Thread: First go at a bevel set with a warped razor

Originally Posted by Euclid440

That warp is not bad, really almost normal, nothing a Rolling X stroke will not easily take care of...

Here is a great video of

Charlie Lewis using a rolling x

...

I watched Randydance and Charlie and their rolling-x'ing a lot at the Asheville, NC, 2014 meet last year.

Yes, the warp was not a extreme; I tried rolling-x's for a while yesterday and seemed to get farther, not closer, to a bevel set so I put it up and decided to try something else. Not exactly sure how to evalute progress with a rolling-x except by thumb pad, arm hair and how fluid addresses the blade during the corrective stroke; am sure my workmanship wasn't making improvements in either. Did I just quit too soon?

And, by the way, if you correct a warp (small or large) with a rolling-x, how will the blade hone and strop down the road? Will it need to be refreshed with similar technique?

Sounds like you should keep at it. I too use a king 1k. When I want it to cut a little faster I just lap it fairly often, pretty much when it starts feeling like it isn't cutting anymore. 4 or 5 swipes with a worn 325 dmt is enough for mine.

As for stropping I use a rolling x on pretty much everything regardless of how much or little the blade smiles. Seems to work well.

As for the rolling stroke I find it makes it easier to get too heavy of a hand. I believe this is due to the small amount of bevel in contact with the hone at any given time.

Ink… Ink the bevel and check the bevel to see how much ink is removed. If you are removing ink, you are removing steel and eventually will flatten the bevel completely.

It takes a bit, to feel, how much you need to rock, it gets a lot easier once you learn how much or how little to rock. It is really, very little rock, on some, like a razor I honed today, with a little smile, it just needed a pressure shift from heel to toe, the full blade was on the stone, the whole time, never lifted off the stone until the heel came off the stone edge.

Ink is your friend and is cheap, use lots of it, I use colored ink, it is easy to see without magnification. Black, can look like a shadow. WD40 removes any residue.
Don’t forget to drop the heel off the edge of the stone on the concave side of the razor, so you are honing the concave side, on a small flat part of the hone. Depending on the warp you will only use half to a third of the stone width. If you try to use the whole stone, you will hit the heel and toe and the middle will not touch the stone.
Think about, if you were trying to hone the edge of half a hoop, on the convex side you would have a large rolling motion and the concave side you could only use a thin portion of the stone near the edge.

The strop will flex and work just fine, extra gymnastics are not needed. You are not correcting the warp, you can't. You are compensating for it.

Yes, to touch up, you will use the same strokes, you use the same strokes for all the stones. You just have to figure out how much rock you need, ink will easily tell you, just keep inking the bevel. Go slow, It gets easier and you use less and less ink. It is quicker to use ink than break out a loupe.

I use ink too, but even when I can see where the problem area is I can't get it honed sometimes...
Good job working through the warp and getting it ready to shave!

Yes, it can take a little time to learn. Just go slow and keep looking at the ink. Eventually you learn to watch the water and see where you are making contact on the blade.

Remember with a warped blade, one side is rocked the other is honed off one edge of the stone, keep the heel on the stone until the half way point of the length, otherwise the heel does not get any time on the stone.

Some hands on time, with a mentor will speed up your learning curve, really there is a lot going on and not as simple, as explained, because you have to learn to read the razor and progress. Anyone can hone a flat razor, but few are.

Aside from ink, water is another friend. Remember to watch the water on the hone. If the blade is not pushing the water, then the edge is not touching the hone. Adjust your stroke so that the the water is being pushed.

Originally Posted by Euclid440

Ink… Ink the bevel and check the bevel to see how much ink is removed...

Yes, to touch up, you will use the same strokes, you use the same strokes for all the stones. You just have to figure out how much rock you need, ink will easily tell you, just keep inking the bevel. Go slow, It gets easier and you use less and less ink. It is quicker to use ink than break out a loupe.

Ink of course; I got absorbed in the moment. I need to keep a Sharpie with the stones.

I agree with what Euclid is saying about using a rolling X stroke and how to go about it. Most all of my vintage razors have a warp/twist to some degree or other making learning the rolling X stoke a must. By using it you are not "correcting" the warp/twist just compensating for the warp/twist.

Bob

Not one to leave well enough alone (and still stinging from forgetting about ink) I returned to several razors today, one of which has been problematic. Where yesterdays inkless rolling-x failed, todays plus-ink instantly showed visually where to correct and quickly produced (shocking) a good bevel. This improved technique along with getting my dilucot thing worked out made for a rapid jump-shift in razor sharpness, smoothness and uniformity.

As always, thanks for the patience getting me rerouted; it's nice to finally have this method producing like it should. This is a real morale booster in what has otherwise been a remarkably tough year for figuring out things that used to be obvious.