Thread: The Starter Set Dilemma

Originally Posted by gugi

Sure, I think that would work for some people.
Although I think it's usually not so much what's on a member's profile, but in their responses to newbie threads that is the better indicator.

I think this is also a great point, because I can count on my hand the number of times I've looked at someone's profile for something.

That said, the reason I think this would be good for me is that it would give me a chance to think through some of the difficulties I had, and try to put myself back in my own shoes when I started out. Then I could put all of those things down on paper and have them to look at from time to time (kind of like a journal I suppose). I see it as a way to leverage the useful info that can come from such an introspective (and retrospective) view, in order to be more helpful and empathetic in answering people's questions.

How about if one of the Senior Mods who reads most of the threads goes through them and looks for recurring trends, and then publishes a tip sheet each month that other senior members can add too, and help address issues each month????? This of course would be there under the tag line "Beginners tips" for everyone to find easily...

What do you guys think??? would that work???

You know besides the Forum itself, and the Wiki, and the Chat, and the one on one PM help...


http://straightrazorpalace.com/begin...an-2010-a.html

http://straightrazorpalace.com/begin...eb-2010-a.html

http://straightrazorpalace.com/begin...ch-2010-a.html

http://straightrazorpalace.com/begin...il-2010-a.html


I know I have only just started this 4 months ago but there is quite a bit of info in there already, and it will change as the need arises...


I am not being facetious here honestly, but there is a ton of info that is easily found on SRP, so many of the senior guys are answering more of where to find it rather then just answering one specific question... More of the "Teach an Man to fish" way of thinking...

Funnily enough, I created the http://straightrazorpalace.com/shavi...fferently.html with a cunning plan in mind. I wanted to aggregate the information gleaned from the thread in one of the existing Wiki articles from the beginners guide

I still take a firm stance on recommendations for manufacturers (even more so for retailers or vendors), but I think we can get some good information from this thread once more of the senior members have contributed to it.

Regards,
Robin

This actually rings very true to something that was in my mind when I first "contributed" to this thread. I'm a photographer, and there is a well-known article on buying a tripod. It's basically about how you can start off with a crappy one, go through the "usual" progression from okay to good to great to exactly right and spend about $1500 total, or just go for the right one for about $500.

A variety of reasons were given about what would make a tripod "right" for different people, and different brands and models were suggested for each one (it's a bit different for tripods of course - there aren't "vintage" carbon fiber tripods). But basically it presents a narrative to which readers can relate and find meaning and guidance.

The analogy does not work at all. Chances are slim that a low budget tripod will outperform an expensive one. With razors, every single vintage has the potential to outperform even the most expensive new models. Quite a few of them actually do.

Even with new production razors, there is no way I could give anyone a recommendation that will reliably work. Last time I tried, I ended up with a 7/8 Wacker, and Obie with a 6/8 one. He absolutely hated the 7/8, and I would never have wanted the 6/8 one. 1". All the difference. And we are still talking about a razor that is otherwise completely identical.

A lot of thought (and, by the way, time and work) went into the documentation we have compiled for beginners. The contributors as a group have hundreds of man years of shaving experience. It is very much the best we could come up with. And I think it is the best you can get anywhere on the net. But with shaving being personal, nothing can replace first hand experience. At the end of the day, you will have to buy at least two razors/creams/brushes/strops if you want to make a comparison of what works better for you.

As an aside, I shaved with two 7/8 Henckels "Friodur" this morning. The razors are identical. They still shave slightly differently, ie "nice" and "very nice". What if the variances were greater, "we" would recommend the razor, and you would end up with one that just shaves reasonably well? Not a good idea for you, or "us", as I am sure you will agree.

Regards,
Robin

The problem is that razor choice is such a personal thing, and they really are all different. The feel different in the hand, and there are differences in the way the razor feels on the skin. Some people like stiffer grinds, others do not. Some like wide blades, others do not.

Its impossible for us to make recommendations like "get razor X, strop Y, soap Z and brush Q for a starter kit" as this will not suit everyone. Nor will it even suit the majority of people.

This really is one of those hobbies that, when you come into it, its easy to think "razor, strop, brush, soap. How hard can it be?" and then, as you learn more, as you get more razors, start honing or even restoring, that there are huge amounts of difference between razors, between hones, brushes and soaps.

Its simply not something thats black and white. If it were, this site would have about three pages to it. The fact that we have tens of thousands of members, and literally hundreds of thousands of pages of information and opinions should show that there are myriad shades of grey out there!

As Gugi says, every new guy has to figure out his starter set, and then work out where he or she wants to go from there. New guys just cant be spoon fed this stuff, it comes down to doing the research, trying things out as much as possible and learning as much as you can.

And sometimes it does come down to a leap in the dark as well. When I first got into this hobby, I read a whole load of different thoughts and opinions on different razors, strops and so on. In the end I decided to go for a DOVO Black Star and Dorko strop. Why? Because I'd read DOVO were a good make, the price was right and I liked the look of the razor. But other than that, it was a total leap of faith. I took the advice I'd been given, weighed it up and went for it.

Its not always a clear cut choice, but thats what new guys have to do. Do the research, find out as much as they can, ask for advice if they cant find what they're looking for and then just go for it!

Stuart raises a number of excellent points. I would like to add that we have a very diverse member structure. We have all sorts of ages, cultural, educational, or economic backgrounds. One man's meat is another man's poison and all that. May be hard to accept for a beginner, but with a background in photography, it should not really be a problem, as recommendations are similarly hard to give in this area (although manufacturers will always try to tell you differently).

he analogy does not work at all. Chances are slim that a low budget tripod will outperform an expensive one.

I'm sorry - I didn't mean it as an analogy. I meant more that there is a story behind how any one of us got to where we are (as there is a common story about how someone eventually came to the "right" tripod). And that the narrative has meaning, even if only as an example of "see, you're not alone!"

And advising someone to simply "start off with this great but really, really huge wiki" is less personal than someone saying, "you are not alone, here's an example - just an example - of what I went through." No matter how good the manual is.

As much as the OP has commented that he set off a storm with this post, I seem to only ruffle more feathers with even posts that are intended as positive and attempting to be more of a contribution (I fully acknowledge that I was aggressive and critical in my first few posts). I'll leave this thread be from now on.

k.