Thread: Motorcycles

Originally Posted by FiReSTaRT

I don't have problems with helmet laws in countries with public health care. To me, wearing a helmet and other protective gear is due diligence and I wouldn't want to be paying into health care where it's not enforced.

I'm a helmet-wearing libertarian and skeptic.

You presume not wearing a helmet increases the rider's health care costs to society. I'll bet it doesn't. First, helmet-less motorcyclists involved in serious crashes are very likely to die, which is likely cheaper---in terms of health care at least---than treating injuries to helmet-wearing riders. Of course, in some cases, the helmet-less rider would suffer more serious injuries than helmet-wearing rider, so it's not clear which effect would dominate. Second, any helmet-less riders who die while they're riding avoid the high health care costs related to old age and dieing of natural causes.

Is it clear whether not wearing a helmet increases or decreases a person's lifetime expected health care costs? No, but I think it's likely that it decreases the costs.

Originally Posted by cabo_sailor

Giving someone an unrestricted license after 3 days is what I call Darwin at Work.

We are constantly seeing new riders with what we call "crotch rockets" smearing themselves all over the landscape. A new rider with a bike doing 150 mph - well he or she won't have to worry about insurance.

That's probably generally true. I've known a few guys (and women) who've done the course and then, very responsibly IMO, gone out and bought a good second hand low powered bike to get the hang of first - but these people are usually older (over 30).

James.

I started on a crotch rocket right after the course, but responsibly (within reason ). Yeah, I do like to take it fast and go low in the twisties, but I don't do insane speeds in traffic or anything I can't handle. Here's a pic from this Sunday's Algonquin park ride

Originally Posted by Jimbo

Very nice restoration She's a beauty.


James.

uuummh - no she started off like that top photo and ended up like the bottom one all black, a lot faster and more powerful, after being stage 2 tuned, lightened and chopped, I put a new heavy duty 6 wire harness in that I built and a light weight gel battery, changed the down tubes of the forks to better quality stainless and dropped the front end by 2 inches for improved handling. upgraded the rear shocks and changed the saddle for comfort.

Originally Posted by FiReSTaRT

I don't have problems with helmet laws in countries with public health care. To me, wearing a helmet and other protective gear is due diligence and I wouldn't want to be paying into health care where it's not enforced.

i obviously do the casualty statistics have shown that the number of deaths and injuries in this country (England) have not gone down since the introduction of Mandatory helmet wearing.

we have the most rigid Motorcycle use Laws in Europe and the hardest Motorcycle test, but still the death toll is rising comparative to the number of bikers on the road;

I am more than well aware that a portion of the blame goes to car drivers and their "I'm sorry I didn't see you" excuse; But, when you see the reports that state the "motorcyclist was killed by the helmet causing a shearing effect at the base of the spine snapping the neck" or "the cause of death was damage to the vertebrae of the spine, due lateral whip lash compounded by the weight of the helmet the motorcyclist was wearing"

then that to me says helmets should be a option to wear item not obligatory - sorry in 7 years I saw to many of these reports that show the helmet contributed to the death of a rider.

and I'll get down of my ranting podium now

I don't know how things are going across the pond, but here in Toronto, they have been doing some rapid residential development without putting any thought into the infrastructure over the last decade. Before, the rush hour lasted from 4:30 to 6. Now it goes well into the 7-7:30 range. The end-result is more crowding on the roads and an increase in accidents/injuries/death for every vehicle category.
On the other end of the scale from you, I heard too many "the helmet saved my life" stories. We could both be victims of selective reading lol.

Originally Posted by FiReSTaRT

On the other end of the scale from you, I heard too many "the helmet saved my life" stories.

I've lived in both states that had helmet laws and those that don't. The arguments for/against are never exactly 100% believable since both sides present a selective set of data to support their position. I doubt anyone knows what the real story is.

I've witnesses some horrific crashes where the rider not only lived, but was essentially unhurt. I've also know of a number of people that were killed when their bike got off balance while they were stopped and toppled over, throwing them to the ground in such a manner that they were killed from a head injury. In both cases, some were wearing a helmet, some were not. I conclude that wearing a helmet often helps protect you and infrequently makes the situation worse... there certainly are no guarantees either way.

But, there are other reasons I wear a helmet. For example, I don't like getting hit in the face with a bumblebee when we collide at 80mph... or a rock kicked up by another vehicle's tire... or ashes when the guy in the car in front flicks his cigarette out the window. Also a helmet doesn't blow off like a hat does (my head needs sun protection, particularly on all day rides). When I ride in cold climates, a helmet is warmer than nothing (but admittedly, is hotter in a warm climate). A helmet is a convenient place for speakers and microphone for the CB/radio... that way what I'm listening to isn't polluting everyone else's space.

And so it goes... to each his own

Originally Posted by FiReSTaRT

I started on a crotch rocket right after the course, but responsibly (within reason ). Yeah, I do like to take it fast and go low in the twisties, but I don't do insane speeds in traffic or anything I can't handle. Here's a pic from this Sunday's Algonquin park ride

Umm, Ilija....You're on the wrong side of the road dude!

Originally Posted by Wayne D

uuummh - no she started off like that top photo and ended up like the bottom one all black, a lot faster and more powerful, after being stage 2 tuned, lightened and chopped, I put a new heavy duty 6 wire harness in that I built and a light weight gel battery, changed the down tubes of the forks to better quality stainless and dropped the front end by 2 inches for improved handling. upgraded the rear shocks and changed the saddle for comfort.

Sorry Wayne_D - Didn't look carefully enough. Saw what I wanted to see, actually. I've got a thing for retro bikes Nice mods.

Helmets aren't a major issue in Aus. as far as I can tell. Just part of the normal riding gear like boots and gloves etc... In all the states I've lived in it's even mandatory for pushbikers to wear "brain buckets".

James.

James

Don't worry Jimbo, there ain't no cruises in Ontario that can catch me

Originally Posted by FiReSTaRT

Sweet ride..
Chief, how are the twisties in Belgium?

thanx FireStart!
In the south of Belgium we have the Ardennes...it's Walhalla! (except for the weather...)