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I'm loving all the different answers and opinions in this thread....I've been reading it daily rubbing my chin and thinking "hmmm, I like that....oh wait...I like that too....".

I agree with Glen. I could say that on my Naniwa 12k I'm always between 10 and 15 strokes, however....the reality is that I'm feeling and listening and looking simultaneously.

I may be at 9...