Thread: For An Intelligent Conversation On Spirituality/Religion

Originally Posted by DerekC

+1 on this. Other Christians might argue with me, but in order to properly defend any position, you must accept that you might be wrong. I firmly believe that the Bible is truth, but other religions also believe that their text is the inerrant truth, as well.

Yes, however there is very little , if any, history, archeology, to back up any other except the words of the writer. History, archeology, science have not disproven anything in the Bible that I know of, only proven parts of it.

Originally Posted by McWolf1969

Its my opinion that any religion, for the individual, is a powerful thing...but in the hands of the masses leads to all sorts of horrible senarios.
I like those parts of the Bible that focus on 'self.' Just my thing.

It's either all true or not worth the paper it's written on.

Guys, I'm not argueing with anyone just defending my beliefs

Originally Posted by gugi

I'm glad that it works for you, but I also recognize that you are a minority.

what do you mean? how is it that he is a minority? Is he black, hispanic, Japanese?

I think having faith is a powerful thing. I think I tend to see things in terms of natural cycles, and it gives me great comfort. I do believe there is a great power on this earth; nature.

I am not an atheist, I think being a atheist is as ignorant as being a fanatic about your religion. I couldn't count the number of times I've heard or read about priests and preachers in general talk about how they sometimes question their faith, and I think that is a very important capacity to have. I am, therefore, agnostic. I do not deny the possibility.

I also believe that like any great institution, organised religion can do a lot of good in the world but can also do a lot of damage. I think too many people have been killed in the name of Religion.

Originally Posted by gregs656

I am not an atheist, I think being a atheist is as ignorant as being a fanatic about your religion.

I don't understand your logic. How does one's conscious decision to deny the existence of a supreme being make them any less knowledgeable about anything?

Originally Posted by paco

If we're speaking logic would it not be better for me to die believing there is a God and be wrong and lose nothing, than to not believe be wrong , die , and lose everything ?

you refer, of course, to Pascal's Wager:
Pascal's Wager - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It is logical only if you assume that believing there is a deity costs you nothing. If believing in a deity costs you something, those costs must be balanced against the odds of an afterlife.

I am firmly in the camp that believing in a deity costs you a LOT. in many ways, too. financially, emotionally, etc. and let's not forget to factor in "lost opportunity" costs, to use an economic term.

I went through a period about 25 years ago where I was fervently religious and trying to save the world. I remember in proselytizing to a girl her saying."that may be true for you but it is not true for me." Of course my reply was that it is either true for everybody or it is not true for anybody. In the years that have passed I have come to the conclusion that the bible is not a reliable document. Historical yes but problems with authorship, variance in the different versions of the gospels and other factors have convinced me that I can't be sure.

Originally Posted by paco

Hence a true Christian will say that an unbeliever in Jesus Christ will go to Hell

No, what you believe a true christian to be will say that.

My definition of a true Christian is someone who tries to follow Christ. No matter what he believes that Christ taught.

That's where the word Christian comes from. From trying to be like christ. Don't turn it into "if you don't believe EVERY word of the bilble you're not a christian."

Believing the bible might make you a biblican.....not a christian.

Originally Posted by LX_Emergency

Believing the bible might make you a biblican.....not a christian.

Well said. The Bible is actually not the only source of information about the life and teachings of Jesus. There are several books that were not included in the bible that were written around the same time as the Gospels, but seemed to contradict much of what early christians believed, so they were omitted.

I find it surprising how frequently and with what ferver various sects of "christians" denounce one another for not following the "true" teachings of Jesus. It seems minor differences (from the point of view of a non-christian, at least) create horrible schisms and even wars.

I don't want to paint all christians with the same broad brush. There are many (most in fact) who are neither hostile nor disrespectful of others' beliefs.