Different Razors - Different Results

[Colin Howkins]

As mentioned previously on this forum, I first used a razor some 45 years ago, and have lived in a world devoid of information on razors until my son put me onto this place. It fired me up and have now bought half a dozen or so razors and have started to enjoy 'playing' with them.

In a previous thread I was given the information on how to get what I call a very sharp razor compared to the sharp razor I had been using this past 45 odd years.

Now some of the razors I have bought have been good and some not so good. Some required a good clean, polish and new scales which I made up myself out of a piece of ebony that was lying around.

This honing business is interesting for previously I had nothing to compare with. My old razor a Gotta 120 I consider sharp. Some of the razors purchased are now very sharp and an absolute pleasure to use.

The interesting thing is that they have all been sharpened the same way. A visual inspection determines how many passes on the coarse stone, but it runs about like this 8-10 x 2000, 16-20 x 4000, 32 -40x 8000,
40 x hard felt with red dovo paste, 40 x hard felt with white dovo paste, finish on leather strop.

Out of all the razors the ones I consider very sharp are: Dubl Duck Satinedge, Boker Eidleweiss, 2 Bengall Full HG. The ones that are sharp: Gotta, Super Focus, 2 Bengall HG

Is this the razor or is it me? Do the sharp ones need more time on the coarser stones.

Any input gratefully accepted. It's not a huge issue - just interesting that I now have somthing to compare

[2Sharp]

Hello Colin. Glad you found this place. I have found that some razors will get very sharp and some will not. I have around 50 and each one is different. Also some will take longer to get to their individual peak sharpness. I keep going back to the hones to try to sharpen the ones I am not satisfied with. If I can get it sharper it is usually because of the bevel refinement.

bj

[English]

Hi Colin,

I have had a similar experience with over a 100 razors that have gone through my hands.

Interestingly, I have had two Gotta's and one was superb and one was OK. The OK one gave a good shave don't get me wrong, but it wasn't super special.

My conclusion is that it is all to do with the tempering of the steel in the manufacturing process and there are a fair few Friday after noon razors out there.

I have found that some makes always seem to get the best out of the metal. Boker, W&B, PUMA are three well known makes that instantly spring to mind especially if they have not been tampered with, if you know what I mean. But I don't think its your honing that at fault. My conclusion is that some razors don't hone up as well as others. The other interesting conclusion I have come to is that the quality and the price seem to bear no relationship whatsoever. I have had some top quality inexpensive razors and some expensive failures.

One last point, I like to tell you that Sheffield steel is the best but that also wouldn't agree with my experiences. I've had good and bad from England, Sweden, France and Germany.

The final conclusion is that when you find a good one hang on to it.

[KristofferBodvin]

Funny you metion the satinedge, I've got one to, and I find it very easy to hone, compered to some of my other razors.Love those ducks!

[JimmyHAD]

Colin, is the visual inspection done with a microscope or eye loupe ? I use a 30 power and it helps me to determine that I have a uniform bevel with the scratch pattern and color consistent all the way up the edge. Early on I neglected that and would get a razor shaving but not that good in the tougher spots like my chin and mustache.

I had a tendecy to move from the coarser hones to the finer too quickly. Randydance is an expert honer and he told me that he may have to take a razor back to the hones three or four times after shave testing before he gets it dialed in completely. I have had the same experience with some of them.

[gssixgun]

Some razors are smoother shavers then others, some are easier to hone, some hold a sharper edge than others.... but I have as yet, had a vintage razor not get to shaving sharp.... (knocking big time on wood)
Each type of razor steel has a different sharpening combination, as in some like the lower grits better, some don't get their edge until the 4k level....

Stroke counts IMHO mean absolutely nothing, even though everyone asks that same question all the time, there are just to many variables to bother relating stroke counts....

I break down my honing into 4 steps period, every razor has the same 4 steps, now granted some might be better at the start so that first step might be really quick or like a re-fresh doesn't even need the first step...

Step 1 Bevel set = the edge will cut arm hair at the skin easily (around 1k)
Step 2 Sharpening = the blade is actually shave ready at this point you could shave with it but it might be a little harsh on the skin (around 4k)
Step 3 Polishing = smooth up the edge and make it more comfortable for a shave (around 8k)
Step 4 Finishing = the ahhhhhh factor where the blade is wicked sharp and smooth (above 10k / pasted strops)

As I hone I go in 10 lap sets and check the edge after each 10 laps until after the 4k level then I don't touch the blade any more....Until I am done with the final stropping then I do a HHT along at least 5 points down the edge and do a test shave....


Using a standard sharpness system like this eliminates the questions, you know that if the razor is sharp at the 4k level you will not have to backtrack with your honing.... The biggest problem using this is the little devil on your shoulder that says "Go on move to the next stone, that one spot will get sharp there" just don't listen to him, and stay on the same stone until it is right, or stay on the pyramid system that you are using until it feels right....

[loueedacat]

Some razors are smoother shavers then others, some are easier to hone, some hold a sharper edge than others.... but I have as yet had a vintage razor not get to shaving sharp.... (knocking big time on wood)
Each type of razor steel has a different sharpening combination, as in some like the lower grits better, some don't get their edge until the 4k level....

Stroke counts IMHO mean absolutely nothing, even though everyone asks that same question all the time, there are just to many variables to bother relating stroke counts....

I break down my honing into 4 steps period, every razor has the same 4 steps, now granted some might be better at the start so that first step might be really quick or like a re-fresh doesn't even need the first step...

Step 1 Bevel set = the edge will cut arm hair at the skin easily (around 1k)
Step 2 Sharpening = the blade is actually shave ready at this point you could shave with it but it might be a little harsh on the skin (around 4k)
Step 3 Polishing = smooth up the edge and make it more comfortable for a shave (around 8k)
Step 4 Finishing = the ahhhhhh factor where the blade is wicked sharp and smooth (above 10k / pasted strops)

As I hone I go in 10 lap sets and check the edge after each 10 laps until after the 4k level then I don't touch the blade any more....Until I am done with the final stropping then I do a HHT along at least 5 points down the edge and do a test shave....


Using a standard sharpness system like this eliminates the questions, you know that if the razor is sharp at the 4k level you will not have to backtrack with your honing.... The biggest problem using this is the little devil on your shoulder that says "Go on move to the next stone, that one spot will get sharp there" just don't listen to him, and stay on the same stone until it is right, or stay on the pyramid system that you are using until it feels right....

Glen, I typically go from shapton 1k (Step 1) to blue coticule (maybe step 2 sort of) and then yellow coticule and/or yellow green eshers (step 3 [with slurry] plust step 4 [no slurry].

Since I'm using a blue cot rather than a shapton 4k, I have a feeling I'm skipping step 2. Other than one PIA green lizard my routine has been making me very happy, but do you think I'd have more luck if I got a more traditional 4k to supplement the 1k in getting the foundation set, or does the yellow with slurry get me to the same place if a little slower?

[gssixgun]

Glen, I typically go from shapton 1k (Step 1) to blue coticule (maybe step 2 sort of) and then yellow coticule and/or yellow green eshers (step 3 [with slurry] plust step 4 [no slurry].

Since I'm using a blue cot rather than a shapton 4k, I have a feeling I'm skipping step 2. Other than one PIA green lizard my routine has been making me very happy, but do you think I'd have more luck if I got a more traditional 4k to supplement the 1k in getting the foundation set, or does the yellow with slurry get me to the same place if a little slower?

I really don't think the stones are as important as I once did, I think if you test at each level then it really doesn't matter which stones you are using.... Just so long as you don't succumb to the voice that keeps telling ya "Move to the next stone" Now I would say that if you keep having the same problem at the same level because that Blue is a slow cutter then yes you might want to move to a faster stone, just so you won't shortcut that step.....


Apologies to Colin for the slight

[Colin Howkins]

Thanks to all who replied to my post. You have confirmed what I suspected that all razors are not created equal. They are a bit like chisels some hold edges better than others.

Jimmy, the visual inspection is just a look and a run of the fingernail along the edge, never gone to the trouble of a loupe.

This whole thing has now become a bit of ahobby, I have always had a bit of a fascination with edged tools, but like I said, I have lived in a razor wildernessfor 40 + years, I am still the only person I know that shaves with a razor [apart form you gentlemen on this forum]

A man once told me 'Only children & fools play with edged tools' - I'm not too sure which category I fall into

Once again - thanks to all