Thread: "Rodgers Cutler to Their Majesty.." Date?

Recent eBay acquisition. Will need to do a restore on this stubby? Can't make out a JR logo on the tang but states "Rodgers Cutler to Their Majesty". I like the fact that it has top and bottom jimps and wedge may be original (not reground). Will try to save the horn scales with some neatsfoot oil soaking and some CA glue. Will need to reshape the damaged scales a bit as well. Will then do some rust clean up on the blade. Hopefully, most of the rust will come off and it will take an edge. Any guesses on the age of this old beauty? 1820s would be my initial guess, but would welcome other thoughts and comments. Thanks

I'd say 1820 - 1830 judging by the shape of the tail.

As I recall from researching my blade.. "Rodgers Cutler to Their Majesty" means it was made between 1837 and 1901 during Queen Victoria's reign. After her husband died in 1901 they changed the logo to: "Rodgers Cutler to Her Majesty"

Here is the wedge I found on the bay recently for a decent price imo.

aj,

I keep seeing these old stub tails, and every time I think...I need to get one of these! Of course my "thinks" don't last long and I forget to look.

Congrats on a very nice and very old treasure!! I'll finally get one...I hope!!

Regards,

Howard

There is an interesting thread here determining the age of a Joseph Rodgers knife. If post #7 is correct then dating a razor stamped "Rodgers Cutlers to Their Majesties" poses a problem. Looking at the physical attributes of the razor might be a better way to go. No expert but from the little I know I think johnmrson ballparked it nicely.

Bob

Originally Posted by BobH

There is an interesting thread here determining the age of a Joseph Rodgers knife. If post #7 is correct then dating a razor stamped "Rodgers Cutlers to Their Majesties" poses a problem. Looking at the physical attributes of the razor might be a better way to go. No expert but from the little I know I think johnmrson ballparked it nicely.

Bob

Thanks for that insightful link on dating JR cutlery. As I relook the tang, it could have had a WR with crown hallmark/logo at some point and would then make the wording appropriate if manufactured between 1830-1837 during the reign of William IV. Thanks for the help on this, AJ

Originally Posted by Tripoli3

As I recall from researching my blade.. "Rodgers Cutler to Their Majesty" means it was made between 1837 and 1901 during Queen Victoria's reign. After her husband died in 1901 they changed the logo to: "Rodgers Cutler to Her Majesty"...

Just to clarify a bit: Queen Victoria's husband, Albert, died in 1861. She was so heart broken that she decreed that the Royal Household would always be referred to as: "Their Majesties". QUEEN VICTORIA DIED in 1901, after which Edward became King and logo's were changed to reflect this: "To His Majesty".

Here's a pic of an old 'Rodgers with the G Crown R ( George Regent) stamp' circa 1821+

I don't think anyone would have dared to include "Cutlers To Their Majesties" in the tang stamp even if they were trying to cut in on Rogers territory. That would have been a bit too close to duplicate if they wanted to avoid litigation.

The first photos in the OP make me date it in the same ballpark as johnmrson did. In "Collecting Straight Razors", author Robert Doyle says that the scales went from being straight sided, as the two stub tail shown below, to having a 'slight curve', as the razor in the OP does in the early 1800s. So assuming the scales are original that is where I would think it would be.

As far as being a "stub tail", maybe I am prejudiced but I think that term is used too loosely nowadays. The two razors, one a Rogers Cast Steel, below, are sure enough stub tails. As the monkey tail began to be elongated it stopped being in the stub tail category AFAIC. Also the absence of a distinction between the edge and tang were characteristics of true stub tails IMHO ........... YMMV.

Originally Posted by JimmyHAD

I don't think anyone would have dared to include "Cutlers To Their Majesties" in the tang stamp even if they were trying to cut in on Rogers territory. That would have been a bit too close to duplicate if they wanted to avoid litigation.

The first photos in the OP make me date it in the same ballpark as johnmrson did. In "Collecting Straight Razors", author Robert Doyle says that the scales went from being straight sided, as the two stub tail shown below, to having a 'slight curve', as the razor in the OP does in the early 1800s. So assuming the scales are original that is where I would think it would be.

As far as being a "stub tail", maybe I am prejudiced but I think that term is used too loosely nowadays. The two razors, one a Rogers Cast Steel, below, are sure enough stub tails. As the monkey tail began to be elongated it stopped being in the stub tail category AFAIC. Also the absence of a distinction between the edge and tang were characteristics of true stub tails IMHO ........... YMMV.

I agree with your and johnmrson's date estimate, but am not sure if this is the original set of scales. They are certainly very early horn. Also agree with your comments about stub tails. Your examples are classic stub tails. Mine is late in the stub tail period. I'd even call it transitional. Believe this period goes to the early 1830s from what I have read in this forum. I have a similar early 1800s cast steel Rodgers as yours that is a favorite.

Don't want get too far into stubtail discussions on this string just hope I can identify someone who has a knowledge of this particular stamp and can tell me if it is part of the "Joseph Rodgers, cutlers to His/their majesties" or is this one a knockoff/fake from the period? Again, I have never seen any other examples in this forum or other SR forums that have a tang marking (razor or knife blade) attributable to JR that this marked exactly like this one? Has anyone else seen this before?