Thread: Shapton's 30,000 or Coticule?

Originally Posted by PenSword

Which would you recommend and why? Please keep in mind I don't intend to restore razors, or anything above just honing them to keep them sharp. If it gets to the point where I need to have them re-beveled (because I might screw up the honing) then it'll be done by a pro.

Cheers!

A Barber's Hone because that is what it was designed for.. they are fast and easy

A Chinese PHIG very good price, and the right one can do exactly what you want..

Any Synthetic 8k-10k hone because they work better at what you want to do than a true finisher...

A good quality Thuringen because when used for this they give a buttery smooth edge..

The good quality Coticule they are very good for this, but watch the hype on these stones..

A good quality Japanese polishing stone not a finisher, much harder to find though...


Keep in mind any of these other then the barber's hone require practice and have a learning curve, beside the waste of money trying to find the right one with the naturals...

Originally Posted by eleblu05

i would go for the coti because that stone can take you from bevel setting to finishing i would also add a c-12 it's only 25$ and can be used to touch up and its a finisher

This is nice to read, but..............

You can set a bevel on the Coticule if the razor is in nice shape and you want to spend the time. For ebay specials or razors with uneven flattening on spines not the same on both sides, it could take days or longer to get to a decent bevel. Try this on an old Meat Chopper wedge some time. Once a bevel is set, the one hone methods of slurry variation can definitely get a razor to shavable off the Coticule. And although, not the most consistent method off any of the Natural Stones, it definitely works.

The Chinese 12K which is also not the most consistent stone around, can be used for finishing and the one stone honing method. It may take a couple tries, but it can work.

Now........None of this is really for beginner honing in my opinion and may be very frustrating to a new guy.

I would typically recommend that a new guy learn to refresh razors first and get them dialed in if they are starting with shave ready razors and also work on their stropping technique.

As far as taking on the whole process, there are many alternative and many opinions and a lot of opinions from people with little actual experience. The Shaptons, Naniwas, Nortons, Coticules, Japanese stones are all viable. It really becomes a matter of choosing and practicing and learning from your mistakes. Heck, if one stone honing will work with a Barbers Hone and it can, the possibilities are endless.

Have fun,

Lynn

Originally Posted by gssixgun

A Barber's Hone because that is what it was designed for.. they are fast and easy

A Chinese PHIG very good price, and the right one can do exactly what you want..

Any Synthetic 8k-10k hone because they work better at what you want to do than a true finisher...

A good quality Thuringen because when used for this they give a buttery smooth edge..

The good quality Coticule they are very good for this, but watch the hype on these stones..

A good quality Japanese polishing stone not a finisher, much harder to find though...


Keep in mind any of these other then the barber's hone require practice and have a learning curve, beside the waste of money trying to find the right one with the naturals...

Add to this that you can also refresh a razor with just a few strokes (usually around 10 with no pressure) on Chromium Oxide or .5 diamond something on the back of your linen or leather strop. Many times, you can keep your razor going for a long time before ever going to a finishing hone for refreshing.

Lynn

Originally Posted by Disburden

If it were me, I would get a norton 4/8 combo and a barber's hone. That keeps you set for life, plus you can sharpen old blades on the Norton.

Coticules are nice but they are, imo, in the 8K range and leave me wanting more keenness which I can never get no matter how much I try, so I use other stones before it if I want to finish on it.

I don't own the Shapton 30K but it's crazy money, only can be used at the end of the shapton system, etc.

I like your idea..but I've read SOOO much conflicting info about the barbers hones that I'm scared to use one. I have a "keen kutter" that is in perfect shape, given that I've never lapped it. I also have a Naniwa 12k. The norton 4k/8k is my next purchase, but I think it'll have to wait a few months - plus my razor isn't dragging that much yet. I guess my question is - are you using the barber's hone as a finisher? I was thinking of using it BEFORE the 12k, then a few laps on the 12k before hitting balsa, pasted strop, etc.

I kept my first razor going for 6 months with Chromium Oxide until i dropped it and it needed something more.

This started me down a long expensive path of buying hones....

Originally Posted by Lynn

Add to this that you can also refresh a razor with just a few strokes (usually around 10 with no pressure) on Chromium Oxide or .5 diamond something on the back of your linen or leather strop. Many times, you can keep your razor going for a long time before ever going to a finishing hone for refreshing.

Lynn

What ever you decide is the best choice for you, stick with it and learn how to use the system for consistent results. About the worst thing you can do is to have three options for honing a razor that you haven't mastered.

Gentlemen,

thank you all for your great responses. I think I'll go down the path of simple and inexpensive and start from there. The suggestion of focus on one approach and get good at that is of course the most sensible (and cost effective!). I'll be ordering the Chromium Oxide mentioned by Lynn and take it from there. In preparation for the future I got lucky and won a vintage coticule and Swaty barber's hone on eBay for very little cost and so I think I'll have enough to learn on for sometime to come.

One quick question - what's the difference in the end result between using .5 micron Chromium Oxide and .5 micron 15 carat Diamond Spray? The cost differential is minor...

Cheers

Originally Posted by Disburden

If it were me, I would get a norton 4/8 combo and a barber's hone. That keeps you set for life, plus you can sharpen old blades on the Norton.

I was going to suggest the same

When I started with straights I ruined more good edges with improper stropping. After several months I got it together and simple touchup can extend my time between honing. Go Slow.