Thread: Lap norton 4k/8k stone before first use?

many newbies starting to hone razors get concerned about whether their stone is flat...if they purchase a new stone 98% of the time the stone is fine but the tech leaves something to be desired...feel, pressure and tech is learned over time...you cant watch someone or a video or have a conversation and presto create a great edge...it takes time practice and trial and error...We have had many debates about the hhh test...in my humble opinion its worthless...how many times have we read questions on threads "my razor passed the hhh test but it still shaves terrible...I can cut hair with a steak knife but I wouldnt shave with it...THE ONLY TRUE TEST IS TO SHAVE WITH IT...SAVE YOUR HAIR ! As to stroping between passes unless someone has the toughest beard in history this is not needed...If a razor is properly honed and stroped it should easily last through a complete shave.On the rare occasion a razor starts pulling or grabing I put it down imed to go to maint and pick up another razor strop it and finish the shave....with regard to microscopes I orig bought a radio shack special (thought Id go blind using it) I then bought a used microscope from a shop that supplys used scopes to med students and doc" offices...every town has these shops...a little more money but easier to use worth every penny...dont buy on ebay check out a scope in person before you buy...

Clarman,

Thanks for your input -- I'll keep it in mind.

Though, I'm not sure that the benefit of "lapping" the Norton was merely for flattening the stone structure -- it also gave the surface texture a completely different feel. Out of the box, even the 8K side was rough and had a certain drag to it (not dissimilar to that of leather), but after lapping, it feels as smooth as glass. The effects of lapping the 4K side were similar, but to a lesser degree. I believe having a flatter, smoother stone surface is what had the greatest effect on my razor's honing. [Presumably finer & straighter teeth on the blade's edge.]

I might be new to this, but I'm not a fool. I would never put all my faith into one single test, but I believe passing the HHT shows an improvement over a previously dull razor which could not cut hair. The shave was an improvement, but I'm still dissatisfied -- and I intend to keep experimenting on technique until I am satisfied with the shave.

It is not surprising that there is a steep learning curve here, with this lost art, and only time and practice will make perfect. We can't learn everything over the internet, but we have to start somewhere.

I understand your comments! are you aware that to hone effectivly you must create a slurry on the stone which negates the smoothness...lapping is ment to create a level plzying field not to reduce friction especially since the norton 8000 side is not a fine finishing stone although some go no farther with honing to finish your hone many use a yellow codicule or escher or sharpton or paste...but Im sure you knew that...good luck!

I wasn't trying to be argumentative, so please don't take it as such. Just stating what I experienced.

Incidentally, yes, I did know the stone creates a slurry -- which is why lapping is generally required in the first place (-as the stone wears away). The question is whether an initial lapping is required, which I guess is more subjective.

Alexander,

Yes, you've got it. Very impressive.

Originally Posted by Alexander

Though, I'm not sure that the benefit of "lapping" the Norton was merely for flattening the stone structure -- it also gave the surface texture a completely different feel. Out of the box, even the 8K side was rough and had a certain drag to it (not dissimilar to that of leather), but after lapping, it feels as smooth as glass. The effects of lapping the 4K side were similar, but to a lesser degree. I believe having a flatter, smoother stone surface is what had the greatest effect on my razor's honing. [Presumably finer & straighter teeth on the blade's edge.]

I might be new to this, but I'm not a fool. I would never put all my faith into one single test, but I believe passing the HHT shows an improvement over a previously dull razor which could not cut hair. The shave was an improvement, but I'm still dissatisfied -- and I intend to keep experimenting on technique until I am satisfied with the shave.

..

no offense taken...just trying to help...I've honed a great many razors (more than the average user will hone during the course of many years) before Ihad to lapp my stone ...REMEMBER a razor is honed with virtually no pressure except the weight of blade on stone..

Cool deal. Thanks again.

For clarification, I don't doubt or question your experience, and I certainly don't claim to be an authority on the matter.

Perhaps there's some middle-ground here, since we seem to have positive evidence of both. Maybe an initial lapping of the stone makes things easier for a 'newbie' who has no technique, but a stone straight out of the box can be easily tamed by the honing aficionados~

Have a good one.

My Nortons--I've used two different ones--both needed flattening out of the box. If you draw a grid on the stone and give it a few laps on 600 or 800 grit sandpaper, you'll see how flat the stone is. Mine were both cupped in the middle, and it took a bit of work to get them flat.

Now that they're flat, I only have to lap them about every 10 razors or so. (I do the heavy hone work on 1000-grit sandpaper and water stone, though.)

I hone a lot of eBay razors, so I put plenty of wear on my Norton.

Josh

Originally Posted by JoshEarl

My Nortons--I've used two different ones--both needed flattening out of the box.
Josh

I'll second this. I bought a Norton 4k/8k combo and found that I needed to flatten it initially as well. It wasn't very bad but it did need it.