for some time to come.

I was thinking about this the last couple of days.

Back when I was into mountain biking, what we used to slip on the rubber handlebar grips was Aquanet hairspray. When wet, it was nice and slippery, but it dried like glue. Perhaps this would be a good way to apply the lapping films to the plates?

I'm going to give this methed a try when I re-do my setup.

Very good thread guys! Thanks a bunch.:tu

Quick update.

Touched up three razors with the system last night. Took less than twenty minutes from beginning to end. Its really nice to just grab the hones spill a little water on them and go to work. This is partly the fault of having separate hones rather than a combination hone and partly the no soaking and no slurry action of this system.

The razors were:

A 5/8 Griffon that was shaving well but felt a little tugging during the shave, last sharpened.... I have no idea sometime last year and touched up on a barbers hone since.

A 6/8 Griffon also shaving well but tugging slightly, last sharpened in early December, I've been shaving with this one right off the 8000 since then and now its ready for a refresh.

A 5/8 "Michigan Farmer" made in Germany. This has been a bugaboo razor for me, it gets nice and sharp but dulls faster than any other razor I have and is the most likely to become over honed fast. Not being able to keep this razor shaving well is a driving force behind me trying different methods of sharpening. When this was expertly honed it was a great shaver, so I know its potential, but I just can't meet the standard with this shaver.

For the first razor I did a short progression of:
1/3
1/5
1/5
1/7
Then checked and called it good, I felt significant improvement in the TPT, enough to move on to a shave test.

The second got a progression of:
1/3
1/5
1/5
1/7
Then check, better but...
10 strokes on the 1 micron
TPT say its as good as the other.

The last razor got a longer treatment as it was barely shaving when I brought it down to the shop.
3/3
3/5
1/3
1/5
1/5
1/7
check and find it better but not there yet.
5 strokes on the 1 micron.
Its good enough for a shave test.

I then blotted the excess water off the hones and put them up, the feet on the bottom allow air circulation so they will dry without being left sitting out. Again it was nice to be in and out of the shop after taking only about five minutes with each razor. I know there are other honing systems that give you this kind of convenience, but this is a first for me, and I really enjoy it. The only thing I hate about honing is the set-up and clean-up time it takes to use traditional water stones or in the case of my Arkansas, oil stones.

Wildtim,

Have you tried the decal appliers' technique of wetting the surface and/or the applique with water mixed with a tiny bit of dishwashing detergent before sticking the two surface together? I spoke with someone who puts the decals on our Highway Patrol cars, asking how they got them on so smoothly and he said water, soap and a squeegee. Wet everything, soak the decal, hold it up and apply it to the car door, and squeegee out the bubbles (or roll out with your plastic laminate roller). Once the water is worked out of the joint between the substrate and applique, the adhesive can make a smooth semi-permanent or permanent bond depending on the type of glue. This should work as well for different materials such as your abrasive films.

:tu

Just found similar alum oxide lapping sheets here, even cheaper and slightly larger:

Lapping sheets and plate

Comes in a pack of 10 for $13.10, so it's $1.30 per sheet.
Each sheet is 9" x 13", you can then cut each sheet into four individual 3 1/4 x 9" sheets for honing. $1.31/4 = 33 cents a honing sheet!

I'm planning to get the 9.5" x 13.5" glass plate they have as well. I can then mount three of the 3 1/4" x 9" honing sheets along three of the side of the glass plate and thus have all three grit sizes (5um, 3um, 1um) available on one plate!

I'm currently using diamond lapping sheets, and they are awesome and long lasting (been using the same sheets for close to three months, they are starting to wear out now), but they are about $5 for a 3" x 6" sheet.

How long do the alum oxide sheets last, WildTim?

Steel uses up aluminum oxide papers pretty fast. How long these will last depends on the density, type of aluminum oxide and the binder used.

But...the price is right. Give it a try and let us know how it works.

I forgot to post shave test results for the three razors I talked about a couple of weeks back. I'm glad I was reminded of this thread today so I could do so.

The second razor from my refresh session came out of that session shaving really really nicely. I have left it alone since. This razor also gave me great shaves right of the 8000 last time i sharpened it so I wasn't surprised to much. This is one of those razors that makes straight razor shaving seem easy, it shaves well, sharpens on a brick and holds that edge very well. Its ugly as sin too so you aren't afraid to mess up its looks.:)

The first razor from my session didn't fare quite as well. It shaved but pulled a little. I probably would have tolerated this level of sharpness when I started honing, but not now. It is markedly better than it was though.

The third razor, my problem child also improved from where it was but seems slightly overhoned. This razor often feels this war right off the hone, only to start pulling badly again a and couple of shaves later. Like I said a problem child as I never seem to get it into that sweet spot of perfection.

I kind of cheated in my tests when solving these two imperfections. I didn't want to go all the way downstairs for either the few laps it would take to fix the one or the disappointment I face in the other. So I reached into my vanity and pulled out my favorite barbers hone giving the better razor three strokes, and the worse one ten. This put the first back into my rotation shaving smoothly, so it was really close to perfect when it came off the honing paper. The last razor still wasn't there yet and it took another ten laps on the barbers hone to get it there. This is actually the first time I have been really happy with this last razors sharpness level in my last three attempts at honing it.

In conclusion: The paper system is as capable as any bench stone/hone system for touching up a edge that has gone off from use but still nothing beats a hone you can use right at the sink and store with your shaving supplies for those last final touch ups that give the most refined shave.

This a great thread!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wildtim

I don't know if you read this paragraph.

"Because of the difficulty of applying the film and the fact that it will have to be reapplied at intervals I would not recommend this system to a beginning honer.

---

I took this warning and kaptain_zero's advise to heart when applying the PSA sheets to a 12x12" marble tile, I got from lowe's for about two bucks. Instead of wetting the tile with water and detergent, I simply put 4" of slightly soapy water in the kitchen sink and submerged the tile in it. Sliding each sheet in so as to not trap any air bubbles underneath the film I was able squeegee out the water with a credit card, no problem. The soapy water allowed me to easily move the sheets to the proper position with fingertip pressure.

I applied four 3 3/8 x 8 1/2 sheets in just a few minutes even though I don't have any experience with decals.

I used your honing technique on an old Wester Bros and it did a fine job!

Thats great to hear. I'm glade the soapy water trick hit it, and that a credit card didn't scratch the PSA film. Those are a couple of my biggest worries the next time I have to apply the film. :tu



I'm afraid I won't be submerging mine though, they are Glass on MDF and though the MDF is sealed with polyurethane I don't trust it to stand up to that treatment.

This method does seem to work for the occasional honer so its great to find way to make it even easier to do.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Seraphim

I was thinking about this the last couple of days.

Back when I was into mountain biking, what we used to slip on the rubber handlebar grips was Aquanet hairspray. When wet, it was nice and slippery, but it dried like glue. Perhaps this would be a good way to apply the lapping films to the plates?

I'm going to give this methed a try when I re-do my setup.

---

Did you ever try this? Results?

Still waiting for my new lapping films to arrive, they're backordered.:mad:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by shuredgefan

This a great thread!



I took this warning and kaptain_zero's advise to heart when applying the PSA sheets to a 12x12" marble tile, I got from lowe's for about two bucks. Instead of wetting the tile with water and detergent, I simply put 4" of slightly soapy water in the kitchen sink and submerged the tile in it. Sliding each sheet in so as to not trap any air bubbles underneath the film I was able squeegee out the water with a credit card, no problem. The soapy water allowed me to easily move the sheets to the proper position with fingertip pressure.

I applied four 3 3/8 x 8 1/2 sheets in just a few minutes even though I don't have any experience with decals.

I used your honing technique on an old Wester Bros and it did a fine job!

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A few questions on this thread, but I'll go with this one first:

Is a piece of tile flat enough for honing purposes? If one was to use a tile for it, what type of tile should one use?

Are micro abrasive sheets available at any type of retail store that could be found in a major metro area or can they only be found online?

Both on 3M's webpage and Tools for Working Wood, several varieties of micro abrasive sheets are listed, which were you using?

Would these same sheets work for intermediate stages of rust removal and restoring a mirror finish to a blade, or would it be best to stick to high grit sandpapers and polishing discs?

Any ideas how many retouches one could expect from a single sheet?

Thanks,

Jordan

Jordan,

I'm not sure where everyone else is getting their abrasive sheets from but I bought mine from Lee Valley Tools as I have a store in our town. These are 3M mylar abrasive sheets, available with or without adhesive on the back.

Polished marble or granite tiles are generally quite flat (the process in polishing is the same as surface grinding) and can be had by the piece from Home Depot and the like. Regular terracotta and ceramic tiles are NOT flat enough.

For rust removal and sanding blades, I'd stick to the common wet/dry type papers.. cheaper and easier to handle, the mylar stuff will work but I can't imagine it being any better and it has to be cut rather than just fold and rip the usual stuff.

As for longevity, I've used it but switched to hones and haven't looked back since... I'd not hesitate to use these sheets if my hones weren't available but seeing they are I've never wore one out. If you are thinking cost vs. performance, the sheets will get you in the game cheap but if you stay with it, hones will come out on top in the end.

Regards

Christian

I just purchased some 3M Micron Finishing Paper from Progress Tool. They carry a large selection. These aren't micro-abrasives but they are advertised as the grits we'd use to sharpen. I purchased 2 sheets of each and they cost me $13.80 shipped. I'll let you know if they're good after I get them.

3M Micron Finishing Paper - 1 Micron / 8000 Grit (Lt. Green)
3M Micron Finishing Paper - 2 Micron / 6000 Grit (Mint)
3M Micron Finishing Paper - 3 Micron / 4000 Grit (Pink)
3M Micron Finishing Paper - 9 Micron / 1200 Grit (Blue)

I use pieces of the pinnacle system variety pack in my travel kit
from woodcraft supply
#147990 the variety pack has 1 sheet 3 grits, finest is .3 micron
I cut some to fit a small spyderco 1000 grit slipstone and the rest to fit a balsa wood "card". The coarsest grit I didn't use
cool stuff but too disposable for the long run imho

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TstebinsB

I just purchased some 3M Micron Finishing Paper from Progress Tool. They carry a large selection. These aren't micro-abrasives but they are advertised as the grits we'd use to sharpen. I purchased 2 sheets of each and they cost me $13.80 shipped. I'll let you know if they're good after I get them.

3M Micron Finishing Paper - 1 Micron / 8000 Grit (Lt. Green)
3M Micron Finishing Paper - 2 Micron / 6000 Grit (Mint)
3M Micron Finishing Paper - 3 Micron / 4000 Grit (Pink)
3M Micron Finishing Paper - 9 Micron / 1200 Grit (Blue)

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Progress Tool carries many different papers. However, these are definitely not appropriate for using with razors. These papers feel more like a cloth than sandpaper. Don't waste your money.. like I did. :(

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Originally Posted by TstebinsB

Progress Tool carries many different papers. However, these are definitely not appropriate for using with razors. These papers feel more like a cloth than sandpaper. Don't waste your money.. like I did. :(

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see my post above:D They are even hone shaped something like 3 x 11 less than 8 bucks

I am now using a flat granite plate I got on sale from Woodcraft. It's awesome for using with lapping films! It is certified flat to below 2 microns across the entire surface!

No need for any type of adhesive. I put a dollup of water down on the granite, lay the film down, and use a damp cloth to press out the excess water, which also helps to clean off any shmutz that was on the film from my previous honing. After the water is all pressed out, the film stays put via stiction from the very thin layer of water under there. Also, if there is anything that gets under the film, you can simply lift it up, clean it out and press it back down again. And when you're done with one grit level, simply peel it off and apply your next one.

Works great! I love my granite slab. I had been using glass plates, but somehow this feels better. I also used it as a surface for sandpaper to lap my Chinese 12k.

Bringing up my old thread :)

I haven't posted in here for a while because, well, I haven't had anything to hone for a while.

That is finally done with as a few of my razors have dulled down to the point where a refresh just isn't cutting it so It's time for another honing session with these hones.

I decided to peel the 1 micron re-apply it just to make sure the grey streaks are swarf and not the abrasive having been worn away (the film is transparent). It was still stuck perfectly flat as is the 5 micron so they actually were still ready to use even after the better part of a year tucked away in a drawer. It just peeled off leaving a bit of the adhesive behind. The adhesive came up instantly with a quick application of goo gone. I cleaned the glass then used Bruces dish soap trick below to apply the new sheet.

The dish soap worked perfectly, there were fewer bubbles and they smoothed right out, I don't think I would have needed the laminate roller to get good adhesion and bubble removal but since I have it I ran it across the surface anyway. This gave me a perfect honing surface in seconds. I blotted up the excess soapy water and let the hone dry so the adhesive would stick. A couple of hours later it was ready for use.

Once again they performed very well and with the ease of applying the film this time, I could safely recommend this as a viable way to enter the honing realm with start up costs much much less than those of a traditional hone.

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Originally Posted by Bruce

Wildtim,

Have you tried the decal appliers' technique of wetting the surface and/or the applique with water mixed with a tiny bit of dishwashing detergent before sticking the two surface together? I spoke with someone who puts the decals on our Highway Patrol cars, asking how they got them on so smoothly and he said water, soap and a squeegee. Wet everything, soak the decal, hold it up and apply it to the car door, and squeegee out the bubbles (or roll out with your plastic laminate roller). Once the water is worked out of the joint between the substrate and applique, the adhesive can make a smooth semi-permanent or permanent bond depending on the type of glue. This should work as well for different materials such as your abrasive films.

:tu

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