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09-19-2015, 09:56 AM #1
Avoiding bad buying decisions and wasted money
As a novice straight shaver, making sense of the amount of available information can be a real pain in the head. Add to that an equal amount of opinions and individuals' perspectives and it gets very confusing very fast. I have noticed such confusion and discord in personal perspectives in more than a few beginners threads recently and in the past. Over at Straight Razor Magazine, they have taken notice as well and obviously thought some assistance would come in handy. A really good read, with some sage advice from one of the best independent and unbiased sources on the scene:
Originally Posted by Straight Razor MagazineLast edited by Pithor; 09-19-2015 at 11:07 AM. Reason: Dis cord don't dance
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The Following 19 Users Say Thank You to Pithor For This Useful Post:
Badgister (09-19-2015), Chevhead (09-19-2015), ChopperDave (09-19-2015), Ernie1980 (09-19-2015), Geezer (09-19-2015), gflight (09-19-2015), Leatherstockiings (09-19-2015), Lolita1x2 (09-19-2015), Lynn (09-25-2015), Moonshae (09-19-2015), oldmandon (09-26-2015), puketui41 (09-19-2015), Raol (09-19-2015), Razorfaust (09-19-2015), RezDog (09-19-2015), richmondesi (09-19-2015), RobinK (09-19-2015), Substance (09-19-2015), Thug (09-19-2015)
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09-19-2015, 11:12 AM #2
All good points. Also, there are straights that I would shave with and then there are some that I just like and collect. I have been lucky in the last year to have gotten burned about 4 times. Two I was able to return and two I had to eat. I keep one of them next to my computer to remind me of my bad choice.
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09-19-2015, 12:50 PM #3
- Join Date
- Feb 2013
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Thanked: 4827It reminds me that I have bought a lot of stuff because of hype. I'm not talking strictly shaving either. I'm quite certain there are many fishing lures that are made to catch fishermen not fish. Shaving gear is not much different.
It's not what you know, it's who you take fishing!
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09-19-2015, 01:47 PM #4
Something I've been troubled with is what I would describe as the the "Youtube phony" phenomena. This phenomena is characterized by Youtubers with some wet shaving skills posting multiple shaving videos monthly reviewing/pushing products. I understand hobbyist posting videos of themselves wet shaving and doing reviews of products they try. There are some, however, that position themselves as an authority basically doing product reviews and technique videos where they don't actually shave, lather, strop,etc. The shame lies in the fact that their created persona and slick editing diverts newcomers away from real subject matter experts.
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09-19-2015, 02:02 PM #5
Leatherstockiings, I have a strong suspicion that the guys over at the Straight Razor Magazine might have written that article with rigged reviews in mind, too. These reviews have become a massive problem. I think that beginners in particular should be made aware of the fact that all that glitters is not gold, and that there are dozens of undercover vendors and their cronies at work in several wet shaving forums, including this one.
I think vendors should be clearly distinguishable (like with the vendor buttons here, although those are a bit problematic, too) from consumers. I also think that fraudsters should be exposed, banned, and their employers be permanently banned along with their products. HTGAM/PPF/PAA come to mind immediately, not least because they sold mislabeled products in addition to shilling. And that is just the beginning. A friend of mine is a highly successful chemist, and I recently gave him 16 "artisan" soaps. He says that none (yes, none - zero, nada, keine) contain the (expensive) essential oils they claim to contain, but that they contain (dirt cheap) fragrance oils instead.
So, beginners should be made aware of that. And I really like the article Pithor quoted in that respect. It can be used to easily, and convincingly, explain a lot of highly praised shaving items and their alleged mythical qualities.
Only, it takes an open mind to really benefit from the article, so it will get a lot of criticism from the guys with the high post counts. And the undercover vendors. And their cronies. But that is as it should be. Many enemies much honour and all that.Last edited by RobinK; 09-19-2015 at 02:04 PM.
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09-19-2015, 02:07 PM #6
Thanks for the article and my heightened awareness as a newbie...
I noticed the article mentioned proraso menthol and was curious if there is a resource that defines ingredients commonly found in cream and shave products?
Looking at the package would be so much better if I knew ingredients I would avoid or ones I wanted. This would surely help my objective analysis...."When defeat comes, accept it as a signal that your plans are not sound,
rebuild those plans, and set sail once more toward your coveted goal."
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09-19-2015, 02:40 PM #7
There is a lot of information about shaving soap ingredients on the interwebs. The bad news is, you will most likely not benefit from it. It takes in-depth knowledge in chemistry to make sense of these ingredients. "Making soap is dead easy", is something you will often hear, but that's only partly true. Yes, making some sort of soap is easy. Getting it right is complex. Not complicated, complex. Which is why so many "artisans" use cheap soap stock from China. That takes a lot of complexity out of the product. Add some cheap fragrance oils, and some magic fairydust (kokum butter, anyone?), and you're good to go. Find some useful idiots to do your mass marketing - instant win. Wait until the big shaving blogs cannot but give these products good reviews (because they rely on the advertising income), and you're in for a beginner's nightmare.
So, ingredients: Forget it. I have friends with degrees in chemistry who also happen to like to play with shaving products. They turn green each time some self appointed expert extols the virtues of oil XYZ or butter 123 without even having actually tried the product.
This used to be a fun place. Now it's full of undercover vendors and their cronies. If you weren't around five or more years ago, you wouldn't even notice. But I do. And I don't like it one bit.
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09-19-2015, 02:54 PM #8
That is a tremendous article which every newcomer to the world of wetshaving should be made to read.
As a relative newbie to the world of DE & SR's, I've probably fallen into one of the "biases". However, having multiple expensive hobbies and being out of the mainstream of the readily available shaving markets, has limited that shaving exposure and bias.
For those that remember Hill Street Blues, the desk Sergeant had a saying after every morning's briefing..."Be Careful Out There!"Tony
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09-19-2015, 03:44 PM #9
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- Dec 2013
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Thanked: 44The problem with sites such as this (and I'm sure all the others have similar rules) is that criticism of vendors is prohibited. Myself and several of the other Western Australian members began a thread in which we critiqued a certain vendor in Perth with whom we had all had bad experiences. The thread was censured by the moderator and I was warned about criticising vendors (we don't do that at SRP). The problem I see with that is that it reduces sites such as this to backslapping, high-fiving forums where we end up repeating the same topics over and over again every six months as a new batch of members comes through asking the same old questions, without allowing us all to pool our experiences and cull the incompetent sellers, thereby benefiting all enthusiasts. Then again, I've always been a cynic. Ok moderators, this is when you send me a PM, or not so PM, saying something like, "You know the rules, if you don't like like 'em..."
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09-19-2015, 06:14 PM #10
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Thanked: 1081This is a very interesting thread that not only relates to wet shaving but every aspect of society itself. We live in a world of consumerism with more disposable income that ever before. We are a marketing dream and ever ready to part with our hard earned cash.
When I first started with a straight razor I never knew about SRP but quickly found it and spent hours pouring over the library. With all the information available I thought what's the point in a forum? All the information I will ever need is there in black and white. After a while I began to love SRP and enjoy evreyones thoughts on this hobby (if it wasn't a hobby we wouldn't be here.) I also learned very quickly that you definitely have to separate the wheat from the chafe. There are members on here who have a lot of experience and I cherish their help and expertise but some I cant understand what on earth they are thinking when they are posting, some of which bears no relevance the question being asked, biased or just nonsensical.
This can have a detrimental effect on beginners success, so like myself I always encourage beginners to fully read the library, digest it, learn the basics, become profficent and go from there.
The acronym YMMV is never a truer wood spoken, whilst some may swere by product x, meathod y or anything z this doesn't always relate to everyone so shouldn't be taken at face value.
This is just my ramblings and should also be taken with a pinch of salt.