Buffer Question

I'm looking really hard at a buffer. Need a little push over the edge.

I've done a couple blades with sandpaper and have a dozen more on the table. I've got all my materials ready to go.

I would be getting a cheaper one. (No Baldors, Caswell has a starter pack for a little over $100.) I figure on another $100 for PPE

The real question is if they are "worth it" for a guy who want to do maybe a dozen a year and sell just enough of them to feed his R/HAD?

The second question is just how "fast" are they? I've done handsanding, and so I know it really really depends on how bad the blade is to start out with. By hand it takes me a week of working on the blades at night. (Most of mine start out pretty rough)

So are we talking 2 or 3 evening on a buffer...or more like 2 or 3 hours?

I started out with a bench grinder and still use it to compliment my Caswell buffer. To just buff the blades it goes really quick. When you get into the greaseless compounds the time required depends on your experience. Be aware that the amount of of grinding you can perform on a hollow ground razor is limited. Also, SAFETY FIRST, LAST AND ALWAYS! Very easy to get a major hurt with a buffing motor or bench grinder.

depends on the amount of pitting, but, I'd say 2-3 hours is probably a fair average estimate.

Remember, not only do you need the buffer, but, you also need 3-4 wheels of the same diameter to hold your greaseless compounds..and then you need 2 additional wheels (one for emery, one for a white rouge..as a barebone setup..)...

At $6-7 a pop, they add up...and the compounds themselves will run you $50-60...

Suggestions -- buy two wheels for 80 grit...you can use one wheel while the other wheel's greaseless compound dries...since you'll be using 80grit to do all of the pitting removal.

When you buy yourself a buffer (or cheaper bench grinder..) make sure you can remove the guards (if its a grinder) and make 100% sure it is a 1700-1800 rpm motor.... you don't want to be doing greaseless compounds on a 3400rpm buffer..if you can find a variable speed 1700-3400 that would be cool because you can do some high speed buffing work with it too..

If you don't have a respirator, you'll need one of those too...and then,..a leather apron...

Expenses add up. a $100 bench grinder ends up costing $350 after you get what you need to use it.

If your using it as Hobbyist, I'd go for the Delta adjustable speed buffer/grinder. It's great, once you take off all the safety guards, etc...I use Enkay buffing compounds, here's a pic of it with the safety guards on.
It works great if it's just for your razors, and then some....I like the fact that it adjusts from 1725 or so up 3500, so it multi tasks....

P.S. I got it at Lowes on sale no less, What a great day that was....

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Originally Posted by Soilarch

I'm looking really hard at a buffer. Need a little push over the edge.

I've done a couple blades with sandpaper and have a dozen more on the table. I've got all my materials ready to go.

I would be getting a cheaper one. (No Baldors, Caswell has a starter pack for a little over $100.) I figure on another $100 for PPE

The real question is if they are "worth it" for a guy who want to do maybe a dozen a year and sell just enough of them to feed his R/HAD?

The second question is just how "fast" are they? I've done handsanding, and so I know it really really depends on how bad the blade is to start out with. By hand it takes me a week of working on the blades at night. (Most of mine start out pretty rough)

So are we talking 2 or 3 evening on a buffer...or more like 2 or 3 hours?

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There's also some great info on this thread:
http://straightrazorpalace.com/works...fo-thread.html

I'm also looking into one and leaning heavily towards the Harbor Freight 6" based on Glen's comments:
- Harbor Freight Tools - Quality Tools at the Lowest Prices

It's 0.5HP and 3450 RPM (manual says 3600 RPM) and they're pretty cheap. Now I was also worried about the constant high RPM, but the G-man says he uses his slower buffer for final polish [permalink]. For $50 I'm willing to give it a try.

RPMs are quoted a lot, but are not the whole story. If you have a meaty machine capable of taking different sized wheels, then you have to consider the rate that the wheel surface is moving across the razor - surface feet per minute (sfpm).

If you have a rpm rate of 1725 with an 8 inch wheel, the sfpm rate is 3450.

If you have a rpm rate of 1725 with a 6 inch wheel, the sfpm rate is 2588.

Using the same machine and a 4 inch wheel the sfpm rate is the same - 1725.

It is not of much importance if you buy a buffer that is designed for one size of wheel, though, but worth bearing in mind if buy a larger buffer: by using different wheel diameters you can vary the sfpm to suit the job. It is probably of more importance in the UK where variable speed buffers are rare and expensive or too small and underpowered to do an efficient job.

My solution was to buy a purpose made heavy duty spindle and connect it to a motor with a step-pulley and v-belt.

Regards,
Neil

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Originally Posted by Neil Miller

RPMs are quoted a lot, but are not the whole story. If you have a meaty machine capable of taking different sized wheels, then you have to consider the rate that the wheel surface is moving across the razor - surface feet per minute (sfpm).

If you have a rpm rate of 1725 with an 8 inch wheel, the sfpm rate is 3450.

If you have a rpm rate of 1725 with a 6 inch wheel, the sfpm rate is 2588.

Using the same machine and a 4 inch wheel the sfpm rate is the same - 1725.

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I invoke the Law of Calvin!

http://www.marcellosendos.ch/comics/...6/19940628.gif

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Originally Posted by Undream

.......
Remember, not only do you need the buffer, but, you also need
......
If you don't have a respirator, you'll need one of those too...and then,..a leather apron...
.......

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+1 on the safety gear.

Also dust exhaust venting.

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Originally Posted by commiecat

I invoke the Law of Calvin!

http://www.marcellosendos.ch/comics/...6/19940628.gif

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The Law of Calvin - I like that!

The examples above were given using a rough formula of 0.25 the wheel diameter (in inches) multiplied by the rpm. I have just googled "surface feet per minute" and it appears that there are lots of online calculators that do it more accurately.

Regards,
Neil

I had planned on the apron, have a respirator for some of my current chores, but did not realize the compounds themselves where that expensive.

Unfortunately (or perhaps, it's fortunately?) I've learn time and time again that "the tool" or "the toy" is only a fraction of the cost.


I went back to the Caswell site. I had thought they had a 1/4hp 1725 "kit" for around a $100...and I was completely wrong. They have a 1/3hp 3400 "kit"...don't think that's what I'm looking. Apparently I got the Caswell offerings and the Baldor offerings confused. Baldors are out of my price range. (Although I'm sure they're worth it. They're what we have on most of our grainbin load-out augers...and that's a legit task.)

So it looks like Zib's delta suggestion may be the ticket. $100 bucks for the grinder + Caswell Inc. - Buffing Kits for $57 (s+h) Sets me at about $170...

....which brings me to two more questions, if I may.

Aprons: Seems a lot of things marketed to "woodworking" are high priced to me. I guess woodworking is an effluent hobby? Anyway, instead of a 'turner's apron' wouldn't a welder's apron+arm chaps work AND cover my arms? Those things are rough but they're cheaper, and cover more real estate. They're rawhide, don't see how a turner's apron can be much thicker or tougher.

Wheels...is it better to be oversized (6" on hollow-grind) or undersized (4" on wedge)?

Thanks

Aprons aren't required. I haven't been using one but I do get all gunked up. The woodworkers turning apron would work best as it covers your shoulders. When getting splattered it's usually from the waist up. Ya might want to consider a hat of some type or a shower cap.

As for wheel size, it depends on the rpm of the motor. With greaseless compounds 3600 fpm surface speed is almost too fast as it is easy to burn the metal but 1100 fps may be too slow. I feel between 2700 and 3600 if a good range. To calculate surface speed: SFPM = 1/4 x diameter of Wheel x RPM (revs of spindle per min.)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Soilarch

Aprons: Seems a lot of things marketed to "woodworking" are high priced to me. I guess woodworking is an effluent hobby? Anyway, instead of a 'turner's apron' wouldn't a welder's apron+arm chaps work AND cover my arms? Those things are rough but they're cheaper, and cover more real estate. They're rawhide, don't see how a turner's apron can be much thicker or tougher.

Wheels...is it better to be oversized (6" on hollow-grind) or undersized (4" on wedge)?

Thanks

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I use a welders apron and it is fine. Be careful about what you cover your arms and hands with though - you don't really want anything loose or flapping that can get caught in the wheels - big, floppy loose fingers on gauntlets are a definite no-no.

As for wheel size, the larger the wheel the shallower the curve, so a larger wheel would be less suitable for a hollow-ground razor. I have found that with 4 inch wheels it is a sometimes a bit of an effort to get in under the spine of a well hollow ground razor. FWIW, some of the old sheffield razors underwent grinding on many wheels of various diameter, down to as small as 2 or 3 inches.

Regards,
Neil

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Originally Posted by Joed

Ya might want to consider a hat of some type or a shower cap.

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I'm looking for a buffer -- could you recommend some good shower caps for shop work? Post images if possible, too!

:)

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Originally Posted by commiecat

I'm looking for a buffer -- could you recommend some good shower caps for shop work? Post images if possible, too!

:)

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I vote for a porkpie hat - keeps the dirt of your head and makes you look like Jimmy "popeye" Doyle, who was a bit of a grinder... :)

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Originally Posted by Neil Miller

I vote for a porkpie hat - keeps the dirt of your head and makes you look like Jimmy "popeye" Doyle, who was a bit of a grinder... :)

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I do have a little trouble keeping my propeller beanie on over the face shield.........:):):):)

I needed a little humor this morning ....... :rock: