Restore newb needs opinions

I've PMd several people and am reading conflicting things. I'm thinking of handsanding.

I just want a mirror finish, maybe bring the scales back a bit and get her honed up.

What does pitting look like? I don't see what I'd call rust, and I don't see any pits either...but I'm a newb.

How would you go about this restore?


http://img526.imageshack.us/img526/8060/p1020305.th.jpg
http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/2091/p1020306.th.jpg
http://img154.imageshack.us/img154/6350/p1020307.th.jpg
http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/6...020309o.th.jpg

I'd buff it. But I imagine you don't have the equipment for that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by floppyshoes

I'd buff it. But I imagine you don't have the equipment for that.

---

What do I need to buff metal? MAAS? I can buy it (I've got 5 other blades on their way in similar condition as this, I imagine). You don't think it needs a full regrind?

What damage do you see on the blade?

BTW, the photos are really big. Click the links above, then click again and once more to get the whole thing.

Its kind of hard to tell from the photos, but I see a couple of things (I think). In the second photo, on the spine near the toe I see what looks like some pitting to me, also I think that you may find some pitting underneath the dark spots you see all over the blade... most of this should go away with handsanding/buffing. Also, you've got some hone wear, and maybe some heat damage (really can't tell, could be something else) on the edge side of the toe.

that's what it looks like to me anyhow.:shrug:

For this you'd need:

• A buffer (1/2 hp minimum)
• A sturdy workbench to mount it on
• Appropriate mandrels
• A set of greaseless compounds and rouges
• Sisal and Cotton Wheels, one for each compound

And last, but not least, the skill and know how required to avoid shooting a hot razor into your belly.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ichinichi

What do I need to buff metal? MAAS? I can buy it (I've got 5 other blades on their way in similar condition as this, I imagine). You don't think it needs a full regrind?

What damage do you see on the blade?

BTW, the photos are really big. Click the links above, then click again and once more to get the whole thing.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ichinichi

What do I need to buff metal? MAAS? I can buy it

---

I believe Dan meant buff it on a 'buffer'- a machine that uses buffing wheels charged with abrasive.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Del1r1um

Its kind of hard to tell from the photos, but I see a couple of things (I think). In the second photo, on the spine near the toe I see what looks like some pitting to me, also I think that you may find some pitting underneath the dark spots you see all over the blade... most of this should go away with handsanding/buffing. Also, you've got some hone wear, and maybe some heat damage (really can't tell, could be something else) on the edge side of the toe.

that's what it looks like to me anyhow.:shrug:

---

You mean the black gunk? It looks like its from the scale...scale rot? I don't even know what that looks like, just things I've read here. But it is raised off of the blade.

Edge side of the toe looks like heat damage to me as well...but could be something else?

Well, if it's only gunk that comes off easily then I may be wrong, but from the pictures I've zoomed in on I'm betting that you'll find pits underneath the black stuff... also the small pinpoint black spots look like they will have pits underneath...
Attachment 24760

Attachment 24761

again it's really hard to say without seeing it in person, but I'm betting that as soon as you try to take that dark stuff off and polish the blade you'll find pits. Also, if that is heat damage on the toe, you may be in for more trouble than this razor is worth... if the temper is ruined on the blade it's not going to be pretty.

All the dark spots you see on the blade is pitting. The heavy staining you see on the spine towards the toe is heavy pitting. In my experience most can be removed but you will be left with remaining residual pits or stains. Sometimes the pitting goes so deep that even a total reground will not help unless you have plenty of steel to remove and it's a bigger blade giving you some room to loose steel. But even that doesn't give you a guarantee.

Completely hand sanding is an option but be prepared to spend countless hours sanding from the low to the high grits. A buffer like Dan suggest is the fastest way to go but unless you have the right equipment and products to do so and know exactly what you're doing.
And don't even mention the word Dremel or you will turn Glen aka The G-man turn around from his grave. All jokes aside. Safety when working with any of your blades should be your main priority especially if you have no prior experience.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Maximilian

All the dark spots you see on the blade is pitting. The heavy staining you see on the spine towards the toe is heavy pitting. In my experience most can be removed but you will be left with remaining residual pits or stains. Sometimes the pitting goes so deep that even a total reground will not help unless you have plenty of steel to remove and it's a bigger blade giving you some room to loose steel. But even that doesn't give you a guarantee.

Completely hand sanding is an option but be prepared to spend countless hours sanding from the low to the high grits. A buffer like Dan suggest is the fastest way to go but unless you have the right equipment and products to do so and know exactly what you're doing.
And don't even mention the word Dremel or you will turn Glen aka The G-man turn around from his grave. All jokes aside. Safety when working with any of your blades should be your main priority especially if you have no prior experience.

---

+1 Even retarded Norm Abram knows to where safety glasses :rofl2:

sigh...back it goes, I guess.

Ah, don't worry about it. Some of the blades I have attempted are much worse. Just start with some sandpaper and giv'r. Looks like you have a lot of metal there to work with.

I'd start with a 400 or 600 grit paper, to remove the worst of the gunk and investigate the pitting. If you feel that you are making good progress, then just keep going. It may take a little while, but you won't have to worry about big scratches from lower grit paper.

If you find a bunch of deep pits that you must get out, then drop down to 80 or 120 grit and get rid of the pits. Then work your way up through the grits, removing the scratches as you go. Obviously, read the hand sanding how to from the wiki.

Then polish with MAAS for shine.

I'll take a totally random stab in the dark and say you will need roughly about 5 - 8 hours of sanding to get it pretty smooth and shiny, then another couple of hours for polishing. That is just the time for the blade. It may take less, it may take more, but now you have an idea of what to expect.

Just remember, if you are going to try for a mirror shine (not necessary by any means) it takes a bunch of time and unless you are more patient than I, you may not get it with your first restore.

Hey thanks, dnjrboy!

I'm unsure whether the blade is truely that far gone or whether the restoration masters have (understandably) higher standards than what I'm after.

Restoration-meisters, I am not hoping to get it to the point where I can list it for $285 or to the point where it looks like the ones exhibited on your respective sites.

I'd like to clean up the blade to where she's a respectable representative of the WB Barbers only line in my modest collection.

I understand that its probably not worth sending it off for a restore. BUT, prompted by the encouraging post above, before I return this blade to the seller:

PLEASE, honestly, is what I want really so impossible/not worthwhile?

That blade should clean up, it will take you some time with the sandpapers, but it should clean up all right. The only thing on that blade that really has me worried is the heat mark... it should get to the point that you may like, but if the heat has ruined the temper on the toe, you may not get it/keep it sharp enough.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ichinichi

I've PMd several people and am reading conflicting things. I'm thinking of handsanding.

I just want a mirror finish, maybe bring the scales back a bit and get her honed up.

What does pitting look like? I don't see what I'd call rust, and I don't see any pits either...but I'm a newb.

How would you go about this restore?

---

They actually only answered what you asked, a mirror finish is pretty hard to obtain, and they were pointing to that the "Rust" had already gone beyond the stage of being the red stuff you were looking for.....The black staining has serious pitting in there....

Anyone can slap some sandpaper and MAAS on a blade and call it restored but the people that answered your question were assuming you were actually looking for a true restoration... Just a matter of semantics no harm done....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by gssixgun

They actually only answered what you asked, a mirror finish is pretty hard to obtain, and they were pointing to that the "Rust" had already gone beyond the stage of being the red stuff you were looking for.....The black staining has serious pitting in there....

Anyone can slap some sandpaper and MAAS on a blade and call it restored but the people that answered your question were assuming you were actually looking for a true restoration... Just a matter of semantics no harm done....

---

Oooooh.

My bad. Pardon my newbness. I didn't know how difficult it is to get a mirror finish. I just figured that it would come with progression up to higher grits and then some MAAS. I can see now if it is a LOT of work to get the mirror finish, how if all that work was just to have an imperfect mirror could be considered a waste of effort.

So, "red rust" is preferable to black?

:gaah: Not to prolong this:

Bottom line is I have two options

1. Return it. My cost then would be shipping one way (seller will cover return shipping and full cost of the blade).

2. Keep it and handsand it until I'm happy (or my arms fall off). I wouldn't be out a huge amount in this case either. I'll need to purchase the sandpaper anyway since I've got five other projects on the way anyway, so that's not an added cost in this option.

My fears are:

1. Sanding takes MUCH longer than I anticipate (which is 10 hours)
2. It'll still look like crap even at its best

I do like this razor (so I'll likely have more patience) because:

1. Its a 6/8 WB Barber (I don't think I'd like it any bigger) but I love the way they look.
2. The scales are in good shape and I like their feel
3. It might keep me motivated enough to be knowledgable with respect to restoration, if not in practice than at least in understanding and thus have a more successful ebay experience later.




Advice?

There is the rub, we can give all the "advice" in the world but not one of us can say for sure until we actually start on a blade....

I can't even say "for sure" if the edge will hold until I test it...

Sorry but there just are no guarantees when it comes to restores, you puts yer monies down and ya rolls the dice :p

From one relative newbie to another, don't sweat it.

In an hour and a half's time you can have that razor "shiny" and assuming the toe isn't heat damaged, perfectly fine for shaving with. You won't be winning any awards or have anything remotely resembling the masterpiece's coming out of the master restorers shops, but you'll have a fine "consumer grade" shaver that looks respectable.

Anyway, start at 220 grit and work up to 2000 grit, handsanding, and then hit it with some maas. If you've done a good job, it will be nearly mirror shiny except for the dark pitted spots where the pits are, and any scratches you didn't remove properly on the way up. But, big deal? If nothing else, it's a good razor to practice sanding on. If the pits are going to bother you and you really want them gone, well then, good luck :p

You're making more out of this than I think you need to. Just give it a whirl. Be careful around the edge of course, it's sharper than you think even when it's very dull, and let us know how hand sanding turns out. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by pjrage

From one relative newbie to another, don't sweat it.

In an hour and a half's time you can have that razor "shiny" and assuming the toe isn't heat damaged, perfectly fine for shaving with. You won't be winning any awards or have anything remotely resembling the masterpiece's coming out of the master restorers shops, but you'll have a fine "consumer grade" shaver that looks respectable.

Anyway, start at 220 grit and work up to 2000 grit, handsanding, and then hit it with some maas. If you've done a good job, it will be nearly mirror shiny except for the dark pitted spots where the pits are, and any scratches you didn't remove properly on the way up. But, big deal? If nothing else, it's a good razor to practice sanding on. If the pits are going to bother you and you really want them gone, well then, good luck :p

You're making more out of this than I think you need to. Just give it a whirl. Be careful around the edge of course, it's sharper than you think even when it's very dull, and let us know how hand sanding turns out. I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.

---

Well said :tu

I have learn that the 80/20 also applies for restorations....

if you spend 20% of the time needed to make a perfect restoration....you will get a Razor 80% perfect....

but that 80% will give you a lot of perfect shaves....

I have a piece coming in much worse shape than yours, the way I'm looking at it is that it will be lots of opportunity to learn the handsanding technique.
If at the end of it you are left with a blade that cannot take an edge then atleast you learned how to do it for next time. You wont know until you try it.

Thanks everyone for your comments, opinions and encouragement! I've decided to keep her and see what a little effort can get me. For those interested, the thread (with pics) is here.