Thread: Some hones and stones

..........

I don't know about you guys....!

(Sorry, I couldn't resist! If this is too offensive, I will remove it)

I officially feel not jealous.... who am I kidding. That is unbelievable work. Just out of curiosity, do you feel that a belgian stone or any other stone that isn't japanese can be useful in your sword polishing? or do you use japanese stones exclusively? thanks.

Originally Posted by Memorael

I officially feel not jealous.... who am I kidding. That is unbelievable work. Just out of curiosity, do you feel that a belgian stone or any other stone that isn't japanese can be useful in your sword polishing? or do you use japanese stones exclusively? thanks.

You can only get so far with any synthetic,coticule doesnt seem to give the proper surface texture needed to start the uchigumori stones,and as far as anybody knows there is no replacement for what the uchigumori.
A good example of what it does;

so the uchigumori is the final polisher and brings out the contrast of the jigane and hagane?

There are several grades,ha-to,used to whiten the hamon and bring out the hada(grain) and ji-to,finer and harder,used to refine and contrast the hada.Both are used to do the final polish in both the stone(toishi)and fingerstone prossess.There is one more polishing prossess that can be done several ways.Sashikomi,hazuya fingerstones are used to whiten the whole sword,jizuya is used above the hamon,then nugui,an assortment of differnt kinds of polishing powders mixed with oil,filtered and applied to the sword and rubbed with a cotton wad,this darkens the ji and contrasts it against the ha without blending out or obliterating the hada if done properly.Another way is Keisho,the sword is whitened from ha to shinoji(ridgeline) with hazuya,then the same with jizuya,then the same with nugui.Then,to accentuate the hamon it is whitened again with the hazuya,small pieces are used to follow the shape of the hamon carefully to give it a sharp,crisp demarcation from the ji.
Greg

this is amazing work, is there a book you could recommend to learn the process? I am sure it will be no where near to experiencing learning from someone but since I have japanese knives that I wish to polish I think that could help thanks.

The Craft of the Japanese Sword is the standard,one of the earliest to publish some general info on sword polish,but also has forging,heat treatment,fitings and scabbards.And a few years back The Art of Japanese Sword Polishing came out,it covers several procedures.
I dont know if you go on Knifeforums,but they have a forum topic"In the Kitchen".what is mostly covered there is Japanese cutlery.
Greg

Originally Posted by Mike Blue

Ben, that leaves out the most important aspect of getting the blade ready for the etch...polishing. Before the etch the blade needs to be finished down pretty fine, otherwise the etchant will really make the coarser scratches stand out and the contrast is pretty muddy.

In the tutorial, Dave did polish the blade before etching. He used 600 grit wet/dry and put a picture of it up. Says he used a 1" x 2" piece like a finger stone would be used.

While the tutorial is a decent recipe, those kitchen knives do not have that dark contrasty appearance in the store shelf. They are polished again afterward. The black smut will keep showing up for a long time afterward unless it's removed. Nobody wants to see that in their food.

The black smut is pretty much patina, no? If I cut a tomato with a freshly polished carbon steel knife and let the juice sit on the knife, it leaves a very black mark. I scrub it with a soapy terry cloth towel, but there is still quite a bit of black patina left. And I want that, too. It protects the blade in the future.
Removing all of it means that you're just going to start the whole process over again. After you develop the patina right, you WON'T see that black stuff in your food. Tonight I made Jambalaya and cut up a white onion with a Sabatier 4star Elephant carbon chef's knife, with a very dark patina'd blade. My onions didn't discolor one bit, due to the proper patina.

The knife in the tutorial is sold with a dark contrasty look. It's a Hattori KD. Hattori has another line similar to a Shun classic or Calphalon Katana where the different layers of steel are polished and there isn't much of a distinction. It's the Hattori HD line. There's also the FH line, but it's solid VG-10, with a Cowry-X version supposedly due.

The ferric chloride would be pretty harsh treatment for a Japanese blade. Another very dilute acid might be used to bring out the hamon. There are a lot of ways to skin this cat.

The Hattori KD is a japanese blade, and the treatment didn't seem harsh at all on it. It's got a Cowry-X core and a chef's knife in that line goes for >$1000. The knife in the tutorial isn't a honyaki knife, so there is no hamon, just the patterns in the steel. The KD in particular is made by drilling holes into one piece of steel then forge welding other steel to it.

I'm not trying to be discourteous, preachy, or anything of the sort. I just use carbon steel knives exclusively in the kitchen and deal with this stuff often. Mike, I'm sure could school me backwards and forwards in metallurgy, forging techniques, and anything else having to do with blades in general.