Thread: Questions for Honemeisters

Dear Honies,

I was wondering if there is any criteria for choosing which stroke to use when sharpening. It would make sense to me to try to use the one most suited to the condition of the blade, but when do you make the decision to breadknife? Obviously chips are a good sign, but should you try to use one of the 4 strokes (from the wiki) as long as possible for convenience? Or is there a certain amount of smile that is too much?

Also, what are the expectations of customers? Do they just want a sharp blade, or do they (or should they) have preferences as to how you sharpen?

Thanks!

"Customers" want a razor so sharp that you don't need to strop it or know how to use it to make it shave.

I don't choose stroke patterns. I simply imagine what needs to happen, based on the geometry presented and use an appropriate stroke.

What needs to happen = what I do. Hope that makes sense.

Originally Posted by AFDavis11

"Customers" want a razor so sharp that you don't need to strop it or know how to use it to make it shave.

I don't choose stroke patterns. I simply imagine what needs to happen, based on the geometry presented and use an appropriate stroke.

What needs to happen = what I do. Hope that makes sense.

It makes sense to me

in my case it's: what I do = what happens

Originally Posted by jendeindustries

Dear Honies,

I was wondering if there is any criteria for choosing which stroke to use when sharpening. It would make sense to me to try to use the one most suited to the condition of the blade, but when do you make the decision to breadknife? Obviously chips are a good sign, but should you try to use one of the 4 strokes (from the wiki) as long as possible for convenience? Or is there a certain amount of smile that is too much?

Also, what are the expectations of customers? Do they just want a sharp blade, or do they (or should they) have preferences as to how you sharpen?

Thanks!

I am going to try and tackle this for you...

First off bread knifing a razor is not part of honing, it falls on the restoration side of the fence... Chips within the bevel pretty much honing, chips larger than the bevel pretty much restoration...

Frowns = restoration
Wowies as in a smiles and a frown or a double frown = restoration....
A smiling blade or a worn toe = honing

Now one of the worst mistakes you can make is taking a nicked blade and trying to just "hone" it out... I was trying to explain this in another thread today also, but a nick or chip can change to a crack so fast it is scary, especially in full hollows....

Now what Alan and Kevin are saying is so simple, if you run the razor down the stone you can see the ripple of water moving in front of the edge... Make sure that every single spot on the edge touches the stone equally and you get a sharp razor... All you have to do is make the ripple move down the edge, it really is that simple... Whatever stroke you have to do to accomplish that on each blade determines the stoke to use....
The only difference to that rule is if you happen to be cutting a fresh bevel then you have to create the whole thing...

Hope that helps answer what you were asking...

Thanks guys!

Glen - your description of what is sharpening and restoration is exactly what I was trying to wrap my head around. In other sharpening, there is little, or no line between the two. In fact, your descriptions would technically make me more of a restorer than a sharpener at this point....

OK, so I am finding more and more success with my 2 razors, each time I sharpen them, I am getting closer and closer to what I want. Unfortunately, over the years, I have done so many things to the blades that I'm worried I really screwed things up.

I wasn't getting an even edge with the marker test, and I had to do some acrobatics with the blade to get then entire thing that was making me very uncomfortable. I kept thinking that if I were to sharpen razors for customers in the future, which I'd like to do, That this wouldn't be acceptable. I figured maybe instead of my sharpening experiment with the bad ebay razors, I would try to get my own good, but not great, razors into a like-new condition.

So I breadknifed my Theirs-Issard because the heel and tip were just not getting honed. The blade was a smiley, so I just flattened it out on a 1K Shapton pro stone. It took less than five minutes.

I spent about 1 hour, really taking my time, to set the bevel using a 500 glass, and switching to a 1k as the new edge approached. When I finally got a new edge, I switched to the glass 2K, 4K, and by the 8K, the blade was something that I have never really seen before - really sharp! I checked the edge under the microscope @60x, and it looked nice and even. I took the edge up to the 16K glass, and finished pyramid style on the 30K.

Too bad I already shaved this morning, and won't be shaving for at least 3-4 days....... I can't wait.

I will be doing this to my Solingin Bismark next, even though I have been quite pleased with my last 2 shaves with it.

Originally Posted by jendeindustries

So I breadknifed my Theirs-Issard because the heel and tip were just not getting honed. The blade was a smiley, so I just flattened it out on a 1K Shapton pro stone. It took less than five minutes.

I will be doing this to my Solingin Bismark next, even though I have been quite pleased with my last 2 shaves with it.

Say it ain't so Tom, take a look at this thread here and maybe this video series here. Than go and sin no more.

Wow. That's a good lesson. Looks like I was doing the right thing all along.... I thought there would be some kind of limit to the rolling X, but I guess not.

Does a smile ever get so big that it would need straightening out?

Originally Posted by jendeindustries

Wow. That's a good lesson. Looks like I was doing the right thing all along.... I thought there would be some kind of limit to the rolling X, but I guess not.

Does a smile ever get so big that it would need straightening out?

Check out this one here. Rolling X stroke throughout.

Edit; check out this thread here for pix after honing.

Got it! I guess there is no limit.

My learning curve, as you are beginning to see, is usually through error.

BTW, G-orgeous razor.