Thread: Interesting Attempted Deal

If you're losing eBay auctions, it's because you're not bidding high enough.

I know that's ridiculously obvious, but some people seem to lose sight of that. If you want something in an auction you need to be willing to pay more than anyone else that wants it. If you're not willing to do that, then you don't want the item badly enough.

I agree with the unfairness of sniping, though I am forced to use it to have a chance. Some guy is patiently waiting for an auction to wind down to seconds, believing he has a shot based on current bids, and WHAM! Out of nowhere comes a whole new level of bidding. And basically, if you see something you "just have to own", you put an unreasonably large amount of money into a snipe, and you will end up buying it.

If you "just have to own" it, then the amount of money isn't unreasonable. You establish the price you are willing to pay; you either get it for that or you don't. If you don't get it for the price offered, then you should be relieved, as it sold too high for what you value the item at. If you do get the item you should be happy, because you paid a fair price for it. The only time there should be a disconnect is if you either didn't bid what the item was worth to you, or if you have some kind of belief that an ebay seller exists to sell you things for less than they are worth. (note: that is not what eBay sellers exist for)

I have attempted to have sellers change their ads to read 'buy it now' for years, offering fair to generous amounts for the item. Never to rip them off. Success use to be 40%. Now, it is nearer 10%, due to greed, and to the great amount of consignment sellers.

To me, any price lower than the final price of a fair auction is ripping the seller off. Expecting someone to sell something for less than it is worth is a form of greed.

It's not greed when sellers refuse your offer. As a seller I have a VERY low opinion of the dregs and bottom-feeders of ebay who scavenge off ignorant sellers. If you offer to lowball me, I will be polite, but secretly want to kick you in the junk. Ebay, by definition, is a free market, fair-price system. List an auction, and it will sell for what it is currently worth. Sometimes things slip under the radar, and other times they sell for way more than what we think they are worth. That's life.

*high five to HNSB*

Edit: in fairness, I also have ZERO sympathy for sellers who are taken advantage of by these wankers. Seriously, spend 3 minutes to find out what your item is really worth. It's not that difficult.

As a seller on eBay I politely decline BIN offers and can honestly say that almost every offer I've received is a huge low ball to what the item is worth. It irks me, but I just tell the potential buyer good luck bidding and let the auction run. It irks me even more when I see items I'm watching get BIN'd for lowball offers of people preying on uninformed sellers. I love seeing a seller post the ridiculous offers they get in the Q&A section. Let's see, in the past month I've seen a Puma Gold get offered $30 and a mint Le Jaguar 30 euros.

Re: Sniping - seriously do not understand what peoples issue with it is. I place the maximum amount I'm willing to pay in my snipe and if I win - great! I paid a price I thought was fair. If I lose - oh well. Someone wanted the item more than me. It is that simple. Trying to chip away at an auction to get the highest bid is stupid and people that complain of snipers winning these auctions - really? The auction has a set ending time. If you want to chip away and get outbid by a sniper in the closing seconds, what entitles you to get another bid if you were willing to pay more than the snipe? Bid your max and accept the outcome of the auction.

There will ALWAYS be another razor. Place your max bid regardless of whether you snipe or bid normal and accept the results of the auction.

All the points made can be said to be valid , but if you contact a seller and request a "Buy It Now" price that is agreed upon before any bids have been made on the item, then the seller has the right to go in and add a "Buy It Now" price to the auction and any one watching can purchase it at that price including the snipers. After the first bid is made, then you can no longer use the "Buy It Now " option or end the auction early except for those circumstances mentioned like the item was sold by another venue or is significantly different than the discription.

The only times I've made an offer was when there was an "or Best Offer" option already available on the auction. If the seller doesn't mind haggling I don't mind haggling.

I'm not ashamed to say I'm a sniper. I do it because of all the times I've run into shill bidders bidding up their buddies auctions for them. In the old days it was easy to spot a shiller. Two sellers working together would show up in each other's bidders lists for most of their auctions. Often I would bid and later a seller would send me email saying the winner wasn't going to pay so would I please buy the item I had lost for the maximum amount I had bid. In other words they had out shilled what every legitimate buyer was willing to pay and they didn't want to pay the relist fee and try again. Now Ebay makes it harder to spot shillers but we all know they are still out there. Some sellers even have multiple Ebay accounts and don't try to hide the fact. When someone has more than one account they can shill their own auctions. I'm wary of people that I know have more than one account for that reason.

I snipe the old fashioned way myself, by submitting my bid when there's just a few seconds left and bidding the max amount I am willing to pay but no more. There have been times even then when I was the high bidder for a couple seconds and then lost the auction. It doesn't matter to me because I would have lost anyway. The people that outbid me must place more value on the item than I do so they deserve it.

Lori

There's nothing wrong with Ebay. It's an auction site and is totally neutral.

Most people who feel bad about Ebay regret the fact that they didn't "win" the auction they bidded
on. Actually, you don't really "win" an auction, you just pay more for an item that anyone else was
willing to pay. That may be a victory, but it also can be a mistake.

I never snipe. I just decide what the highest amount is that I am willing to pay for an item. If I really
want it, that bid may be quite high. If someone wants to pay more and "win" it, then I've already
factored that into my "feelings" equation.

What's really fun is to be sitting there with a high bid that is way up there and then watch the snipers
go nuts trying to steal the auction. Caveat: only do that when you really MUST have the item

Here are two more thoughts of mine and Lori touched on it a bit so I now understand the other side. Snipers always say they simply input the most they are willing to bid and that's it. That is all good, and I have no problem with it, but if that is the case, why wait until the last two seconds? Why be transparent until the very end? "Shillers" is an understandable reason but if you really think about it... do you think they've given up just because people bid at the last second? Couldn't they also use a sniping program and input $5,000 to ensure they win and get every possible dollar out of the highest sniper with a second chance offer? At least if you do it yourself there is some discretion if the auction starts to feel off.

Another thought is that, to me, of course I want the razors that I am bidding on but why would I want to pay the MAXIMUM amount I can possibly spend for every item I buy on ebay? If you go to an antique store or flea market, whether it be for razors or something else, do you never haggle with the sellers in person? If you buy a car do you not try to get it for a good price that is fair to both parties and not pay retail? Of course there are some difference in my examples when being compared to ebay but the concept can be applied to almost anything you buy.

Edit: This doesn't really count for people who shoot out really lowball offers on purpose. (I think a few times I've offered something I thought was reasonable and the auction took off to a price I'd of never thought possible. When this happens I usually feel like a ______ )

You don't have to pay the "MAXIMUM amount" to get what you want, but you do have to bid more than what others are willing to bid. The purpose of sniping is to deny you the chance to reconsider and raise your bid. As such, it is more likely that it limits rather than inflates prices on Ebay. If I really want an Ebay item, then I had better bid high for it, whether now or during sniping. If I don't, I have no reason to complain or feel remorse.

Originally Posted by ats200

Another thought is that, to me, of course I want the razors that I am bidding on but why would I want to pay the MAXIMUM amount I can possibly spend for every item I buy on ebay?

But I think you are missing the point. Back when I was buying on ebay, I might set up 10 snipes at prices that I would like to pay for them. These prices were lower than I expected them to sell for, but they were what I was willing to pay. I could bid on 10 knowing full well that I would likely only get one or two of them, but I was happy with them because I paid NO MORE than I was willing to pay.

I went to an antique dealer recently who had about 20 razors for sale. I sorted them into the following categories:
--ones I did not want at all
--$5
--$10
--$15
--$20

Most were in the $10 category. I told the vendor I realized that he wanted much for for them than I was asking but these were the prices I'd be willing to pay given the relative amount of work they required and the price I could get for them after that work. Only two in the $20 category and those were the only ones he was willing to sell, so I got a W&B For Barber's Use 7/8 full hollow and a Joseph Rodgers 6/8 wedge for $40. We both walked away happy.

These two scenarios work the same way. In each case I decided what I was willing to pay and waited to see if I got them at that price. Sniping allows you to pick a price and walk away without allowing some schmuck to repeatedly, over and over, redundantly, repetitively, again and again, constantly, time after time, frequently bid up my only bid.

I still think that isn't true. If you enter in the most you are willing to pay.. isn't that the maximum amount? I don't mean that I have to enter in every single dollar to my name. We may be on different trains of thought here but I simply meant, if the most I'm willing to pay is (for example) $100. Why not try to negotiate for less?

Edit: Sorry for the "hard headedness." I completely understand what everyone is saying and on some level I do agree but I think it comes down to the old saying "agree to disagree."