Thread: MBA vs MS help?

I will be starting to move into more of a project management role and spending less time in the field (30% - 50% vs 90%) and I will be wrapping up my BS degree in the spring. I want to start on either an MBA or MS in project management ASAP as my current employer will reimburse at 100%. I have no chance at attending a top tier, or even a second tier MBA program because I travel so often that I have to take my classes online. There are some good MBA programs online, but not one that will make a future employer raise their eyebrows due to the name of the school. The MSPM on the other hand is a masters degree in a non-technical field witch may be pointless, however I am positive that I like managing things much more than managing people, so while I could see myself in a high level operations role, I do not plan on taking on a personnel management position, unless it was for a personally owned business.

The reasons I would choose an MSPM over an MBA is it will help get me ready for the PMP certification if I want to go for it, and I absolutely suck at learning math online. From what I read an MBA is rather math a bit more math intensive than an MSPM. Also there arent many schools that offer an MSPM so it is not subject to the same rankings that an MBA would be subject too. Of course on the other hand an MBA may be give me access to a wider option of future opportunities, regardless of what institution its from.


Any thoughts opinions, I know many of you have graduate level positions and education and thought you may have some advice.

Josh,

I didn't think MBA was math-intensive at all. There is some in accounting and finance. However, you can take only intro courses in accounting and finance, and math there shouldn't be very challenging. Some programs focus more on math, of course, but still. You can probably just choose a program and ask them for examples of math workload - then you can decide for yourself.

Didn't Harvard have an online MBA? - I thought so...

I am not rooting for MBA (even though I have one) - just trying to help you understand better the options / situation

Best of luck
Ivo

Originally Posted by izlat

Josh,

I didn't think MBA was math-intensive at all. There is some in accounting and finance. However, you can take only intro courses in accounting and finance, and math there shouldn't be very challenging. Some programs focus more on math, of course, but still. You can probably just choose a program and ask them for examples of math workload - then you can decide for yourself.

Didn't Harvard have an online MBA? - I thought so...

I am not rooting for MBA (even though I have one) - just trying to help you understand better the options / situation

Best of luck
Ivo

Havard has a partial online MBA, but there are a number of courses that I would have to take on campus and its just not possible with my job, I looked pretty carefully at the top 10 schools and none would work The best I would be able to go to is a top 50 or top 75 school for an MBA.

Top 50 is not too shabby?

The rankings are important, but depending on why you're getting any degree - actual learning and personal drive may get you quite far. As well as connections and stuff

I was just reading that CEOs at Fortune 500s from Harvard and Wisconsin are about equal number. Not sure of the number and precision of the quote, but you get the idea...

Cheers
Ivo

Originally Posted by izlat

Top 50 is not too shabby?

The rankings are important, but depending on why you're getting any degree - actual learning and personal drive may get you quite far. As well as connections and stuff

I was just reading that CEOs at Fortune 500s from Harvard and Wisconsin are about equal number. Not sure of the number and precision of the quote, but you get the idea...

Cheers
Ivo

I actually already have the connections, I currently work for a fortune 100 company and worked my way up from the bottom...doing lots of favors along the way and making many friends in the process who have since been promoted. I also travel so much that I have friends all over, I also get plenty of head hunters calling me, so on the connection front, I think I am ok. I guess it comes down to the fact that the ranking of an MBA has been so drilled into my head and I know I would rather learn what is being taught on the MS, that the MBA has to be well respected once I get out or else I dont know if its worth it. I highly doubt that an MBA will teach me things I couldnt learn by doing if I was in the position to run a business or division, same thing is probably even more true of a MSPM.

The difference is the MSPM may be useless outside of operations managing processes, especially a non technical masters degree (might as well be an MBA right?) on the flip side I dont want the fact that I was traveling to count against me with an MBA if I go through all that work mostly for the piece of paper, I want to make sure it gets recognized and is appreciated.

As Ivo said, top 50 (or any accredited MBA program for that matter) isn't too bad when you have it backed up with proper connections and work experience. That's what I'd go for if I were you.

I think the MBA would be more marketable, across different fields. Also, look carefully at the PMP...a lot of companies want you to have one, as if it is a guarantee against failure. I am a member of the PMI, but have not gotten a PMP...mainly because of the 30+ people I have worked with who have one, all but 4-5 are completely useless and got the certification by cramming for the exam or taking prep seminars. Some of them...I am amazed they can find their way home at night...seriously!


I've also been cautious about companies that are "degree happy"...degrees are nice, but experience trumps a piece of paper with nothing backing it up. That is why it is so frustrating trying to hire new people...everyone thinks they should start in the corner office....

Originally Posted by WireBeard

I think the MBA would be more marketable, across different fields. Also, look carefully at the PMP...a lot of companies want you to have one, as if it is a guarantee against failure. I am a member of the PMI, but have not gotten a PMP...mainly because of the 30+ people I have worked with who have one, all but 4-5 are completely useless and got the certification by cramming for the exam or taking prep seminars. Some of them...I am amazed they can find their way home at night...seriously!


I've also been cautious about companies that are "degree happy"...degrees are nice, but experience trumps a piece of paper with nothing backing it up. That is why it is so frustrating trying to hire new people...everyone thinks they should start in the corner office....

My company seems to care less about degrees for many of their employees, and they will pay quite well if you can do the work, but upper management is definitely a glass ceiling if you dont have a graduate degree. I mostly just want one because they will pay for it, and if I dont do it now...I will lose all my momentum. As far as the PMP, they work with GWU/ESI for PMP classes so I can do that separately if I want, but I think I have to actually hold the title of PM to take those, and I will probably be a PE for a while first, long enough to complete a MBA or Masters first.

I took a distance learning/online MBA in 1999 which I completed in 2002 (and that was fast-tracked). Original reasons for embarking on the degree:

- greater marketability on CV
- to get the next step up
- to get it "out of the way" before more important family committments started (my firstborn came 2 weeks after I finished my final exam -- yep, I planned 3 years ahead)
- to increase salary

It did all those things, and within 12 months of receiving my qualification I was fortunate enough not only to be offered a role on the executive board, but one in Marketing having spent 12 years in the production/operations environment. I never expected that. The combination of experience in operations as well as a more commercial arena is very useful to me now.

Regarding your questions Josh, I can only answer with respect to the MBA experience. What I found was:

- the math can be challenging, but certainly not overly difficult. You can easily get by since most examination questions in finance modules (for example) are accompanied by equations so all you need to do is know where to plug in the values. It's methodical, and process-driven that's all. And if your strengths are in process management then it should be a doozy!

- although a top tier business school will undoubtedly maximise your return on investment, it ain't the be all and end all. For similar reasons as yourself I chose to do distance learning. Although the school I attended is well-respected, it's certainly no Harvard or LSE. But that's OK as long as your choice of course matches your expectations or planning. I.e. I am not looking to become a CEO of a FTSE 100 publicly listed company. Such a role and all its commitments do not fit with my own life priorities. I wanted a promotion into senior management, more salary, and more currency on my CV. You don't need top tier to achieve that.

- the fact that I spent three years, my own funds, in my own time pursuing the degree is enough to raise any employer's eyebrows. The committment and drive one demonstrates by taking such a route does not go unappreciated, top tier or not! Many prospective employers have been more interested in hearing how I managed those years and the challenges I faced rather than the same old dry questions about past work experience. At that level, employers are looking for more rounded, balanced competencies...

- which is exactly what a decent MBA programme wil deliver. I found that it was a life-changing journey. Not only did I receive more knowledge in management, but it had a profound effect on my home and social life. It gave me a much more mature and balanced approach to life in general.

- An MBA isn't just about people management. It tries to teach and prepare you for all eventualities, be it process, people or financial. But mostly, it gives you a helicopter view and holistic understanding of organisations and how they work, i.e. a much wider perspective than other speciality qualifications.

And you're exactly right, it doesn't teach you anything you couldn't pick up with experience in a Fortune 100 company. But what it does give you is the tools with which to accelerate that acquisition of knowledge and therefore accelerate your career. An MBA tends to have a shelf-life of only 5 years before you need to start topping it up. But within 5 years you will have already transformed your career (if you're motivated enough).

My advice to you would be to focus on exactly what it is you wish to achieve in your career, which should give you some idea as to which path to take. Rather than compare the two qualifications on the basis of what they could offer you, examine them on whether they give you what you need to achieve your long-term goal (take a minimum 10-year view).

And do not rule out either qualification. There is no reason why you shouldn't do both in your lifetime if their combination will get you where you want to be! It should neve be a case of either/or, but one of "what do I need to get me there?".

I hope this wil be of some help, and good luck with whatever you decide to do. Whatever your decision, as long as you put in enough thought, you won't be in a position to regret it!

Mark thanks for the great reply! I found it very helpful, much appreciated.