Bruno

Very, thoughtful Bruno, and I can honestly say I completely agree. With regards to the first part, yes the language is broad, but knowing when and how to use it to express yourself articulately without being offensive seems to be a dying art.
With regards to the second part, as a man (and a father) I feel under more scrutiny around kids that women are. Not that I really mind, I would far rather that than not, and maybe that feeling is just self imposed, and maybe women feel the same way, maybe its just a product of today's society.
Too many maybes, but thanks Bruno, I enjoy reading stuff you have written, it is well thought out and considered.

Thank you Bruno. Most explicit and to the point in a way that can't be easily refuted. As a person that didn't always fit in the middle of what or when ever I suffered through, as Shakespeare put it, "the slings and arrows" but not of fortunes but words. I applaud the clarity of your writing.

By the way, as an aside. There was a fairly recent study done on foul language and older people. It seems, that in general, as we age we tend to relax more in our use of swear words. Not that it is done consciously but the mental prohibition seems to lessen with age. I find that to be somewhat true in that I have found myself using bad language more frequently in everyday conversation and have to self-censor milli-seconds before I utter it.

Interesting. I don't normally stray on to the main page but tonight I'm glad I did.

The whole scenario depends on the, well, scenario.

It depends on the word and the context. I mean, I think these days, at least in the society I live in dropping the 'F' word won't get you sacked.
I also agree those labels can shock one.

However, sometimes you need to give someone a slap across the face to wake them up, and language can do that. It can be nice and it can refresh. Language is fluid, and, like freezing water, can wake one up.

Carl, you are right the scenario is, well the scenario.
And yes, sometimes saying what someone doesn't want to hear is exactly what they need to hear.
However context is more than important as well as circumstance. I would need to know you to tell you to f off, knowing that you would know that I still cared for/about you. Look at the baby steps/toing and froing, that were used to form our relationship (i almost put relationship in inverted commas, but it seemed a bit ridiculous, we are both grown ups). If I had just gone at you in the forum, without some sort of something else, you wouldn't know what to think.
Now if I had labeled you as whatever, openly I cannot take that back, and I cannot stop that from being taken out of context.
I think modern "conversations" (ie forum/ facebook banter etc) can and have been very damaging to some, what has been said can be glossed over etc, that which is written, especially in an open arena cannot be refuted as easily, and in some cases at all.
I am sure we both know things about each other that we would prefer weren't put out for public viewing. But the modern generation (gosh that makes me sound old) really don't seem to think like that. There have been a few instances of people loosing their jobs due to what they or their friends posted on facebook around where I work.

It is all about context. Across me is sitting a colleague who is 15 years older than me. Together we are a bit like stattler and waldorf, always grumping about things and especially about each other. What we say to eachother would be grounds for immediate termination if they were taken from one context (2 people who know eachother well, and who are equals when it comes to burning) and transferred to another context (for example me and the insecure girl at QA helpdesk who doesn't talk with me often).

That is why zero tolerance policies are universally stupid, because they don't take context into account. But that is rather different from the point of my article. The above paragraph is more about profanity and interaction with people.

There are times when you need to be firm. But even in those cases, you rarely find that labels are accurate, even (or especially) the loaded ones like terrorist. You can be firm without calling people things that are not accurate. When you do, you are intentionally dumbing yourself down and blocking yourself from rational arguments.

Sorry Bruno, may have been swerving off course a bit. I think we are all working our way to the same point though, some of us might just be stopping off along the way. (by some.of us I might mean me )

Thank you, Bruno. Nuff said.

Words are interesting things. They are a way of simple communication and also loaded to mean something entirely different that is esoteric to the speaker. Your post, Bruno, lead me to believe that you have a hell of a lot more going on in your soul than you posted.
Profanity is just the tip of your ice berg.
The greatest writers have all been profane but were so in the service of the telling of the human experience.
I use profanity liberally, I like it. I find it colorful. It rhymes and is honest.
You, sir, should look into your heart and find out what it is that makes you want to judge others and then use a platform such as a blog to berate them.
BTW, having a blog does not make you a writer nor an authority on any subject, especially the human experience.
All the best,
Folded

Interestingly, you don't know me from Adam, and you think you can accurately 'judge me'?

In case you missed the entire point of my blog post, I was not talking about profanity. What triggered the ideas behind this post was the statement that profanity is ok because 'words don't hurt'. However, the post itself is about how words CAN be used to hurt, and much worse than actual sticks and stones.

Emotionally charged words are also often abused to make people lose focus of the topic at hand. Is that 'honest' as you call it? I think it is not. If a gifted speaker twists words and uses them like a whip to drive a mob into a frenzy, is that 'honest'? No, it is not. It's never honest and rational words that rule a mob. But emotional rallying cries do. If you want to belong to a group of people that acts rationally, then the only way is to be rational yourself as well.

I want groups of people to behave rational. Especially if I am a part of that group. To that end I wrote this blog post. Most of the senior members here want the same thing, actually, which is why we have a large group of likeminded senior members and staff, and why the owner put me in charge as an admin. I don't 'rule by force' to decide how things go around here. That only works for a short time. Decisions here are usually taken with a near unanimous concensus. My blog is a way to give the interested onlooker an idea of what goes into the decision making. It's not a pulpit from which I unilaterally decree how it shall be.

People are free to have a different opinion. If you think profanity is great, you can certainly use it wherever you want. Except for here on this site, because the concensus is that we want a profanity free place. That was the original decision by the original owner, Lynn. Over time, the people who stayed are the ones who (among other things) like this concept.

As for being a writer? Who are you to say I am not? I have written an published many things, both online and in print. And in this position of administrator (and staff member before that) I have dealt with many people and many facets of human experience. I've dealt with thieves and con men. I've dealt with people trying to create problems for others, I've dealt with the problems that arise over jealousy, profit, and a number of other things that motivate man. That doesn't make me an expert, but it does make me qualified to say that I have some idea about human nature in general , and this forum in specific.

Originally Posted by foldedandhoned

Words are interesting things. They are a way of simple communication and also loaded to mean something entirely different that is esoteric to the speaker. Your post, Bruno, lead me to believe that you have a hell of a lot more going on in your soul than you posted.
Profanity is just the tip of your ice berg.
The greatest writers have all been profane but were so in the service of the telling of the human experience.
I use profanity liberally, I like it. I find it colorful. It rhymes and is honest.
You, sir, should look into your heart and find out what it is that makes you want to judge others and then use a platform such as a blog to berate them.
BTW, having a blog does not make you a writer nor an authority on any subject, especially the human experience.
All the best,
Folded

And what exactly makes your views on the matter any more valid than anyone else's? Allow me to educate you on one major point regarding these blogs and this site - Bruno is an Administrator. For all intents and purposes, and certainly as it pertains to you, this is his house and these are his rules. If you do not like those rules, please feel very free to vacate the premises.

James.

Wow,
I could very well vacate the premises but I chose not to. My ideas are mine as well as my interpretation of Bruno's thoughts. If you side with him in a devotee way then so be it. My views are not a rule and in no way do I impose them on anyone. You seem to hold the title of "Administrator" in high regard. In your mind Bruno is untouchable.
I will abide by the rules because I want to be part of this community, but I will not nor do I abide censorship.
I promise not to use profanity or to use this form in a antagonist or defamatory way.
I'm just an honest man who calls it like I see it and am perfectly willing to enter into debate with anyone at anytime.
Bruno answered my post and I agree with him. I was a bit half cocked, as it were, and sent a more emotionally charged response than I should have. My apologies Bruno. Nuff said.

That is just the best poetic mumblejumple written in any "altered state"! I salute just that!

Truer words were never written or spoken. Everyone should remember that words are like bullets. once fired they can not be undone.

Originally Posted by Razorfeld

...snip...
By the way, as an aside. There was a fairly recent study done on foul language and older people. It seems, that in general, as we age we tend to relax more in our use of swear words. Not that it is done consciously but the mental prohibition seems to lessen with age. I find that to be somewhat true in that I have found myself using bad language more frequently in everyday conversation and have to self-censor milli-seconds before I utter it.

Funny; peculiar, I find that as I age I am less inclined to use the foul language that was the common denominator in many workplaces i spent time in. But, since I 've been writing a lot, it has really come to my attention just how often I did without thinking and used it instead of a descriptive word. As in: " Ya know that $%^&* thing #$%^&* won't come off!"
~Richard

Curse words and vulgarity are the crutch of the inarticulate.

Yet I find when I am in the ghetto backed up against the wall ,pre being robbed and beaten , A well strung together cursing tirade is the one manner of communication that garners any type of respect and often diffuses the situation. Environment and Audience seem to be the common thread to usefulness when in less than genteel law abiding situations.
This forum is not that place. Black Friday at Wal-Mart it will have a useful application.