This was asked in the "Palins choice for VP" thread by IVBarber! I want to know the answer!!Quote:
Obama has been a senator for about 6 mo. What does he have as far as experience goes?
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This was asked in the "Palins choice for VP" thread by IVBarber! I want to know the answer!!Quote:
Obama has been a senator for about 6 mo. What does he have as far as experience goes?
Quote:
Originally Posted by JMS
Obama has been a Senator for a lot longer than 6 months.
What the heck is a 'community organizer'? Sounds like an agitator to me. I mean, his mentor in early life was Frank Marshall Davis, a known communist and anti-white racist activist, who was on the FBI's Security Index. Now, does that make Obama a communist or a racist? No, but it does bring troubling thoughts about his true motivation. I mean, he studied at the knees of Davis (referred to as "Frank" in his book "Dreams From My Father", where he says he went often to Frank for advice and counsel), Wiliam Ayers (a domestic terrorist), Jeremiah Wright (a racist, bigot preacher), he bought his house at below-market value from a convicted felon slumlord (Tony Rezko). Thing is, his associations frighten me. He seems to be the Manchurian Candidate.
He's actually only spent 143 days of actual work as a senator (count it up; that's less than 6 months). The rest of the time, he's been campaigning.Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottS
He's shown up for most of the votes, Joe.Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Chandler
going to be IBTL!!!
Barely.Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottS
Here's a full list of the vote's he's missed since he's been busy trying to convince people he's qualified to run for the highest office in the USAQuote:
Barack Obama has missed 290 votes (45.5%) during the current Congress.
Missed Votes by Barack Obama | Congress votes database | washingtonpost.com
Obama voted present more than 130 times in the Illinois state senate. I wouldn't trust him to bake a cake because that would require far too many decisions for him.
And how's this for hope and change:
Quote:
Barack Obama has voted with a majority of his Democratic colleagues 96.0% of the time during the current Congress. This percentage does not include votes in which Obama did not vote.
Obama chairs two subcommittees neither of which he has actually led.
Even Hillary noticedQuote:
Dec. 29, 2007 |
Doubts about Barack Obama's presidential credentials have crystallized during the past two weeks over his stewardship of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee's Subcommittee on European Affairs, which has convened no policy hearings since he took over as its chairman last January. That startling fact, first uncovered by Steve Clemons, who blogs on the Washington Note, prompted acid comment in Europe about the Illinois senator's failure to visit the continent since assuming the committee post, and even speculation that he had never traveled there except for a short stopover in London.
No wonder he's so admired. He reminds me of the kid that wants to be everyone's friend. He speaks well but won't commit to anything of importance (unless he did it by mistake which he undoubtedly later will make excuses and apologies for)Quote:
Obama responded: “Well, first of all, I became chairman of this committee at the beginning of this campaign, at the beginning of 2007. So it is true that we haven’t had oversight hearings on Afghanistan.”
:confused: huh?:confused: What ia IBTL?Quote:
Originally Posted by sicboater
:OT
In Before The Lock.
You took the word right out of my mouth to quote MeatLoaf. Nada experiance, but a hell of a campaigner, don't forget he told us" He's THE ONE." :wQuote:
Originally Posted by Joe Chandler
+1.Quote:
Originally Posted by sicboater
good call.
I guess his success to date as a candidate then must be because of how angry people are at the GOP.
You're absolutely right. Anger at the GOP is the reason he's doing so well. But look at this, too...as angry as people are at the GOP, he should be slam-dunking McCain, but he isn't. That gives me hope that people are smart enough to not punish everyone for their anger at Bush. Cutting off the nose to spite the face, as it were. I think people realize Obama's policies are bad for everyone.Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottS
This isn't going to be specific to any particular candidate because I haven't followed either campaigns closely enough to discern a "favorite".
But as for experience in general, one of the defining characteristics of human intelligence is our ability to gain actual experience through the actions of others. We can assess the actions of those around us and determine essentially the same conclusions as the persons in question who are gaining the knowledge first hand.
So to spend so much time on a subject that is largely inconsequential is almost a waste of time. Not to mention that any candidate is going to have an entire entourage of specialists that can get them heading in the right direction, should they wade into uncharted waters.
We should really be judging all of our candidates on the ability to learn and be adaptable to incoming scenarios.
I think it's because he is so charming in his preac- er, I mean speaking style that some people have said they feel a "thrill going up my leg"Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottS
Doesn't the Democratic Congress have a lower approval rating than even the Republican President?
True, and if you'll notice, things (economy-wise) such as the price of gas, housing market, etc., didn't get bad until the Dems took over Congress in '06. Not saying they're related, but you can't help but wonder...Quote:
Originally Posted by hoglahoo
The last gallup poll results I saw where from july (re: congress's job approval rating) and they where kind of funny. The break out showed that the republicans and independants approved of congress more than the democrats polled.
The over all approval rating was a dismal %14
Among Republicans for that time period, the approval rating was %19
Among independants: %14
Among Democrats: %11
The approval rating tends to go low too it seems when gas and food prices rise...
interesting stuff and curious to boot!
a linky link:
Congressional Approval Hits Record-Low 14%
Yes, Congressional approval just sucks. Oddly enough, the electorate is responding by putting more Dems in both Houses, and plenty of them.
What exactly has the experience level of any US president been at running a country, prior to being elected?
I think the more pertinent question is how much experience do the respective presidential advisers have?
James.
Many (most?) Presidents were previosuly governors, top-level generals, or vice presidents. Each of those positions involves making top-level decisions alongside with the President and / or being the most responsible leader of large groups of people over a wide area in so many ways that far exceed that of a less-than-one-term US Senator
Rats, I meant to hit control T and I accidentally hit control R and lost the rest of my rant. It's probably for the best anyway. Actually, I'll see if I can reproduce some of it here (taken from Obama's interview with Bill O'Reilly last week):
Oh yeah, I thought it also worthwhile to mention that advisors don't actually make the decision they are advising someone else to make. That's a huge difference. Generals, Governors, large business owners, even Vice Presidents make important responsibility-heavy decisions. Obama's toughest decisions have apparently been whether or not to vote party line or to just miss the vote, or at least that's what I got out of his saddleback forum answer to what was your toughest decision you've ever made. Considering he was only available to cast the votes he was elected to cast for about 6 months until he started spending his time and energies to run for the Presidency, I don't quite understand how anyone could seriously argue that he is more experienced than any two term Senator or even House member to run for President.Quote:
OBAMA: ....There is no doubt that the violence is down and that is a testament to the troops that were sent and General Patraeus and Ambassador Crocker. I think that the surge has succeeded in ways that nobody anticipated, by the way, including President Bush and the other supporters....[McCain. Barack doesn't have enough experience to admit that McCain was right and Barack was wrong.]
O'REILLY: But if it had been up to you there would not have been a surge. You and Joe Biden, no surge.
OBAMA: Hold on, if you look at the the debate that was taking place. We had gone through five years of mismanagement of this war, which I thougth was disastrous, and the president wanted to double down and continue and open-ended policy that did not create the kind of pressure on the Iraqis to take responsibility and reconcile.
O'REILLY: But it worked, come on.
OBAMA: Bill, look - I already said it succeeded beyond our wildest dreams.
O'REILLY: Why can you not say, 'I was right in the beginning, but I was wrong on the surge?'
OBAMA (hoglahoo's version): Because I don't have any experience, Bill. I've never led anything, I haven't even completed my freshman term in the Senate yet. Not even one term, Bill, but I am confident I can sweet-talk enough voters to get me into the White House. My strongest associations have not been with past Presidents, Secretaries of State, or even foreign relations officials. I formed my political ideas at the feet of a domestic terrorist named Bill Ayers, nurtured them in the church of Jeremiah Wright, and- oh hey wait a minute... this isn't being recorded is it? Damn.
Okay okay let me backtrack for a moment. You're just trying to make people afraid of me because I'm black and I have a funny name.. yeah.. silly season that's it. Elect me, I know what I'm doing (insert deer in the headlights look here)
Obama answered roll call votes 99% of the time in 2006 and 66% of the time in 2007 as his campaign got under way. This session, he has voted in 70 out of 169 roll call votes, and it is conceded that he has made every effort to be present for key votes.
By way of comparison, in that same time period, John McCain was present in 2006 for roll call 91% of the time; in 2007, as his campaign got under way, it dropped to 44% of the time. This session, he has answered roll call 36 out of 169 times.
Spin that.
j
Oh, and by the way, "The One" was first mentioned in a McCain attack ad. Obama never said it.
Link please:DQuote:
Originally Posted by Nord Jim
http://www.anwealde.com/photos/spin.GIFQuote:
Spin that.
I saw that too, of course. The difference is that although both of them have shirked their duties to run for President, Obama has spent very little time in the Senate at all, not even finishing his first and only term yet.
McCain has 10 times more experience actually voting in the Senate. That was what I highlighted and outlined above. If I can remember that the topic is "Obamas experience?" then it becomes a stark contrast between McCain's and Obama's.
And if I can remember that Scott said "He's shown up for most of the votes, Joe." then I can see why someone (me) would want to actually report what the percentage is, since "most" is 50%+ and Obama barely exceeds that. McCain has not been present for most of the votes since 2007, but he can draw on past experience because he has a past (however inglorious!) in the Senate
Gee, you didn't ask for links on any of the other statements. Please promise me that you care about the truth even when you agree with something.Quote:
Originally Posted by JMS
Here's your link: Candidates' Senate votes fall by wayside on campaign trail - USATODAY.com
j
Look, you can be an Obama Hater if you want. It's a free country. But please be fair with the facts. There has been a particular wealth of misinformation about Obama on these threads this week, and it seems that some people just swallow it whole.Quote:
Originally Posted by hoglahoo
j
Thanks!Quote:
Originally Posted by Nord Jim
I didn't need to ask for links as the comments I was interested in already had links!
I particularly enjoyed that medicare vote that nary a Senator missed. Even Ted Kennedy managed to pull himself out of the recovery room to vote. It was quite the picture. To bad McCain missed it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nord Jim
In fairness, I think that the traveling back and forth is too much for him.
McCain's been at it 26 years. Obama less than 2. He really should be trying harder. They're not equals. And what stands has Obama taken? What bills has he authored? What committees has he chaired? For that matter, what communities did he "organize"? Are they better? Worse? What did he actually do? Look, I think both candidates are full of crap...they always are. But McCain is a more palatable crapfest than the Manchurian Candidate. And perhaps you're right...maybe Obama didn't refer to himself as "The One"...I don't know. He did, however, refer to himself as a Muslim...it took Stephanopoulos to correct him and put him back on track. Much like Howard the Rtard Dean's "YEEAAAARRGH!!!", this should wreck his candidacy if people are paying attention.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nord Jim
I'm always amazed at how the same people who discount Joe Biden as a "Washington Insider" also claim that McCain is superior because he's -- wait for it -- a Washington Insider.
It's also easy to discount Obama's experience when you either don't know what it is or don't know what it's about.
Here's a fact: McCain: bottom 1% of his graduating class at Navy (which he got into because of connections)
Obama: Magnum Cum Laude at Harvard Law.
j
McCain still has more senate experience. All washington insiders have more senate experience than Obama. Maybe that's why Obama chose one to run as VP with him - I can only speculate.
This stuff's all on the record. Look it up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Chandler
And as far as referring to himself as a Muslim? Please! It was a misstatement. Shall we "wreck" McCan't candidacy for misstatements? The guy has a public brain fart every other day.
j
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nord Jim
I'm not arguing Obama's not smart. It's obvious he is. I don't like his policies; I have no problem with him personally. I have a lot of respect for his oratory, but if he's not experienced, he's not experienced. I don't necessarily find a lack of experience that much of a detriment if a person can learn, but he's touting his experience as a community organizer and senator, and no one (not even him) seems to know, or can define what that is. Given his long-term radical connections (and if you want to deny those, I simply can't help you, as you're willfully blind) with bigots, communists, felons, slumlords, and racists I guess I tend to believe the worst. Community organizer sounds synonymous with communist agitator given those associations. And his time as a senator has been a joke, with lots of "present" or missed votes, no controversial stands of priniciple, no significant legislation or committees chaired...All I'm saying is I don't know enough about him that's provably true. So much of it seems to be smoke and mirrors. Anyhow, given the system we're in, we're all screwed, it's just a matter of degree. I call for bloody revolution to get us back to Constitutional principles, but that's not a popular opinion.
And if McCain had said it, the press would be all over it like stink on ****. I don't know you...you might be a wonderful guy, despite our differing political opinions, but if you can't see the sickening awful bias in the press, you're profoundly, intentionally myopic.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nord Jim
Examples, please. And be aware that for every example you cite, I'll come up with three from Faux News.Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe Chandler
Did you hear the one about the 12,000 miniature flags at the DNC? They were packed up and ready to be shipped to the next event, and some Republican ripped them off and sent them to McCain -- who claimed that Obama had thrown them away. It was all reported, of course, by Fox News's Carl Cameron, who, if you remember, famously had to apologize for making up phony quotes from John Kerry.
If Dan Rather had done that, they'd have crucified him. But Faux? No big. The guy's still there, still doing the same lies and dirty tricks.
j
the removal of Keith Olbermann would go a long way toward balancing the scales I think
You'd have to give me O'Reilly, and then probably throw in Limbaugh and Andy Coulter.Quote:
Originally Posted by hoglahoo
I'm off. You'll have to save the nation by yourselves.
j
Community Organizer Definition:
A manure salesman with a mouth load of samples.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nord Jim
Now we're arguing the Theory of Relative Filth when we argue which network is worse. Yes, Fox is biased to the right. As ABC, CBS, NBC, NPR, MSNBC, CNN, The New York Times, LA Times, and even the National Enquirer are biased to the left. There is very little true journalism left anymore, which makes it tough to get good info. I'll vote McCain/Palin because, in principle, I agree with the Republican platform, not because I believe any of these peckerwoods will actually do what they say. But I could say the same thing if I were going for Obama. At least McCain says he's not going to raise taxes or try and take my guns (which I cling to, because my life is so friggin bad here in the good ol' U.S.of A) But you're absolutely right about one thing: If a journalist is caught making up stories, they should be terminated, post-haste (and I'm not talking about getting fired...I'm talking about literally terminated).
I'll happily trade you Limbaugh, Coulter, and O'Reilly for Olbermann. Spot me MoveOn.org and it's a deal
Should be a stickyQuote:
Originally Posted by d. m. ellington