Thread: President of the US of A

Originally Posted by gugi

As far as I know science and biology arn't quite clear cut on sex/gender as it is on human/nonhuman, though the later is also not simple black and white either.

To start with the easier one - if I remember my high school biology correctly the definition of species is based on the ability of producing fertile offspring. By this definition recent research would suggest that neanderthals are humans because they had sex with humans and passed their genes. On the reverse is speciation - not clear cut either.

As far as the biology of sex/gender goes, when our knowledge and understanding was more limited it was a matter of external genitalia. And hermaphrodites were unexplained phenomena and in many cases treated as animals.
Now, that we know about genes, DNA, and chromosomes things are not simpler - you have people with extra chromosomes, or with genitals that don't correspond to their chromosome set. All this is to say that the neat male/female classification isn't as simple as people want or have wanted it to be.
And in this context you can add psychology - some people identify as the opposite sex. The simplest solution to this, of course, is to treat them as sick/crazy/perverted/etc. and that certainly is the traditional approach. But the society has changed and plenty of people do not find this approach satisfactory anymore.

But, as I said, this seems to me yet another issue that is being blown out of proportion for purely political purposes. If gay wedding cakes had proven more effective I think that would've been the big social controversy instead. And if Obama thought a fight over it were more damaging to the left than to the right he'd have left it to get resolved the same way as the gay wedding cakes.

We can, and should, accommodate people with differences, just as long as those accommodations don't interfere with people who are different in other ways.

Maybe the gay cake thing was blown out of proportion, with culpability on both sides. And if you identify with a gender different, from that of which you were born, fine. But don't force others to go along with it, especially if they don't want to.

Maybe if everyone individually were a little more tolerant, the political opportunists would have less divisive fodder to dump on us.

Folks already have problems accepting anyone who isn't like they are meaning the same religion or ethnicity or tribe or (you fill in the blanks) but this sex gender thing is simply too much. I mean it's like a guy landing a spaceship from Arcturas and he has 4 legs and 4 arms and two heads. It's just too much beyond the pale. If the law didn't protect him they would kill him in two seconds.

Originally Posted by thebigspendur

Folks already have problems accepting anyone who isn't like they are meaning the same religion or ethnicity or tribe or (you fill in the blanks) but this sex gender thing is simply too much. I mean it's like a guy landing a spaceship from Arcturas and he has 4 legs and 4 arms and two heads. It's just too much beyond the pale. If the law didn't protect him they would kill him in two seconds.

Just imagine how much that guy could eat. Fast food chains would love him! Come on down!

Offered as an observation and nothing more.

As a traveler I will immerse myself in the local culture and practices and on that note learn and blend in with the locals. I hate looking and acting like a tourist.

If you have traveled abroad you will encounter restrooms that have a woman attendant for men’s room and one restroom for both sexes. It was a little unsettling the first couple of times for me having women walk by me standing at partitioned urinal on her way to the toilet stall. I felt weird and out of sorts at first because nobody else batted an eye. I’ve learned to get over local cultural stuff. The last two holidays were in Paris and Amsterdam by the way.

I think the biggest problem here is they are moving too fast for the majority of people. This is a major cultural change for the US.

Originally Posted by jmercer

I think the biggest problem here is they are moving too fast for the majority of people. This is a major cultural change for the US.

Could be, but it is a presidential election year, so everything that is perceived as politically advantageous is blown up as big as it can go.

This started as an issue in a city, then the state quickly jumped on it and then it has escalated to a national topic.
The gay marriage went from may be 20% support to 80% over a decade or so. It probably is way too fast for the remaining 20% holdouts, but at this point they probably have to accept it and make piece with it.
I wasn't around in the civil rights era, but reading the history it seems rather dramatic too.

Simple solution to the bathroom issues.

Instead woman's and men's rooms it should say vagina to the right and penis to the left.

There are for more non transgenders in the world than transgenders. And many are to young to understand when they see a guy in the ladies room. It's simple democracy right. The larger groups win? LOL.

Originally Posted by Suticat

Simple solution to the bathroom issues.

Instead woman's and men's rooms it should say vagina to the right and penis to the left.

There are for more non transgenders in the world than transgenders. And many are to young to understand when they see a guy in the ladies room. It's simple democracy right. The larger groups win? LOL.

Have you read the Constitution?

The larger group does not win right to trample the rights of the smaller group or the individual.

Originally Posted by Suticat

It's simple democracy right. The larger groups win? LOL.

Not a simple democracy, but yeah if the majority is large enough it certainly can impose its will. And sometimes, for example as in the case of the prohibition things can go back and forth.

Separate Single Bathrooms

Problem solved

Heck that will probably solve the lines at all the Ladies rooms too if they can't go in gaggles


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