New - Introducing Myself

Hi there,

My name is Ryan. I'm 28 years old. I live in Canada.

I just started straight razor shaving this week. I decided to go to straight razor shaving for a few reasons:

1 - I have this vision that I'll get the best closest shave
2 - The cost of gillette cartridges is obscene
3 - It's very Zen
4 - It's manly and old-fashioned... respectable

Anyways, I purchased a beginner's kit. I have a 5/8 Dovo Razor, a 2" strop, best badger brush, a shave cream and a shave soap, styptic pencil, etc., etc.

I spent a lot of money on the kit without trying it out first. I could use a lot of help because at a week in I have to admit my face looks like spaghetti (from cuts). If anyone is looking for someone to mentor, I'd love to have a mentor!!

I've watched dozens of youtube videos and I even read a 40 page PDF book on straight shaving. I'm familiar with fundamentals such as the 30 degree rule and the importance of face prep and aftercare (although I still need to upgrade my aftershave).

So basically, I'm just at a frustration point where I find there are certain parts of the face that aren't very difficult, but there are certain parts that are. I find that the cuts come from either a lack of concentration and I put the razor against the skin at a wrong angle or i will be shaving and the razor bumps along my skin and then digs in.

Any help would be appreciated.

Ryan

Welcome to SRP!
Take your time. start by only doing your cheeks until you are comfortable with the razor. other questions... where did you purchase your starting kit from? do you have pictures?
some of the things only come form experience and others from beard prep and razor sharpness.

as for a mentor... it would help to know where in Canada you are, it is a big country... there are users on here from all over Canada, well most of the cities at least.

enjoy,
jim

Hello, fellow Ryan

First some obligatory questions:
Where did you get your kit? Did your razor come honed by someone or just factory honed?

Best advice I can give is start slow...you shouldn't be trying to shave your whole face right out of the gate. Most of the senior guys around here recommend starting with easy patches...WTG from sideburn to jawline on the dominant side....then the cheek. Then the non-dominant side and so on. Reason being, those areas are pretty easy and you can get used to the feeling of the razor in your hand and different angles without causing too much damage. If the razor ever digs in it will be because 1) your lather isn't up to snuff 2) you are using too much pressure 3) your angle is off

Where are you in Canada, there are lots of folks up there, but considering it's pretty big...i figured i'd ask :)
Welcome and try not to get frustrated...it's a marathon, not a sprint.

Welcome to SRP. The kit that you bought, did the razor come to you "shave ready", meaning it was honed by hand by someone who knows how to? If you have not done so already, be sure to read Lynn's post, found in the beginners links on the home page, First Straight Shave. Just start by shaving your cheeks for now and finish up with your previous shaving method. Add new portions a little at a time as you gain confidence and muscle memory. There is a learning curve, but if you have the patience, you will learn. Don't worry about making mistakes, that's how we learn. The chin and neck seem to be the most problematic for most new straight shavers. For me, it took a couple of months before I was able shave my entire face with just a straight. I was not BBS by a long shot, but that comes with lots of practice. Hang in there, read and practice. Post questions.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ReardenSteel

Welcome to SRP. The kit that you bought, did the razor come to you "shave ready", meaning it was honed by hand by someone who knows how to? If you have not done so already, be sure to read Lynn's post, found in the beginners links on the home page, First Straight Shave. Just start by shaving your cheeks for now and finish up with your previous shaving method. Add new portions a little at a time as you gain confidence and muscle memory. There is a learning curve, but if you have the patience, you will learn. Don't worry about making mistakes, that's how we learn. The chin and neck seem to be the most problematic for most new straight shavers. For me, it took a couple of months before I was able shave my entire face with just a straight. I was not BBS by a long shot, but that comes with lots of practice. Hang in there, read and practice. Post questions.

---

Yes, the razor I bought was honed to 'shave ready' from where I bought it. They ship all their new razors honed to shave ready and offer one free honing when you need it.

Thanks for the tips. Yes, certain areas feel easier to do. I can do my neck surprisingly well.. both WTG and ATG... I am really confused about how to do XTG. My cheeks are usually not a big problem except on one side of my face near the top. Above the lip is getting better but still a lot of cuts in the nose area and the chin is by far the most difficult. Your suggestion to focus on the areas that are easier and use a regular razor on the rest is a good one. Would you say I should use the regular razor on the difficult areas and then do a delicate pass with my straight so that I continue to get a feel for it?

Thanks for responding!

Ryan

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ryryrecords

Yes, the razor I bought was honed to 'shave ready' from where I bought it. They ship all their new razors honed to shave ready and offer one free honing when you need it.

Thanks for the tips. Yes, certain areas feel easier to do. I can do my neck surprisingly well.. both WTG and ATG... I am really confused about how to do XTG. My cheeks are usually not a big problem except on one side of my face near the top. Above the lip is getting better but still a lot of cuts in the nose area and the chin is by far the most difficult. Your suggestion to focus on the areas that are easier and use a regular razor on the rest is a good one. Would you say I should use the regular razor on the difficult areas and then do a delicate pass with my straight so that I continue to get a feel for it?

Thanks for responding!

Ryan

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once you have the cheeks and neck going comfortably, i would start by doing the delicate pass with the straight first, then cleaning up/finishing off with the regular razor. if you use the regular razor first, you won't really know if you are doing anything with your delicate pass or not.

Attachment 96857

I bought my kit from The Classic Edge The Classic Edge Shaving Store

Thank you for the suggestion of just doing the easier parts to get used to the razor and angles. The direction of shaving and keeping the 30 degree angle is difficult and will take some time.

I live in Northern Ontario, in Kirkland Lake. I doubt there'd be anyone around here as it's a town of maybe 8000 people ha ha.

I put in the small picture from the website of my kit... if you go to the store link below, you can read about my entire kit:

http://www.classicedge.ca/NewStraigh...product_id=400

Thanks!

Ryan

one other thought ... the 30degree shaving angle is only and approximation, not a law. some time a smaller angle works better and with some razors a larger one works. experiment with lowering your blade angle first to see if it helps.
the kit looks nice... although it is a styptic pencil not septic and the seller has it listed... there is a huge difference between the two.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by syslight

although it is a styptic pencil not septic and the seller has it listed... there is a huge difference between the two.

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roflmao.

couple pennies, US even if they arent worth much up there.

.01 I really think its helpful to get the lather down good, I see no mention of how you feel about your lather. It takes some patience and attempts but have faith, when it feels & looks about like warm coolwhip you are at least in the ball park (probably still a bit dry). If it looks like re-constituted dry milk, its too thin. A bit of a waste, but you can just lather in the bowl, scrape it out and half way clean stuff and play with it again. It will make the bathroom smell really good and get you some practice

.01 Be very mindful of moving your face at all or the blade laterally (similar direction to the line made by the cutting edge)

What all the others have said, topped of with a little you might be trying TOO hard to do it perfect. To much concentration does not a zen mind make.

The angle portion, I find I need to use a couple angles per pass. If I start with a shallower angle and move to a higher one, I hear more hairs going bye bye. Same happens for the reverse.

Regarding the angle - Thank you for affirming this for me. I find that closing up the angle helps on certain areas, such as the neck. Also it helps to close up the angle on the areas where my technique doesn't feel strong (closed angle equals safer), I sometimes just need to do more passes.

I did my morning shave today with both my straight and a regular gillette razor. It went well. I did a WTG pass on my cheeks and neck and didn't incur any new cuts. Then I did the rest with my gillette and did ATG with the gillette too. Using the gillette helped because I have some almost gash like cuts from the straight, and going over them with the straight wasn't allowing them to heal and I was just adding new ones.

About my lather and prep. I prefer to do it after a shower but if not I spend 4 minutes of putting hot water on my face and rubbing it in. I soak my shaving brush for 2 minutes in really hot water. With the lather, I prefer the glycerine soap (Colonel Conk Bay Rum) over the Derby shave cream. I find it to be more hydrating. I typically will relather many times during a straight shave because I find the lather will dry up on the unshaved areas. It is very uncomfortable for me to shave when my skin isn't hydrated and the lather is drying. So I typically will relather 4 or 5 times because I'm going so slowly.

I do feel comfortable going ATG on the neck only... on the cheeks and other areas I do cut myself. Tomorrow I will bring that back into my shave and finish the rest with the gillette. Once my cuts are healed more then I can try a pass under the nose and on the chin.

These suggestions are great. You are all very appreciated for your comments!

Ryan

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ryryrecords

Hi there,

Anyways, I purchased a beginner's kit. I have a 5/8 Dovo Razor, a 2" strop, best badger brush, a shave cream and a shave soap, styptic pencil, etc., etc.

I spent a lot of money on the kit without trying it out first. I could use a lot of help because at a week in I have to admit my face looks like spaghetti (from cuts). If anyone is looking for someone to mentor, I'd love to have a mentor!!

I've watched dozens of youtube videos and I even read a 40 page PDF book on straight shaving. I'm familiar with fundamentals such as the 30 degree rule and the importance of face prep and aftercare (although I still need to upgrade my aftershave).

So basically, I'm just at a frustration point where I find there are certain parts of the face that aren't very difficult, but there are certain parts that are. I find that the cuts come from either a lack of concentration and I put the razor against the skin at a wrong angle or i will be shaving and the razor bumps along my skin and then digs in.

Any help would be appreciated.

Ryan

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FWIW (after eveyone else has had their say) --

The kit sounds fine.

a) You cannot afford a "lack of concentration" when using a straight razor. If you're rushed, if you're preoccupied, if you're really tired -- use something else for the shave. It's _not_ a cartridge razor, or a DE; there are no training wheels.

b) There's no real "30 degree rule". What I have found that works:

. . . . Hold the blade flat against your skin, and start a slow stroke;

. . . . Raise the spine until the edge just starts to cut your beard. That's the right angle to use.

. . . The angle will be flatter going ATG and XTG, than going WTG.

c) "the razor bumps along my skin and then digs in." This _could_ be:

. . . . a slightly-dull blade, or

. . . . . not enough skin-stretching, or

. . . . a beard that needs more pre-shave prep -- hot shower, hot towel, or something else to soften it a bit more.

What can happen with a slightly-dull blade is that you apply more pressure, and make the angle larger, to force it to cut beard. But with that much pressure, and that increased angle, it's happy to cut skin.

When you don't stretch your skin, the pressure of the razor's edge lifts a ridge of skin in front of the edge. That happens even more, if you're pressing on the blade. The angle between the edge, and that ridge, is larger than you think it is. And the razor digs in.

I suggest that you forget about ATG and XTG passes, until you get a solid, "no-cuts" WTG system worked out. Good pre-shave prep, a sharp edge, and very very very light pressure on the blade should help.

Two questions:

. . . How many laps are you stropping between shaves?

. . . What's your pre-shave prep?

Charles

PS -- the thing that separates "beginner shaver" from "expert shaver" is that the expert has made _all_ the beginner mistakes, and doesn't make them any more. At least, not often.<g>

Quote:

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Originally Posted by cpcohen1945

FWIW (after eveyone else has had their say) --

The kit sounds fine.

a) You cannot afford a "lack of concentration" when using a straight razor. If you're rushed, if you're preoccupied, if you're really tired -- use something else for the shave. It's _not_ a cartridge razor, or a DE; there are no training wheels.

b) There's no real "30 degree rule". What I have found that works:

. . . . Hold the blade flat against your skin, and start a slow stroke;

. . . . Raise the spine until the edge just starts to cut your beard. That's the right angle to use.

. . . The angle will be flatter going ATG and XTG, than going WTG.

c) "the razor bumps along my skin and then digs in." This _could_ be:

. . . . a slightly-dull blade, or

. . . . . not enough skin-stretching, or

. . . . a beard that needs more pre-shave prep -- hot shower, hot towel, or something else to soften it a bit more.

What can happen with a slightly-dull blade is that you apply more pressure, and make the angle larger, to force it to cut beard. But with that much pressure, and that increased angle, it's happy to cut skin.

When you don't stretch your skin, the pressure of the razor's edge lifts a ridge of skin in front of the edge. That happens even more, if you're pressing on the blade. The angle between the edge, and that ridge, is larger than you think it is. And the razor digs in.

I suggest that you forget about ATG and XTG passes, until you get a solid, "no-cuts" WTG system worked out. Good pre-shave prep, a sharp edge, and very very very light pressure on the blade should help.

Two questions:

. . . How many laps are you stropping between shaves?

. . . What's your pre-shave prep?

Charles

PS -- the thing that separates "beginner shaver" from "expert shaver" is that the expert has made _all_ the beginner mistakes, and doesn't make them any more. At least, not often.<g>

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Thanks for your tips, I'll address your questions to me first:

Pre-shave Prep: Hot water splashed on my face for around 4 or 5 minutes, sometimes I wet a towel with the hot water and hot it against my shave area. Near the end I rub the hot water into my growth. I then soak my brush for 2 minutes in really hot water in the sink. I work up a lather in my cup with (currently using) Colonel Conk's Bay Rum Glycerine shave soap. I work it until the lather is meringue like but still bubbles and water in it. I brush in multiple directions to raise the hair. I find I re-lather a lot whilst shaving because the lather or my skin drys out. I find a hot wet blade and hot wet skin make the razor glide smoother... when it drys up then the razor just bumps along a lot.

Stropping: As for stropping, I do about the minimum of 30 round trips. My stropping technique isn't great, sometimes I go too quickly and I am not as accurate as if I go slow, but I've read that slow stropping is a problem in and of itself (although I've also read that it doesn't matter... care to weigh in?)

I know what you mean about the angle. Some of the best strokes of the razor have started out with me laying the razor flat and starting downward and adjusting the angle to start cutting the hair. I should do this more often because it is very dilerbate and most cuts start at the start of a stroke.

I have been neglectful to stretch the skin. This is probably why I have the bumping. I never thought of it how you explained it. That makes sense that if there is pressure on the blade it would make unstretched skin more likely for a cut or bump along. I will start the stretching.

And I like your point about concentrating. 80% of my cuts happen in moments when my eyes somewhat glaze over and I'm overly confident. If I concentrate the worst I'll get are little nicks in hard areas (round the nose).

I've also bought a new after-shave balm. I was using a really cheap after-shave balm by Gillette that was very drying. I went for a Nivea after-shave balm that's alcohol free until I can afford a premium balm from my shave store at the end of the month.

Thanks for your advice... I'll focus just on WTG for a while. I know that they say it takes 30 days for your face to adjust to a new system. I will give it that long before attempting the other.

Ryan

P.S.
If anyone wants to recommend some after treatment I'd love some ideas as to what you really like. I will be ordering from the store that I linked to above on page 1 so that's my selection. I have also given some thought to using witchhazel as I saw some barbers on youtube using it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by syslight

Welcome to SRP!
as for a mentor... it would help to know where in Canada you are, it is a big country... there are users on here from all over Canada, well most of the cities at least.

enjoy,
jim

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That is all part of the ploy my friend... %90 of Canadians live within 30 miles of the U.S. border.. Coincidence?... I don't think so... They are massing for the strike!

Oh yea, Welcome! plenty of guys here to help you get started too! Good bunch of fellows with a lot of knowledge.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wintchase

That is all part of the ploy my friend... %90 of Canadians live within 30 miles of the U.S. border.. Coincidence?... I don't think so... They are massing for the strike!

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I know it is part of their ploy to invade... "operation maple syrup!" i used to live a couple miles south of the ny/ canada border near Rouses Pt...

personally i fill my lathering mug with hot water before my shower and let my brush soak while i shower
the conk soap does dry out quickly you might want to try adding a few drops of glycerin to it it will help with the lather and moisturizing the face ... witch hazel helps keep the burn down especially if you are going to use an alcohol based aftershave.

jim

My thoughts:

1. Strop _slowly_, and do a good job. Don't raise the spine off the strop when you flip the razor. Hold the strop pretty tight, and put just a little pressure on the cutting edge of the razor. NOT MUCH PRESSURE! There's a good YouTube video that demonstrates "flip technique" -- you can probably find it as fast as I can.

2. I found that 40 laps wasn't enough; I'm using 50 laps now, and getting better results. "Lap" = up and down.

3. I don't use any after-shave products at all, so can't help you on that score. But I would avoid anything with alcohol in it. Try an aftershave "balm", or use Vaseline "Intensive Care" lotion (not my idea -- another member recommended it).

4. You might benefit from a pre-shave product, put on your face _sparingly_ just before you put on lather and start shaving. I have used almond oil, hair conditioner, Astroglide, and glycerin. They all help the razor glide a little better. Other people have had good luck with Proraso pre-shave oil.

It sounds like you have typical startup problems. As you try different things, you'll find out what works _for you_, and what doesn't.

Charles

Question about shaving:

I hold my razor in my right hand and it works great for shaving up and down on my one cheek. I use the same holding position on the other side of my face but have shave more from the sides, on an angle. Should I be switching hands?

All the suggestions have helped. I did a WTG shave this morning and stretched the skin, which especially helped to do my chin.

After I did two passes with my gillette and my face is very smooth, no nicks. I was very careful and I stropped a bit more than usual in my prep.

And yes, I switched to an after-shave balm. The one made by Nivea. It is alcohol free which was a big selling point for me. It seems to be a nice step up from what I had although I'll likely get a premium after-balm soon. I also was thinking of getting some pre-shave oil... gotta watch the wallet though :-)

Ryan

Question about shaving:

I hold my razor in my right hand and it works great for shaving up and down on my one cheek. I use the same holding position on the other side of my face but have shave more from the sides, on an angle. Should I be switching hands?

All the suggestions have helped. I did a WTG shave this morning and stretched the skin, which especially helped to do my chin.

After I did two passes with my gillette and my face is very smooth, no nicks. I was very careful and I stropped a bit more than usual in my prep.

And yes, I switched to an after-shave balm. The one made by Nivea. It is alcohol free which was a big selling point for me. It seems to be a nice step up from what I had although I'll likely get a premium after-balm soon. I also was thinking of getting some pre-shave oil... gotta watch the wallet though :-)

Ryan

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ryryrecords

Question about shaving:

I hold my razor in my right hand and it works great for shaving up and down on my one cheek. I use the same holding position on the other side of my face but have shave more from the sides, on an angle. Should I be switching hands?

All the suggestions have helped. I did a WTG shave this morning and stretched the skin, which especially helped to do my chin.

After I did two passes with my gillette and my face is very smooth, no nicks. I was very careful and I stropped a bit more than usual in my prep.

And yes, I switched to an after-shave balm. The one made by Nivea. It is alcohol free which was a big selling point for me. It seems to be a nice step up from what I had although I'll likely get a premium after-balm soon. I also was thinking of getting some pre-shave oil... gotta watch the wallet though :-)

Ryan

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That's kind of a YMMV question...I think i would say, if you CAN learn to switch hands, do it. but there are lots of guys who don't...
I think recommended "best practices" would say it's best to learn to switch hands.

Also, this might be helpful if you haven't read it yet: Different ways to hold a straight razor - Straight Razor Place Wiki

regarding preshave oil...it's not an oil (and not as messy) but it's hard to go wrong with proraso preshave cream at $11-$13...i use the green tea aloe because the regular is just too much menthol for me.

cheers

The question of switching hands is a matter of comfort. I am extremely dominant with my left hand and used to switch hands in the beginning, but in the end I chose to stick with my left and eventually, I got better and better with shaving the side of my face that is most problematic. A lot of people will tell you to switch hands, there are Benefits to this, and you will eventually become proficient with both hands while shaving, but I find one handed shaving is just fine for me too. Experiment with different ways of holding the razor and you will find what is best for you! Also, I find beard mapping to be crucial as well for this, that is how you will develops what angle and position is best for you, be it one handed or both hands. Lastly, I also recently purchased my first double edge and have discovered the pros to owning one of those as well. It really helps in those problem spots for touch ups where I cannot get my straight's angle to be just right. Good luck!

I ride little bikes and occaisionally huck myself off big jumps. I normally switch hands just for the left side WTG pass. However I had an eye opener that has me spending the next couple few weeks concentrating on single handed shaving for a single pass with (eventually) both hands.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ryryrecords

Regarding the angle - Thank you for affirming this for me. I find that closing up the angle helps on certain areas, such as the neck. Also it helps to close up the angle on the areas where my technique doesn't feel strong (closed angle equals safer), I sometimes just need to do more passes.

I did my morning shave today with both my straight and a regular gillette razor. It went well. I did a WTG pass on my cheeks and neck and didn't incur any new cuts. Then I did the rest with my gillette and did ATG with the gillette too. Using the gillette helped because I have some almost gash like cuts from the straight, and going over them with the straight wasn't allowing them to heal and I was just adding new ones.

About my lather and prep. I prefer to do it after a shower but if not I spend 4 minutes of putting hot water on my face and rubbing it in. I soak my shaving brush for 2 minutes in really hot water. With the lather, I prefer the glycerine soap (Colonel Conk Bay Rum) over the Derby shave cream. I find it to be more hydrating. I typically will relather many times during a straight shave because I find the lather will dry up on the unshaved areas. It is very uncomfortable for me to shave when my skin isn't hydrated and the lather is drying. So I typically will relather 4 or 5 times because I'm going so slowly.

I do feel comfortable going ATG on the neck only... on the cheeks and other areas I do cut myself. Tomorrow I will bring that back into my shave and finish the rest with the gillette. Once my cuts are healed more then I can try a pass under the nose and on the chin.

These suggestions are great. You are all very appreciated for your comments!

Ryan

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Welcome Mate, this is a great site full of really good knowledgable people. My penneth worth is also learn to use both hands, persavere it makes shaving both sides of you face so much easier. It will feel really awkward at first but keep at it and in a few months it will become quite doable, in time very easy as you build muscle memory.

Good luck to you

Cheers

Heelerau