Thread: Self Deprecating Newbies

While I agree with the spirit of the OP, I also think it is a good thing to set the bar high. Being hard on yourself is one of the ways to achieve great things, in any walk of life. But all within reason of course.

There's nothing wrong with being disappointed, or failing, or screwing up. Everyone does it, and will continue to do it, until the day they die. What you need to develop is an additional mechanism that takes that disappointment, failure, or whatever, examines the causes of it dispassionately, maps out a plan to overcome it, and then implement it. All within the context of what you want to achieve.

That kind of approach takes a certain level of self-honesty, and it also takes a certain level of emotional (and, when using straights, perhaps physical) robustness. It also takes humility, patience, and determination.

I have no doubts that people who have achieved great things in life have also experienced great disappointments along the way. The thing that differentiates them from others is what they do with the disappointment - rather than let it control them, I would suggest they controlled it, and used it to learn how to do things better.

So I say set the bar high, always aim for the acme, but expect to be disappointed, and know how to deal with it. In the context of straights, that's where this forum and the more experienced members can play a part. Try to be constructive in your self-criticism: it is hard to help without specifics to go on. And never think you are the only one experiencing the particular difficulty you have atm - I can guarantee someone, somewhere, has had a similar, if not identical, issue at some time.

Auntie (Tough Love) Jimbo.

Originally Posted by Obie

Ladies and gentlemen:

Thanks to our good friend Alembic for bringing up the subject of newbies being a tad too hard on themselves. I do concur with every point he makes. Other members have expounded upon the subject thoughtfully as well.

Newbie ladies and gentlemen, please bear with me for the following story:

Ignacy Paderewski (1860-1941), one of the greatest pianists of all time, once said: "If I don't practice for one day, I know it. If I don't practice for two days, the critics know it. If I don't practice for three days, the audience knows it."

So you see, my dear newbies, it takes practice, even for the greatest ones. Anything worthwhile, if you want to be good at it, takes time and practice. Granted, when compared to what it takes to be a great pianist, straight razor shaving is a solitary note floating in the air. Still, it does take practice over a period of time. It also takes patience and repetition.

Please stay focused. Every shaver goes through the same learning process. I did, and I still have a long way to go. Some shavers become adept faster than others for various reasons, but in the end, we all nail down a major accomplishment and become skilled straight razor shavers.

Regards,
Obie

Obie,

You have such a scholarly way with words. The way you weave them, it makes your statements seem beyond reproach. Thanks.

I think we should all encourage the necomers to stop being so hard on themselves and focus on each aspect that was good or better than the day before.

They fight two things. The first is not wanting to be bad at something as an adult, and the second is the instant gratification. I actually think str8 razor shaving reveals ones character to oneself. There is patience, overcoming struggle, gentlemanliness, respect, care, etc.

Oops, there I go getting philosophical again.

Ok, the bottom line is quit focusing on the negative, it is polluting your mind and interfering with your enjoyment and learning.

David

Originally Posted by Jimbo

While I agree with the spirit of the OP, I also think it is a good thing to set the bar high. Being hard on yourself is one of the ways to achieve great things, in any walk of life. But all within reason of course.

There's nothing wrong with being disappointed, or failing, or screwing up. Everyone does it, and will continue to do it, until the day they die. What you need to develop is an additional mechanism that takes that disappointment, failure, or whatever, examines the causes of it dispassionately, maps out a plan to overcome it, and then implement it. All within the context of what you want to achieve.

That kind of approach takes a certain level of self-honesty, and it also takes a certain level of emotional (and, when using straights, perhaps physical) robustness. It also takes humility, patience, and determination.

I have no doubts that people who have achieved great things in life have also experienced great disappointments along the way. The thing that differentiates them from others is what they do with the disappointment - rather than let it control them, I would suggest they controlled it, and used it to learn how to do things better.

So I say set the bar high, always aim for the acme, but expect to be disappointed, and know how to deal with it. In the context of straights, that's where this forum and the more experienced members can play a part. Try to be constructive in your self-criticism: it is hard to help without specifics to go on. And never think you are the only one experiencing the particular difficulty you have atm - I can guarantee someone, somewhere, has had a similar, if not identical, issue at some time.

Auntie (Tough Love) Jimbo.

I can't disagree with one single point you made Jimbo. I think between you and Obie you have tempered my point better than I.

Originally Posted by Alembic

Obie,

You have such a scholarly way with words. The way you weave them, it makes your statements seem beyond reproach. Thanks.

I think we should all encourage the necomers to stop being so hard on themselves and focus on each aspect that was good or better than the day before.

They fight two things. The first is not wanting to be bad at something as an adult, and the second is the instant gratification. I actually think str8 razor shaving reveals ones character to oneself. There is patience, overcoming struggle, gentlemanliness, respect, care, etc.

Oops, there I go getting philosophical again.

Ok, the bottom line is quit focusing on the negative, it is polluting your mind and interfering with your enjoyment and learning.

David

My dear David:

You are so right about everything you have said. You have my vote on every word. My general belief is this: Things are never as bad as they seem, unless, of course, one is on one's deathbed — and that is as bad as it gets.

Shaving with a straight razor is a learned skill. If you push too hard, you'll face a wall of frustrations. So settle down. Take a breath. Approach your task methodically and patiently. You'll get there.

By the way, David, thank you for the kind words.

Regards,
Obie

Originally Posted by BeBerlin

Is that really the case? I am seeing more beginners than in previous years who are apparently under the impression that all you need to do is buy a Filarmonica and you will get a BBS shave immediately. Additionally, and despite our best efforts to provide information to the contrary, there seem to be more people who come here with exaggerated expectations. I have tried to compile a number of Common misconceptions and mistakes in the FAQ, such as "there is a best razor", or "my newly acquired, and pre-honed, razor is not shave ready because it does not pass some test".

Straight razor shaving is an acquired skill. It takes a lot of time and patience. Some members seem to have mastered it within weeks, but that appears to be the exception. It took me several months to consistently get shaves that were markedly better than those from a DE. That is something that we all should keep in mind when we encounter beginners.

On a personal note, I would always discourage beginners to invest too heavily in their first equipment. I think it raises expectations, and can lead to self depreciation faster: 'I paid for the best kit in the world, but after 10 shaves, I am still not perfect - something must be wrong with me.' Or something along those lines. I made the best progress when Coully provided me with a cheap 6/8 round point razor that is now on its way to Scotland in the hope that it will serve another beginner equally well.

Regards,
Robin

I agree with you, especially there's assumption that if they bought the best equipment they'll get the best <---that's the culprit, too high expectation, this is something that I was trying to avoid weeks ago, that's why in my first thread I'm looking something as "starter" or "beginner", not really a type of razor because I know all razor simply cut and that's the purpose, but I want something that I can rely on, good steel and it should hold edge and not very expensive, just want to see if this is for me. First shave was OK, maybe because it's a 2 weeks beard, I feel confident enough to shave and magically with no cut, of course in my chin area its not too clean but hey, I didn't cut while I have a razor that can simply cut a hanging hair, glde in my face...second shave is worse, I cut several area in my chin, trying to clean the unfinished area...but it's ok, I'm thinking this is a journey, even I've started to forget that the reason why I'm buying something cheaper and not 100bucks razor is because I want to see if this is for me, that thinking is disappear and all I see is an adventure and journey forward, now I have problem, I always want to shave everyday, while that's simply not possible, there's no hair in it about the chin area, that's the biggest problem, even with battery shaver and mach3 I'll have blood in that area, dunno what's problem my skin, I'm thinking I have a very very very sensitif/thin skin there. So, first shave, side burn, under the cheek, adam's apple, mustache are all good, chin? month of practice I guess, even 6 years using battery shaver and mach3 not really help, it still bleed in some occasion.

The problem now is that...it's just been sometime since I started str8 shave, but now I'm kind addicted to visit the classified, reading all the razor clubs thread, it's like I'm falling in love with those blades

ps. I always get the closest shave when I'm shaving a 3 weeks beard, it's happen during my mach3 days, and I wonder if that's also the case with str8

Straight razor shaving is like any other skill. Buying the best kit doesnt make you the best, it just makes you a guy with great kit..!

I have an Ibanez Jem, but can I play like Steve Vai? Err... no! I'll need to do a lot more practice to get up to that level.

The other thing with straight razor shaving is that the kit is actually only a small part of it. I reckon there are four elements to a really great shave;

- A shave ready razor
- Good stropping
- Good lather and prep
- Good technique

So having a NOS Filli and an expensive strop is great, and will definately serve you well, but they will be for nothing if your stropping technique, lather, prep and shaving technique suck.

Its not enough to have good kit, you need to know how to use it as well and I do agree with Robin that some people forget this! You need to put the time into it, above all else, to get the best results.

Someone with a Dorko strop, a DOVO Best Quality and the knowledge to use it will get a much better shave than someone with a Filli and a Nakayama strop and no clue what they're doing.

But that said, when you dont get the results you want right off the bat, dont go out there and throw in the towel! By all means, be hard on yourself to get the best shave you can, and want to get great lather, prep, stropping and so on, but just be aware that you will need to actually put the work in and take the time to get the results you want.

Great post David!

As a complete newbie ( only been doing this for 2 weeks ) I can say that one needs to really look at why they are interested in Straight shaving in depth as well. I am doing this because conventional cart razors and even electric razors gave me such a nasty razor burn I hated shaving and would go months without doing it sometimes just to give my skin a break (which then drew the ire of my wife). I have found with shaving with a straight that my skin is much better for it.

Now is my shave BBS.. heck no but due to the irritation from more modern methods my face feels smoother now than it ever really did before even 2 days after I shave.

Also in this crazy instant gratification as soon as possible world I enjoy just taking the time to myself and the focus I need to not cut myself when shaving. It puts me in a better mood every morning after I shave.

As far as kit I am one of those do-it-yourself people as well so I find restoring an old blade intriguing and also know that because I have restored the blade it may not be the best currently and as I learn more it will become better.

Again this is my path and what I have chosen that works for me. YMMV but keep at it and enjoy the "You" time no matter what the results currently and know it can only get better.

I was having big problems getting my shaving sorted, it seemed i couldn't hone my razor properly, i kept slicing up my face when shaving both very off putting to say the least. However when it eventually clicked, that moment of clarity when you realize you got it right for the first time, everything else didn't matter i knew from then onwards that i would slowly beginning to improve and that's how it's been.
Now i could have very easily given up and sold all my kit after a month of seemingly getting nowhere fast but i'd invested quite a bit of money and time in this so i wasnt going to give up that easily and i had plenty of time to learn too.

So what was the turning point for me ? I'd been making my own strops and doing my best to keep costs down, i have 4 strops now for less than £10 so that cant be too bad, and experimenting on what to treat the surface with when i stumbled upon a simple leather cream from my local supermarket that did exactly what i wanted. As soon as i stropped with it i knew i was there.

Job done now to learn to shave

ian

As one of the newbies who has posted recent updates on his first shave, I want to be clear about something. Nothting in my post was meant to be self depricating. Except maybe for the comment about my slice. Really, even a newbie should know that the razor should NOT move that way.

I think this forum has done a fine job of settting expectations. I didn't expect BBS (said so in my post) and didn't expect to have great stropping skills even though I bout a great strop.

And speaking of equipment, I haven't seen any noob posts talking about buying a Livi or even a filly. But I disagree with the comments that imply equipment doesn't matter. My other hobby is music. The best, pre-war Martin (worth a LOT of Livi's!!!) will not make you a great guitar player. However, the best guitar player in the world can't pull the tone out of an Estaban that he/she can a vintage instrument. So, there is some balance between equipment and skill. I think this is especially true of someone learning a new skill.

The best straight razor won't make you a great shaver on day one, but poor equipment absolutely will slow your progress. I also think that anything that introduces doubt into the process may be a hinderance as well. For example, I invested in a new, professionally honed razor and a very good quality strop. For me, buying a restored razor from someone I don't know would have introduced a lot of doubt into the process. Same is true for my strop choice.

I know stropping is a skill I need to learn over time, but I also know that any errors in that area are due to my input in the process, not the equipment. That allows me to focus on the skill rather than the implements. Look for a more detailed post from me on a thought I had regarding my SRP bridle strop, and whether or not a brand new stropper should have bought such a thing.

I think the best thing the forum can do is continue to provide good reviews of equipment (remember, we won't all be new forever) and lots of words of encouragement. The folks that get it, will get it. Those that don't probably won't no matter what you say or do.

Just some thoughts from a guy on day three of this sport/hobby/craziness that is straight razor shaving.

--David

You can learn so very much on internet forums and SRP is a perfect example. I was flying blind for years before I found this place.

However… internet forums are a place where many people <ahem> exaggerate. If the novice needs a point of comparison for his shave of today it should be the one he had yesterday not Mast3tershv3rBubba’s BBS wetdream.

Me? Thousands of shaves, still a beginner.

Semper Circa