Thread: Chef knife recommendations

This is the best knife EVER for the money:

http://www.cutleryandmore.com/details.asp?SKU=6868

I was ready to buy a Tojiro Gyuto from that Japanese knife site, but they appear to be gone from that site. Anybody know where I can find them again or a comparable knife for price and quality?

X

Originally Posted by xman

I was ready to buy a Tojiro Gyuto from that Japanese knife site, but they appear to be gone from that site. Anybody know where I can find them again or a comparable knife for price and quality?

X

What size? Korin has pretty much all their knives and anything else you could want with Japanese knives.

Speaking from NO experience whatsoever, just a little exposure to steel theory...

Do you know what stainless steels you're referring to? Unless you're talking about high-end stainless steels, my impression is that good high carbon steels take and hold an edge better than stainless. Carbon steels get harder than all but the best stainless alloys.

The main advantage of stainless steels is their resistence to corrosion.

I must be missing something here; I'd love to hear more from someone with extensive cutlery experience.

Josh

Originally Posted by ps49556n

Get yourself a Victorinox Fibrox chef's knife in a size you are comfortable with, they come in 8, 10, and 12 inch models, and a Victorinox Paring knife (black plastic handle). The chef's knife will cost you anywhere from $20-40 depending on the size and the paring knife should be around $5. These blades come incredibly sharp from the factory and can literally be used for a month or two (used properly) without even putting the blade to a steel. I worked in four star kitchens in manhattan under the best chefs in America and you will not find one carbon blade in these kitchen with the exception the finest, traditional sushi chefs....they all use the victorinox.

Now hear me out first....I think carbon steel kitchen knives have their place....if you are using the knife at home, carbon steel will work, but avoid carbon steel if this is for professional use. In a professional kitchen you will dull a carbon steel blade before the day is over and if you are not careful you could potentially ruin it beyond repair.

With that said, you can certainly use carbon steel blades at home but the extra maintenance IMO is not worth the benefits which are pretty much nonexistent when you are using a stainless steel blade like the Victorinox. A knife like a victorinox when properly used should be able to go 3-6 months in a home kitchen MINIMUM before needing sharpening. I say properly used because 99% of home cooks out there develop bad habits that will dull even a stainless blade very quickly.

I use a 6000/1000 japanese water stone to sharpen kitchen knives...while the victorinox is stainless, it is not very difficult to sharpen compared with a traditional one-sided japanese carbon blade.

It really comes down to personal preference....some like to use fancy knives daily, other like myself prefer the practicality and utility of a stainless blade. Be warned, not all stainless blades are equal. Expense german brands like Henckels are high quality but I find them to be INCREDIBLY uncomfortable to use for long periods and just do not like their feel/balance coupled with the fact that they are overpriced.

Originally Posted by adickerson0

Do you know of a good Carbon blade chef knife for under $100?

Depending on what side of the world you prefer your knives from there are a few. Sabatier Nogent is a good one for western styled knives and for japanese steels there is the discontinued Hiromoto HC line, as well as Fujiwara's high carbon line. Both can be found for well under $100.

I have not messed with the sabatier nogent line but have heard good things about them. Hiromoto, Fujiwara, Masamoto, Suisin, Masahiro, and a few others I have had and think highly of them.

Well after reading all of your posts and a pm, I have decided to try the caphalon 7 inch chefs kfife to start with. Josh, I may be interested in a knife from you as well, I would be interested in a 5 inch chefs knife or a cleaver of some kind. I am looking at a few others that were mentioned in this thread as well. So far I am finding that I can probably have a couple good knives for less than 100 dollars which is nice.

Depending on what side of the world you prefer your knives from there are a few. Sabatier Nogent is a good one for western styled knives and for japanese steels there is the discontinued Hiromoto HC line, as well as Fujiwara's high carbon line. Both can be found for well under $100.

I have not messed with the sabatier nogent line but have heard good things about them. Hiromoto, Fujiwara, Masamoto, Suisin, Masahiro, and a few others I have had and think highly of them.

I am very interested in these knives but what does it take to keep one sharp? Would I need to buy the three hones on the hiromoto web site? What kind of method do you use to sharpen one of these?

Originally Posted by matt

I am very interested in these knives but what does it take to keep one sharp? Would I need to buy the three hones on the hiromoto web site? What kind of method do you use to sharpen one of these?

Well that depends on what kind of steel you are going after. Western knives being softer than japanese knives only need to go up to say one or two K on the stones. Where Japanese steels kind of start there...

If you plan on fixing your own chips and such I'd get something in the 220 range, than move up to a 1k, 4k, and 8k. Shapton GS stones make that an affordable line of stones. Do you need them all for your knives? No but they help ALLOT. For years I made due with a 1200 king and a 4/8k Norton. Chips took along time to work out but I rarely used the 1200 king otherwise.

Let your cooking style and needs dictate the edge you want to keep. I changed all my "work" bevels to suit the harsh line environment, while my home knives get the wicked scarry sharp treatment. You can get just as crazy with "rocks" for kitchen knives as with hones for straights, and why not... they are the exact same stones...

Alright DC, I asked this in another thread, but perhaps you can help me here.

Why would I want a High Carbon chef's knife vs. a Molybdenum vs. a Stainless Steel one?

I know why I like Carbon shavers. They hone easily and feel good on my face.

I've been using an 8" SS Kiwi kitchen knife for decades and it serves me pretty well. I do find I need a few laps on my cheep kitchen hone (a stropping rod might do just as well?) to get it to cut tomatoes effortlessly, but I don't take great care of it. it just sits in the drawer with my other knives.

What should I be looking for to serve my needs best?

X

Originally Posted by xman

Alright DC, I asked this in another thread, but perhaps you can help me here.

Why would I want a High Carbon chef's knife vs. a Molybdenum vs. a Stainless Steel one?

I know why I like Carbon shavers. They hone easily and feel good on my face.

I've been using an 8" SS Kiwi kitchen knife for decades and it serves me pretty well. I do find I need a few laps on my cheep kitchen hone (a stropping rod might do just as well?) to get it to cut tomatoes effortlessly, but I don't take great care of it. it just sits in the drawer with my other knives.

What should I be looking for to serve my needs best?

X

Ok first off stop scaring me with the knives in the drawer thing /shudder..

For the same reasons you like carbon shavers may well translate to cutting food. But that is HIGHLY subjective to you idea of sharp. The same things you do to razors basically is the same that should be done to kitchen knives... ok if your into hard steel knives that is... so let me back up a bit (long day of doing tax's, brain fragmented a bit...)

Lets assume your current knife is made under the western ideals of cutlery. Hardnes of steel being between 52 and 57 or so is norm for these knives. While in it's self not bad, it is a world of difference than say a japanese knife at 62 to 65. Ok back to softer steel, it is much more user friendly to the avg person that tossed the knife in a drawer, dinging the edge on everthing there. Getting the knife out and sliding it over a grooved steel to push the edge back straight. Now one that differing here between carbon and and stainless is the amount of ding and how easy the edge is returned. Stainless has larger carbides in the steel (most of the time) and will break off while using a steel, carbon looses less to a steel, in general. It's a trade off for getting chromium in the mix to help stain resistance. Moly blades are steel mix's with different ideas for stain resistance and I really havent played with heavy use of moly in blades. AS steel has a touch of moly I think, I'd have to look it up again...

In basic terms Stainless will stay shiney if cared for, carbon knives react with foods and color the blade (a good thing). Stainless blades will not react easaly with foods (not to say they don't react). Stainless hold a lesser degree of sharpness longer than carbon, while carbon will get sharper but can loose it a touch sooner. Stainless takes alot more work to get really sharp, carbon gets wicked sharp easy.

When you jump up to high grade stainless and carbon with super heat treatments you really get crazy with all the above. Your edges don't roll or bend any longer, they chip due to the high hardness. So you MUST treat them with care vs a western knife. With this higher sharpness you can lighten the blade by as much as half or more. Cutting a ripe tomato can be as easy touching it with you edge. I can cut slices of potato so thin that you can put tow slices together and still read through them, With just the weight of the knife. Thats a Murray Carter Nakiri in white #1 steel, wicked sharp. While you can get close to that with a stainless blade you will sacrifice thiness and thus geomitry, the ability to slice with ease.

Yup so many insane variables. Personally I find stainless knives anoying to sharpen and in general treated very poorly. The sanitation level these knives tend to be kept in would scare anyone who really looks at that kind of stuff. Carbon steel forces you to take care of the blade, or it will rust. So you must decide if you want to pick up your knife skills a notch or not. Carbon knives have many good qualities, not to say stainless don't I just don't like them. If you want to see if you can take the leap, see if you can get a perry or a petty made of carbon steel and do what you can to keep it in good order. If you can keep it going for a while you will know if you can start spending real $$ on quality steel.

Let me know if I jumped around to much, Like I said my brain is kind of cooked tonght