My newest project

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02-26-2019, 05:09 AM
JellyJar

5 Attachment(s)

My newest project

Been looking for a barbers notch to restore for a while. I came across this at a pretty good price and took a chance. It's a 6/8 with bone scales and is in a lot better condition than I thought it would be :D. The scales have an integral wedge, witch confused me a little as I've only seen this with plastic, but I tested them and they're definitely horn. The scales need some help, but they should be savable. They're slightly translucent now, so I can't wait to see them polished. There's only a couple of pin point pits on one side of the blade and a few more on the spine. The tang has some mild rust around the pivot, so I'll be unpinning it. But, I'm probably not going to do much to the blade. There's very little hone wear and it has an even bevel. The tang stamp indicates 1900 to around 1950 manufacture (if anyone can narrow that window a little...). The tang stamp is Wade & Butcher over Sheffield England over a circled B and an arrow with four fletches pointing to a maltese cross. Got a couple of projects ahead of this one, but I'll probably be asking for some advice in the workshop when I start. Pictures below.

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02-26-2019, 05:40 AM
BobH

I'd say you got yourself a quality razor in very nice condition. There appears to be very little if any hone wear too. You are right, it won't take much restore it too.

The scales are highly savable. When you get them unpinned soak them in pure Neatsfoot oil for a few days to rehydrate them, wipe them dry and allow to air dry for a few days. If there is any delaminating fill with crazy glue and sand. When all the repairs are done sand and polish. For more info on restoring horn scales type "restoring horn scales" in the search box in the upper right corn of the page. You will find threads like this https://sharprazorpalace.com/worksho...rn-scales.html .

If you can't save the original domed washers when you unpin replica ones are available on the net.

Can't help narrowing down the date of manufacture unfortunately. Hopefully one of our members may be able to help in that regard.

Have fun with the project.
02-26-2019, 05:48 AM
Gasman

They did make scales with wedges like that. As you said, mainly on plastic but they did it with horn too. It looks to me as if the collar at the pivot end is different than the one at the wedge end. This could mean the scales are not original to the blade. But a set of horn scales is always nice.

As for unpinning I use a drill press and drill out the peen after taking a tiny flat file to the peen. This gives you a flat spot to drill into. By the time you drill enough to knock the collar off the pin should come out. Gently pry between the scales and it should come apart. But I do mean gentle. I broke a few in my efforts to remove pins.

The horn scales should be soaked in oil for a few days. Neatsfoot oil is great for this. And even if you soak for 2 weeks the scales will be fine. They will need to dry for a couple days after the soaking. Sand and polish the scales. If you find some delaminations in the scales you can clean them out with brake cleaner or starter fluid spray and use a couple drops of super glue in the delaminations. But do this before the oil soak.

That will get you started. I'd recommend you buy a set or 20 (HA) of collars and some pinning rod from AJ Kenney. He is on eBay and is a member here. Just PM him and he can fix you up. You got a good looking blade there so be gentle sanding and it should turn out just fine. Lots of info on restoring razors can be found here. Just take your time and enjoy the fun. Good luck and keep us in the loop as you go.

Looks like Bob and I were typing at the same time. LOL. Dating a W&B can be difficult. They were made for so many years.
02-26-2019, 06:00 AM
cudarunner

You've gotten some very sound advice from the posts above.

As far as if the collars can't be salvaged (I've messed up my share:w) here's a link to Austin here at SRP from there he can direct you to where you can purchase some very nice replacement collars. He's a great guy to work with and his products are top notch! He's also a Vet! :y :tu

http://straightrazorplace.com/members/ajkenne.html
02-26-2019, 06:02 AM
Gasman

You forgot the link Roy. :rofl2:
BTW, Austin is AJ Kenney.
02-26-2019, 06:06 AM
cudarunner

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gasman

You forgot the link Roy. :rofl2:
BTW, Austin is AJ Kenney.

Thanks Jerry, but when I went to fix my FU it showed that I did indeed put the link in my post..That's really strange!

So let's try posting Austin's link again here--

http://sharprazorpalace.com/members/ajkenne.html

Ok, I checked on the preview and the link is there.
02-26-2019, 07:46 AM
Grazor

That don't need no restoring.
Spit, polish, hone and shave...
02-26-2019, 12:36 PM
outback

6 Attachment(s)

I've worked some magic with horn.

Feel free to PM me on any questions or concerns you might have.

Those should come out great.!
Honey horn has got to be the toughest to repair, for me. Being its transparent, its easy to see the repairs on some, others come out looking new.

I always start with a good scrubbin, let dry, then make sure their flattened with the use of a clothes iron. Then sand the scales to remove the nasty oxidation off the outer skin, make all repairs needed, then soak in Neatsfoot for several days. Depending on how dry they are.

Remove from oil, wipe excess off with paper towel and let rest for a day. Sand with steel wool, (0000) then polish.

Attachment 303017

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02-26-2019, 01:44 PM
Geezer

FWW:
I have seen two diameters of "bullseye" domed washers on a Sheffield razor the little ones were enough smaller to be noticeable.Thay were on the pivot end of the scales.
~Richard
02-26-2019, 04:24 PM
Euclid440

Nice find. Unpin by facing the pin head, filing a flat on the dome of the pin. Cut a piece of wood the length of the razor and drill a hole the size of the pin collar for the razor to rest in and keep from trying to balance on the pivot pin on the other side.

Center punch the pin with a sharp punch and drill using a No. 1 Center Drill, not a twist drill bit. A 1/16th inch drill bit will flex and wander.

If you want a clear look you have to finish the inside of the scales, and you can only do that by un-pinning. But you could clean it up a lot without unpinning.

If you do decide to go that way, you can toss the whole razor in a Ziplock bag and soak. As said make any repairs first then soak. The neatsfoot will not harm the blade or pins.

The blade should clean up with some 1000 wet and dry, 600 on the heavy rust spots, and polish up with 0000 steel wool and any good metal polish.

The chips on the edge should come out on the 1k. Make sure to hone with a rolling X stroke to keep that nice smiling edge. And use tape, no sense in wearing away a spine that has lasted all these years.
02-26-2019, 04:40 PM
Gasman

Id be sure to take Outback up on his help. He has the horn magic.
02-27-2019, 01:40 AM
JellyJar

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobH

I'd say you got yourself a quality razor in very nice condition. There appears to be very little if any hone wear too. You are right, it won't take much restore it too.

The scales are highly savable. When you get them unpinned soak them in pure Neatsfoot oil for a few days to rehydrate them, wipe them dry and allow to air dry for a few days. If there is any delaminating fill with crazy glue and sand. When all the repairs are done sand and polish. For more info on restoring horn scales type "restoring horn scales" in the search box in the upper right corn of the page. You will find threads like this https://sharprazorpalace.com/worksho...rn-scales.html .

If you can't save the original domed washers when you unpin replica ones are available on the net.

Can't help narrowing down the date of manufacture unfortunately. Hopefully one of our members may be able to help in that regard.

Have fun with the project.

I've used mineral oil in the past for knife restorations as recommended by the international knife collectors association. Would Neatsfoot oil be better? or is it one of those either one is fine things. I'm optimistic about saving the collars since they are steel.
02-27-2019, 01:47 AM
JellyJar

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gasman

They did make scales with wedges like that. As you said, mainly on plastic but they did it with horn too. It looks to me as if the collar at the pivot end is different than the one at the wedge end. This could mean the scales are not original to the blade. But a set of horn scales is always nice.

As for unpinning I use a drill press and drill out the peen after taking a tiny flat file to the peen. This gives you a flat spot to drill into. By the time you drill enough to knock the collar off the pin should come out. Gently pry between the scales and it should come apart. But I do mean gentle. I broke a few in my efforts to remove pins.

The horn scales should be soaked in oil for a few days. Neatsfoot oil is great for this. And even if you soak for 2 weeks the scales will be fine. They will need to dry for a couple days after the soaking. Sand and polish the scales. If you find some delaminations in the scales you can clean them out with brake cleaner or starter fluid spray and use a couple drops of super glue in the delaminations. But do this before the oil soak.

That will get you started. I'd recommend you buy a set or 20 (HA) of collars and some pinning rod from AJ Kenney. He is on eBay and is a member here. Just PM him and he can fix you up. You got a good looking blade there so be gentle sanding and it should turn out just fine. Lots of info on restoring razors can be found here. Just take your time and enjoy the fun. Good luck and keep us in the loop as you go.

Looks like Bob and I were typing at the same time. LOL. Dating a W&B can be difficult. They were made for so many years.

Good to know integral wedges were done with horn. One of the collars is dinged on one side like someone was trying to adjust the blade position and missed. I'd like to save the collars as they go with the history of the razor. If not I'll look up AJ. I've been using the drill press method exclusively since I tried the flush cut once, it worked, but made me real nervous about damaging stuff.
02-27-2019, 01:49 AM
JellyJar

Quote:

Originally Posted by cudarunner

Thanks Jerry, but when I went to fix my FU it showed that I did indeed put the link in my post..That's really strange!

So let's try posting Austin's link again here--

http://sharprazorpalace.com/members/ajkenne.html

Ok, I checked on the preview and the link is there.

Thanks for the link, that'll save me some searching.
02-27-2019, 01:49 AM
JellyJar

Quote:

Originally Posted by outback

I've worked some magic with horn.

Feel free to PM me on any questions or concerns you might have.

Those should come out great.!
Honey horn has got to be the toughest to repair, for me. Being its transparent, its easy to see the repairs on some, others come out looking new.

I always start with a good scrubbin, let dry, then make sure their flattened with the use of a clothes iron. Then sand the scales to remove the nasty oxidation off the outer skin, make all repairs needed, then soak in Neatsfoot for several days. Depending on how dry they are.

Remove from oil, wipe excess off with paper towel and let rest for a day. Sand with steel wool, (0000) then polish.

Attachment 303017

Attachment 303018

Attachment 303019

Attachment 303020

Attachment 303021

Attachment 303022

Wow those look really good. Hope mine clean up that nice!
02-27-2019, 01:55 AM
JellyJar

Quote:

Originally Posted by Euclid440

Nice find. Unpin by facing the pin head, filing a flat on the dome of the pin. Cut a piece of wood the length of the razor and drill a hole the size of the pin collar for the razor to rest in and keep from trying to balance on the pivot pin on the other side.

Center punch the pin with a sharp punch and drill using a No. 1 Center Drill, not a twist drill bit. A 1/16th inch drill bit will flex and wander.

If you want a clear look you have to finish the inside of the scales, and you can only do that by un-pinning. But you could clean it up a lot without unpinning.

If you do decide to go that way, you can toss the whole razor in a Ziplock bag and soak. As said make any repairs first then soak. The neatsfoot will not harm the blade or pins.

The blade should clean up with some 1000 wet and dry, 600 on the heavy rust spots, and polish up with 0000 steel wool and any good metal polish.

The chips on the edge should come out on the 1k. Make sure to hone with a rolling X stroke to keep that nice smiling edge. And use tape, no sense in wearing away a spine that has lasted all these years.

Good to know about the inside of the scales. I was mostly going to unpin to make sure I get any active rust out of the pivot. I do want that translucent look so I won't skimp on the inside surface - good tip.

My plan with the blade is to be really gentle, I'd like to preserve as much of the original look as possible. I just want to stop any further degradation.

Under magnification the edge is really clean, no chips. May just be the light in the photos.
02-27-2019, 04:49 AM
BobH

Quote:

Originally Posted by JellyJar

I've used mineral oil in the past for knife restorations as recommended by the international knife collectors association. Would Neatsfoot oil be better? or is it one of those either one is fine things. I'm optimistic about saving the collars since they are steel.

No idea if mineral oil would be a good substitute for pure Neatsfoot oil. Pure Neatsfoot oil is made from the shins and feet of cattle so would seem a natural for revitalizing horn scales. It must be pure Neatsfoot oil and not the variety that contains other additives as well.

All you can do is try and save the collars but sometimes things go wrong but there are period correct replacements available. I'd give careful consideration to what Euclid44o said in post #10 regarding how to unpin a razor.

Bob
02-27-2019, 12:54 PM
outback

1 Attachment(s)

A doming block from Harbour Freight, and you can fix the original shape of the collars.

Attachment 303061
02-27-2019, 05:05 PM
cudarunner

Here's the link to the 'Dapping Block'

https://www.harborfreight.com/catalo...=dapping+block

There are smaller sets out there---
02-27-2019, 06:55 PM
ajkenne

Quote:

Originally Posted by JellyJar

Thanks for the link, that'll save me some searching.

JellyJar for your convenience. https://www.ebay.com/usr/ajkenne4xm3 Thanks, Austin/AJ
02-27-2019, 07:13 PM
Gasman

1 Attachment(s)

Austin just wanted to post a picture of himself. :rofl2:
Kidding.

I have one of those dapping blocks. Thanks Roy. Ive used it often. Its a nice tool to have. Ive made my own collars with it. Nothing fancy but good enough for basic razors.
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02-28-2019, 02:18 AM
JellyJar

Quote:

Originally Posted by outback

A doming block from Harbour Freight, and you can fix the original shape of the collars.

Attachment 303061

Hold on a minute, you mean I got a new razor AND an excuse to buy tools! Oh, man this forum rocks. Wait is that new tunnel in this rabbit hole?:)
02-28-2019, 02:31 AM
cudarunner

1 Attachment(s)

Quote:

Originally Posted by JellyJar

Hold on a minute, you mean I got a new razor AND an excuse to buy tools! Oh, man this forum rocks. Wait is that new tunnel in this rabbit hole?:)

Down the Rabbit hole you and Alice go-------------------------------------

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02-28-2019, 06:01 PM
Gasman

Next thing you know you will be pricing a new 2×72 belt grinder. Just be sure you have room.
03-01-2019, 02:13 AM
JellyJar

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gasman

Next thing you know you will be pricing a new 2×72 belt grinder. Just be sure you have room.

I've worked long and hard to keep my hobbies in check, been fighting the urge for a lathe for at least 15 years. Fortunately my father has a lot similar hobbies, so we can share tool space. I wonder if he'd want to start shaping his own blades instead of just putting handles on...:hmmm: