ABC it's as easy 123..
ABC baby you and me
Yep I went there
(in case you don't get it :)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hacker7
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ABC it's as easy 123..
ABC baby you and me
Yep I went there
(in case you don't get it :)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hacker7
Obamacare repeal would be a step in the right direction so that's a point in his favor, the biggest drain on the paying taxpayers, so ok. Then maybe that deficit toke board will start going the other way. Tc
Plus I,m for less taxing of the ones who "EARNED IT"
I personally don't care for my money to be freely given away. I worked for it not anyone else, and yes, I don't care anymore. The checkbook doesn't balance, we need to reign in all government. I,m not a trump fan but I,m for just about anyone with a pulse who at least will try to stop this freight rain we created by looking the other way. For some reason we are being taxed to death that these "for the people representatives" consistently do everything in their power to take more from the working man. I,m retired and they still take a chunk of my money, how about giving me back just what I put in? How about we find a way to keep the government from encouraging making the free ride system a career. How about them being punished for overdrafts? Breaking laws? ( see Hillary and just about everyone of these public servants who forgot they work for us)
So the big problem now is as shown by the last 2 elections, is campaign to the ones receiving benefits and you win. But maybe this time the workers and the over burdened, earners will come out in force and send a message. Cause if Trump gets elected that will be the people taking a stand(electing a Crazy man just to be rid of what we have now). Hell I'd vote for Ted Nugent before anyone who,s running now, so I,m at my ropes end too. Tc
I never said anyone who likes trump is uneducated, might have been someone else. I actually like trump compared to all the other choices on both sides for the exact reasons you stated.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hacker7
I do like how when Obama got elected, the re elected, the right was filled with horrible thoughts of what was to come and how bad it would. It's nice to see the liberals squirming with discontent, and the Republicans too!
I was referring to what Trump calls the uneducated. In fun I said that because I know you are a stickler on grammar. Lol. No disrespect intended.Quote:
Originally Posted by prodigy
I agree with everything you have said. If anything it will be interesting. Maybe the start of a new party? They all need to get back to basics. A gov't of the people, by the people and for the people. Right now its for themselves.:lurk:
Politics is and always has been the never-ending fight of stupid vs evil. If you are confused about which side you are on, you only have to consider whether you view the other side as stupid or evil and you will immediately know which side you are fighting for.
So here goes the GOP, playing Russian roulette with a semi-automatic... Again…
Good lord man, what good did they think, dragging out Romney to trash the GOP leader, is going to do?
Keep it up and Hilary will be the next president. And GOP incumbents will drop like flies, which actually may be a good thing.
Did anyone hear Romney's speech today. WOW. Again, I'm not a Trump fan but Romney sure looked like one when he gracefully accepted his endorsement inthe previous election. This kind of hypocrisy and dishonesty is what has gotten the likes of Romney in so much trouble with voters. That's the trouble with lying all the time. No one knows when to separate the lies from the truth. Romney and the rest of them keep saying that Trump isn't all of this and isnt all of that. But I'm convinced that Trump represents that flushing of the toilet that I mentioned previously. To me, I would choose one of the other two major candidates over Trump - Cruz because he's more closely aligned with my sense of conservatism and Rubio because he seems more electable. But if Trump wins the nomination, he at least serves the purpose of putting a stake through the heart of the Boehner/Bush/McConnell republicans. And a loss like this is about all that will really get their attention. Instead of fighting him so much, they should be getting on board with what their base has been demanding. If they did that, the need for a Trump would disappear.
I thought it was "Anyone But Cruz". I guess that was when the republican establishment thought they can simply wait out Trump self-destruct.Quote:
Originally Posted by gssixgunABC it's as easy 123..
ABC baby you and me
Yep I went there
(in case you don't get it :)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hacker7
I believe this may go down as the single dumbest political move of this century. By Romney firing torpedos at the Trump campaign only confirms to the Trump supporters that he indeed is the only untainted non-establishment candidate running for office. Do they not understand the dynamic happening here? His success is due to the years of GOP waffling and BS thrown at its constituency. They want no more and regardless of their opinions about this man he is at least one thing a fighter and a winner by nature and that itself is rather refreshing to see in a political candidate. The establishment has no control over this guy and can make no campaign money off him and they hate that because its essentially the business they are in.
That's not how you win elections (or govern successfully) though - you need to build broad enough coalition and insisting on some ideological purity gets you exactly what Ted Cruz and the 'freedom caucus' have gotten - a bunch of symbolic gestures (dozens of votes to repeal Obamacare), a bunch of high profile casualties that would normally be on your side (Cantor, Boehner, McCarthy), some blunders (the budget sequestration, government shutdown), and nothing of substance from your agenda achieved.Quote:
Originally Posted by OCDshaver
I'm surprised that so many people are surprised with the Romney speech - this has been going on for months. As I said earlier I find it extremely unlikely that at the end of the primaries the Republican party will get behind the nominee with the unity and enthusiasm that are necessary to win the general election.
Hence my desire to see another candidate in place of Trump. But the current group in DC have proven to not be able to govern as many desire. If Trump becomes the candidate, it will serve as more than just a warning shot across their bow. Cruz would also serve the same purpose, to a lesser degree Rubio since so many in DC have embraced him not that Bush has left. The point is, there's more happening here than just an election.Quote:
Originally Posted by gugi
Yes, I think we may be in the midst of a political realignment, but I'm still only 60% on that.Quote:
Originally Posted by OCDshaver
I think what we are seeing is a political revolution in the making. No they don't understand what is happening here. To me it comes down to this. If you want 4 more years of Obama vote for Clinton. If you want more Bush like politics vote for Rubio or Cruz. If you want change vote Trump. What is going on now is unreal. If Trump wins the nomination and is denied the candidacy. Then all bets are off. "you say you want a revolution, well you know"
I think its amusing to say the least that the GOP has no choice in this. Trump warned early on that he would not go rogue if the establishment gave him his fair due of support. If in fact this phenomenon continues and he steamrolls more states to the point of an obvious nominee and they don't give it to him or try to broker a convention. He will go independent and kill any chance of a republican win. they may as well give the people what they want and not shove one of their anointed ones down our throats.
The form of the political revolution is most likely a 'third party' (and then may be fourth and fifth). You'll still have to form coalitions to win elections and govern, but the agreements will be a lot more explicit about what each party gets and what it provides. And those who make unrealistic demands are left to watch from the sidelines. It's how most of Europe has been operating for a long time.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hacker7
I have been able to vote for 45 years and all that time we have had 3 main political parties and at times more. Minority governments can work well and can keep some of the insanity down to a dull roar.Quote:
Originally Posted by gugi
Bob
We have many parties in the US :)
Socialist
Progressive
Liberal
Democrat
Bluedog Democrat
Moderate Republican
Republican
Conservative
Neocon
And a few others too
Libertarian
Green
Constitution
To avoid confusion and keep it simple only two names are used however :rofl2:
I am only kinda joking :(
I'll bet there are a few others too but being a family forum the names can't be said. ;)
Bob
Well after watching last nights debate everybody is gunning for Trump. Is it me or is the media not playing fair. It seems they went out of their way to put the pressure on Trump and not on the others. Chris Wallace comes up with a screen of numbers after Trump throws out some figures. I saw no screens for the others. Even thou their claims seem just as exaggerated. Do you think the GOP put the pressure on the Fox host to slant it? After Trump they seemed to go after Cruz more than Rubio. After yesterdays assault on Trump I would not put anything past them. There is nothing wrong with asking for some details but be fair. Rubio looked worn down last night. It will be interesting how this plays out. :popcorn:
Quite a long time ago, I heard this quote:
"Democracy is a terrible form of government; the others however are all so much worse."
I guess we are seeing 21st Century democracy in its true form. The ridiculously improved technology of media communications will make this (and future) news events (like elections) much unlike they were in previous years. People are swayed and influenced by exposure to media. Just not politics; indeed-why is advertising a multi-billion dollar industry? Bombard the public with a plethora of data, truly relevant to the issues or not, and their actions will be influenced....Pavlov was indeed onto something. It's a valid thought that the next POTUS will be the choice of Fox, ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN and the rest of the usual crew.
Regardless of whoever winds up in the White House, he/she is only one cog (albeit a pretty powerful cog) in the machinery of US government. The Executive branch is NOT omnipotent and that is a good thing.
Interesting that "experience" is kind of a non-issue. Trump has zero political background; Cruz and Rubio are first term senators. Ms. Clinton would have to be the candidate with most time logged in any kind of government office. How well she handled those offices are a matter of debate.
Me?? I'm just going to watch bits and pieces of the drama from the cheap seats and worry about voting when the smoke clears around October. In the meantime, I wish they would bring "Blacklist" back....
I agree and after Romney's impassioned speech, I finally decided on who gets my vote on Tuesday, that speech really swayed me to vote for Trump..Quote:
Originally Posted by Hacker7
Watching the reactions on my FB feed I realized that I was not alone either, seemed to me that many of my fellow Libertarian leaning friends made up their minds..
The surprising reaction came from my friends that are Very Right Wing Conservatives, most of them also made the decision to vote Trump after Romney's speech..
It will be interesting to see the results in these two most northern counties of Idaho on Tuesday as they normally vote to the EXTREME right
Yup, really disappointed in Fox news and Glenn Beck, lately I only watch ORiley on tape, fast forward through commercials and listen to Classical music station…
They all think we are stupid. What ever they say we will listen. These people on the news shows think we watch to see them. They are much like the politicians. They have a sense of entitlement. They feel they are bigger then what they are reporting. I find sixguns comments very interesting that this whole out to get him mentality is backfiring in their faces. They don't understand the dynamics at work here. At this point I feel they are against me too. I live in NY a very liberal state. If Trump can carry NY it will be a big sign of change. But it might be close to being over by then.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hacker7
That is how I felt in the last two Pres. Primaries, in fact even this one, the Candidates that I really liked are long out of the race, so I get to settle
I would like to see the primaries all run in one week, and the results not released until the next week so the whole country gets to vote on everybody, but nobody cares what I think hehehe
As Jefferson hoped, "An educated citizenry is a vital requisite for our survival as a free people." Our public education has devolved to the fifteen second sound bite, as correctly noted, dominated by the giant filters of whatever media you attend to. We have readily swallowed the politically motivated "common core," or other manipulated curriculum to move the education of a citizen from individual to corporate responsibility. The biases we are being fed are becoming more subtle and pervasive.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hacker7
This all begins to look like the latest round of WWF where the good guys turn into bad guys turn into the good guys and all the crowd is doing is cheering for more blood (folding chairs, drop from the top rope...). It isn't even wrestling any longer. It's posing and posturing for the camera. I think Hacker7 is correct, it's about the egos being shown to the public. The only money to be made is in media stocks.
I think the republican establishment is far too obsessed with the idea of conservatism. I am not sure that is always the best platform for a presidential bid. This is in fact a very diverse country with a lot going on that needs to be represented. Bringing forth the rightest wing candidate will on average isolate the greater population from identifying with said candidate. In a general election you need to be able to pull support from more moderate people on both parties. I myself find that I don't identify with the extreme religious right and certainly not with the socialist nanny state left. I like my constitution the way it is and don't want it messed with I also would like public money well spent so I am in a sense very fiscal conservative also am tolerant of some social matters that I don't feel should be the focus of a political bid and more about freedom of choice of the individual. I would say I am mixed bag of ideals and concerns and I feel the real majority of this lovely country is as well. I rarely feel represented lately its always the same choice, do you want one extreme or the other I want neither.
I am disturbed by how accurate this analogy is.Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Blue
I just saw where Cape Breton Island up in Nova Scotia wants all those who defect if Trump wins!
They even have a web site about it!
:roflmao
Just had a thought! One could easily live with Rosie Odonnell and Whoopie Goldberg up there with a jillion undocumented folks from Mexico and South America. Refugees from all over the world, even! Utopia!
Yea, some crazy Canuck DJ created a spoof site for laughs and you thought we did not have a sense of humour. ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by sharptonn
'Cape Breton If Trump Wins' gets help from tourism agency - Nova Scotia - CBC News
Bob
Almost forgot, it is a great place for a visit and one of my favourite drives in Canada is the "Cape Breton Trail".
I don't really think Amal Clooney will like it up there, though.....Amal....Triumph carburetor?Quote:
Originally Posted by BobH
Well, winter in cape Breton ain't for everyone.
Bob
Thought Trump was pathetic during last nights debate. Seemed totally out of his depth speaking in general terms indicating only a general and limited understanding of world affairs and American law, and relying on stale demagogic statements such as: "And I'm gonna build a wall, and make Mexico pay for it" and low blow insults to get any kind of support or applause from the crowd. Was a bit disappointed that Rubio stooped to Trumps level but understand that often the best way to deal with a bully is to punch him in the nose. Still Rubio demonstrated a much deeper understanding of foreign and domestic affairs. I think Cruz dominated the debate and made Trump look like a chump - "Breathe Donald, breathe...".
Quite frankly, after last nights performance, I really don't see the appeal of Trump, nor do I understand how anyone on the conservative side could support him.
What our country is in sore need of is an accurate diagnosis of what is truly broken.
Easier said than done. Trump has the brashness to give a frank assessment of what isnt working, prioritize what needs to be fixed and present the facts.
Unemployment in our country is at 10% . OK 94Million not working.
Infrastructure, i.e. roads,bridges, damns. Nuclear power plants that have been limited in the amount of preventative maintenance needed.
Education or lack there of needs to be addressed promptly.
I live near Detroit, the entire region needs to be cleaned and fixed. Potholes to potheads we need a path and a leader.
What is working is that people of the region see the need to change. Its the how to that is complex.
You need a working population that has a value system that all will follow and uphold.
Obese, system scamming free hand outs and being the largest consumer on the planet.
Just makes for a disaster looking for a place to happen.
Watch what you wish for.
I would move across the bridge/tunnel to Canada if this country continues on its present path.
Revolution,bloodied,rape, and pillage are just a matchsticks strike away from burning the nation to the ground.
Ultimately its the people. Everyone is on edge. Fights and violence are common place here. Distrust is off the charts because of all the corruption prior and current to this post.
Yet step back and view our problems as opposed to the world picture. Where else are we going to go? Or how do we fix our house, It calls for all citizens to become actively engaged in the solution.
Well their ploy worked. Of course he came out looking bad the deck was stacked against him from the start of this farce. Not one of the host pressed Rubio or Cruz on any specifics yet they hammered Trump. I am not saying Trump is the greatest. But I am for what he represents. Rubio totes the party line. Cruz in between Trump and Rubio. We some how made it trough 8 years of obama. I think we should try something different.Quote:
Originally Posted by honedright
Obama succeeded with some things that are different. Different just for different's sake is not always a good thing and we need to be more discriminating about what is different. Traditions become such usually because tried and true is what works. Experience and history seem to agree with this. The French completely abandoned tradition and replaced it with ideology resulting in the French Revolution. The problem may be that America seems to have veered far from it's foundational roots. If I were to get lost in the woods, I would try to find my way back by locating the original, familiar path. I wouldn't attempt to re-navigate and hack my way through uncharted and unfamiliar forest.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hacker7
How about the 17th amendment? This completely "Breaks" one of the checks and balances built into the constitution for states rights. This is covered in Federalist #45 where Madison states, "The Senate will be elected absolutely and exclusively by the State legislatures."Quote:
Originally Posted by ultrasoundguy2003
The problem ain't Washington, it's the people who are plain stupid and have allowed a tiny minority with an agenda to essentially take over. Washington just reflects the country.
Ask folks if they like Obamacare and it's no way but tell them a system with all its hallmarks and they want it. They want Govt off their backs as long as they get to do what they want and force others to do what their brand wants, small govt oh yea until all the things they rely on stop happening. States rights? Right on until they realize the reason the Federal Govt got so big is doing what States should have done in the first place but didn't because of corruption and indifference at the state level.
People don't know what they want but as long as they refuse to think for themselves there are plenty who have no problem doing the thinking for them.
As far as Trump is concerned remember he is the one who led the birther movmt and demanded to see Obama's College Transcripts. I think anyone who seriously thinks the President somehow fooled his way into office is probably seriously lacking in grey matter in their brains.
That's only because Jefferson only trusted the American People to make the right decisions only so far. He was probably right. It's the reason for the Electoral College too.Quote:
Originally Posted by honedright
Agreed, because history teaches that the majority is fickle, and changes it's mind frequently. To assure any form of stability, representative government (Republic) is preferred to direct rule by the people (Democracy).Quote:
Originally Posted by thebigspendur
Edit: The "Mode of Electing the President" or "Electoral College," although it wasn't called that by the founders, is discussed and reasoned by Hamilton in Federalist #68. But even this process (Article 2, Section 1(3) of the constitution) was changed by the 12th amendment.
I don't think there's been a direct democracy anywhere in the world past Ancient Greece. The closest in well functioning modern states is probably Switzerland.Quote:
Originally Posted by honedright
The US Congress has about 90% job approval rating, as long as you measure it correctly by the voting of the people and not by their words.
Fundamentally the US is founded on the principle that the government is by the consent of the governed. When sufficient number of people want something it happens. Ultimately there is a negative feedback loop for bad choices, individual and collective - it's the more expensive way to learn a lesson, but one way or another the lesson will be eventually learned.