Thread: How Long from Dull to Sharp?

I'm hoping some of you guys with more experience honing can give me some input on this.

I recently obtained a couple of old, but clean razors, that were quite dull on which to practice my honing technique. Both razor were German steel. My thought was that I could master the technique without screwing up a good razor in the process. I watched Lynn's video twice, got out my Norton 4k/8k and started with pyramids.

I managed to make some improvement to the blades, but not near enough to successfully shave. My question is, how much work does it take to bring a totally dull blade to a shave-ready blade?

I'm assuming the problem lies in my technique. It would seem that 8 or 9 of the pyramids that Lynn described on his video for blades needing a lot of work would do the trick (starting with 15 passes on each side, then 10, etc.). We're not talking stainless steel or a blade with a nick in it.

Nothing would make me happier than to learn that a really dull blade could require even more passes on the stone, but I'm skeptical about that. Meanwhile, I'll continue trying to figure out what I'm doing wrong.

Ok then -

a really dull blade could require even more passes on the stone

Seriously. Some very dull blades require 4x as much work. Sometimes you may need to go down to 1K or 1200 and after this still do say 100 laps on Norton 4K. Really depends on the razor. (disclaimer - my Norton may be slower cutting than others')

Check the edge under magnification. Do the permanent marker trick - to see where metal is removed (search archives - but basically, just mark the bevel and edge and do 1-2 laps on 4K to see if the marker line is removed uniformly, are you getting to the edge at all or just the bevel, etc.)

Cheers
Ivo

Did you lap your norton before you started? I spent weeks farting around like this with my first razor getting nowhere - then I lapped my stone and got shaving sharp my next attempt.

I'm with Ivo in that the 4K cuts very slowly for me. Some guys seem to be able to get it to work more quickly, but I've spend hours on it without making much progress.

Do a search on "thumbnail test," which will help you figure out where you are in the honing progression. If the razor is still really dull, you might try getting some 1K wet-dry sandpaper. There's a lot of info on using sandpaper in the honing forum as well.

It took me weeks to get my first razor shave-ready, but now I can do it in less than 30 minutes. I never thought it would happen.

Hang in there,
Josh

There are some guys who have been straight shaving all their lives and never really learned how to hone properly. I think even Lynn will tell you he is still learning when it comes to honing.

There are no formula's its a matter of your own technique and the tools you have at your disposal. If you took ten identical razors with identical problems and gave them to ten people each would have a different story as far as how long it took to hone and how they did it. You just have to keep at it until you get the job done and experiment with different routines and media and techniques.

Thanx for the tips. I'll go to a coarser grit and see what happens.

As Michael suggested - whatever you do - lap / check the stone! No ands, ifs, or butts - if it ain't flat you ain't goin' nowhere

Cheers
Ivo

You will need to establish some technique before we can talk about a realistic time frame at all. Even then each honer has his own pace. That said;

A workman is only as good as his tools. For totally dull, you'll want more than just the Norton 4/8k combo. That'll take forever, or at least days maybe. Moving up in grits is a great way to cut your time and if your technique is perfect and you've got a collection of stones at your disposal which are high quality and fast cutters .... an hour? I'm never so lucky though.

X

Originally Posted by xman

Moving up in grits is a great way to cut your time and if your technique is perfect and you've got a collection of stones at your disposal which are high quality and fast cutters .... an hour? I'm never so lucky though.
X

Come on, guys! This is the newbies corner. I'm a newbie, and I don't have a collection of stones. I'm starting to straight shave for a few months now. I only have an Arkansas stone. Do newbies in general have a "collection of stones" ranging from 220, 1000, 4000 and 8000 grit ? That's way too expensive and complex for a newb.

Just my thoughts...

Time to sharp is influenced by the following factors:
- experience
- tools

One of my first honing projects was a problem razor I got from thebigspendur.
I had a yellow coticule at my disposal, and a very cheap no-name course (320 grit?) stone that I had lying around.

With these 2 it took me 19 full hours to get that razor shaveready (also because I was inexperienced then).

The problem with razors is that you need a fine stone (like 8K) to get an edge that you can comfortably shave with, and something coarser to remove metal to shape the edge (4K or 1K).

I don't have an arkansas stone so I am not qualified to comment on that.

This sucks from a newbie perspective because it requires an initial investment.
Personally I think the norton 4/8 is one of the best things to buy if you are getting started because it allows you to start with a dull blade and end with a sharp blade that you can shave with.

By now I have a collection of stones, allowing me to pick the right stone for the right phase, and I can get even a very dull blade shaveready in less than an hour.
If the blade is in good condition and only needs minor sharpening, I can get it ready in under 20 minutes.